EJ20 SOHC with and without cam sensor - what gives?

[Steptoe's photos]

Not that I have lurked EJ forums much, but never read of SOHC versions in AUDM Impreza 2000MY with cam sensor and 1999 MY without.

Was the no cam sensor to cater for the block mounted ECU of the Forester?

I am betting USDM had different versions as I have found only got EJ22 in the Impreza in 2000

Swapping engines between the models is gonna need the crank trigger to be swapped as well as inlet manifold and stuff

[el_freddo]

The EJ18 and smaller only had the crank sensor. All EJ20 engines phase 1 or 2 had cam angle sensors afaik. 

Where did this engine come from without the cam angle sensor, is it actually an EJ20 or are you assuming it is because it’s in a model that was EJ20 from factory? Or has someone pilfered the cam angle sensor for some reason? 

Cheers 

Bennie

[el_freddo]

I just checked for a cam angle sensor on the EJ202 I’m messing around with and there does not seem to be any plug in the wiring for a cam angle sensor, nor do I recall removing a cam angle sensor from this engine as there isn’t one, but the hole for it was open to the back of the cam wheel, no cover or plug. 

I hope this helps mate! 

Cheers 

Bennie

[Steptoe's photos]

hope you put something on those words you eat Bennie

I have an August 1998 made date, so a MY1999MY Forester, with a Sept 1998 compliance plate date ( how different from my Sept 85 made RXA with a 3/87 compliance plate  )

I have the original handbooks that the dealer staff completed by hand, stating the same engine number for the EJ20 I just pulled out.

24 years and 360,000 km and hardly a dirty puddle has this seen ! The inside was a different story

It appears to have been well serviced and maintained up until recently when life hit a few speed bumps for previous owner.

In going in to inspect the crank sensor differences of the one piece cam belt crank cog/ crank trigger. It has a series of teeth, probably normally fit 36 to a trigger, but has a ramp up to a flat of no teeth opposite a no teeth section, then a run of teeth between each one. The donor EJ20 pulled from a late 1999 RX Impreza that has a cam sensor, the crank trigger wheel is basically six pointed trigger. I scored one like this, if not the same, from a 2000's EJ25 Foz engine in prep to try a speedyefi ECU

 

So, swapped the crank trigger to suit the car. There is a rubber plug, looks factory in the cam box section of the #2 and #4 head. The cam sensor of the Impreza is not the same as the crank sensors. It has a metal shield casing around the part that sits in the orifice . I don't know yet if the crank sensor is the same between the two. No part numbers cast, just some feint rubber ink stamp numbers. 

I am jst finding the larger body of the Foz a bit tricky to get around to line the engine back up to the gearbox. Tinkering with idea to borrow some gearbox bolts for their long shaft to try line up top holes, complimenting Subaru's great stud idea down below. Engine is hanging from an even number of links chain, bolted diagonally. Front of #2 head and rear of #4 has some up facing M10 holes. Planning on using a turn buckle in between block and tackle hook and front of block to get some fine, supported adjustment to get the angle of approach perfect. 

[el_freddo]

So you’re dropping a phase 1 engine into a phase 2 vehicle? 

How will you bolt the intake manifold on? NA and turbo phase 1 are different to each other; phase 2 NA and turbo intake bolt patterns are the same but different to phase 1. 

The EJ202 with the computer mounted on the back of the engine has two marks on the cam wheel “3hrs” apart from each other. I can’t tell you how they’re orientated atm in relation to the cam timing mark without looking at it. 

This crank timing cog at a quick glance is the same between EJ202 na and EJ205 turbo.

And as for eating my words, smothered in dark rum is best  

Cheers 

Bennie

[Steptoe's photos]

Given that the box of gloves was within reach, I don't understand why I was not using them. If I was, I would have had clean hands underneath to take photos for you, of both trigger wheels (integrally cast into the back of timing belt sprocket) and the rubber bung plug.

 

I really do not know Phase 1 and 2 ... stuff I think is related to bellhousing bolt pattern / number ?

 

I think I read somewhere that my EJ20 in the Foz, is EJ202

Foz made August 98 so must be AUDM 1999MY

Imp was late 99 so must be 2000MY

The Imp EJ20 is now in, running and road tested. Runs pretty sweet too. I have six weeks rego left on it, so plan to keep the test driving going, see what fuel economy it gives .

The more I do to it, the longer the donor delay becomes   

Just about to source some GT mag wheels to do away with seasicky 70 series tyres

I had to swap the crank's timing belt cog for the trigger wheel bits to suit the under bonnet ECU.

I also had to swap the intake manifold and all it's bits so loom plugs would match.

I found that the TB are different in where the coolant comes and goes, maybe for the Foz has hydraulic clutch slave in the way of an Imp TB ?

To assist with inlet manifold hook up, I made use of my 8mm silicone end caps and deleted the coolant from the TB.

I can assure you I will not be parking in freeze or snow. It simplified hook up and peace of mind of reduced number of hoses to blow in future

Using Foz intake fixed the bad injector I had on the Imp, I now have an empty engine bay in the Brumby to build and install my EA82M v2.0. 

[el_freddo]

Hmmm, is the foz a series 1 (taillights on body only) or series 2 (taillights on boot lid too)? 

The phase 2 inlet gaskets don’t fit the phase 1 heads, so you can’t be swapping between the two without a head swap… and 1998 seems too early for the phase 2 to me (I could be wrong again!). In the Liberty it didn’t come in until 1999 when the first Gen3 models landed. Imprezas I thought were 1999 or 2000 when they swapped to the phase 2. 

Easiest way to tell if the block is phase 1 or 2 is the number of gearbox mount bolts. Both phases have the same lower studs as all Subaru EA engines. The phase 1 engine only has the upper two bellhousing bolts, the phase 2 has six bellhousing bolts and is commonly referred to as the eight bolt engine. 

Phase 1 heads have three retainer bolts in the centre line with cast lines on the cam cover. Phase 2 has five retainer bolts, one in each corner and one in the centre. These cam covers are smooth and the spark plug tubes are built into the cam covers. 

Cheers 

Bennie

[Steptoe's photos]

Thankfully it is  the tail gate free of lights. So a Series Oe. It also has that butt ugly brush guard on the front bumper. I also find series one grille easier on the eye.

Both engines were six bolt, two stud. Imp was late 99 build date, so 2000MY is assumed. Foz built Aug 98.

A stroke of luck that the Forester block matched my Imp. Must be careful if I get any more bits.

I really struggled with the larger body when grappling with the engine / gearbox separation and engagement.

I grabbed a pair of gearbox housing bolts and cut down to 120mm long , one ended studs to assist in aligning the top, while factory studs helped below

[forester2002s]

4 hours ago, Steptoe's photos said:

I grabbed a pair of gearbox housing bolts and cut down to 120mm long , one ended studs to assist in aligning the top, while factory studs helped below

That's a great idea. Thanks for the tip.

[Steptoe's photos]

On 1/17/2023 at 11:50 AM, forester2002s said:

That's a great idea. Thanks for the tip.

I also used a block and tackle hanging from above. Chain bolted to upfacing M10 holes front corner of #2 and same at back of #3, even number of links, then used a turn buckle in between links , from front, upper middle of block to the hook. It allowed me to make fine adjustments to the angle the engine hung. A few tweaks to match angle of the gearbox. It made a swearing event into a quick and easy one person job.

[forester2002s]

I've rigged up a chain-hoist from the garage-rafters. And I use a Load-Leveler from Harbor Freight, similar to this one.

But I really like your idea of used long studs in the upper mounting holes, to guide the assembly together. It sounds easy to just line up the engine and trans, and it will all slide together easily. But in practice, it just ain't that easy!

[Steptoe's photos]

the plug

it seals a lot better than the heat? shielded cam sensor

[Steptoe's photos]

On 1/21/2023 at 10:16 AM, forester2002s said:

I've rigged up a chain-hoist from the garage-rafters. And I use a Load-Leveler from Harbor Freight, similar to this one.

But I really like your idea of used long studs in the upper mounting holes, to guide the assembly together. It sounds easy to just line up the engine and trans, and it will all slide together easily. But in practice, it just ain't that easy!

I used a cable tie to hold the clutch fork back and only a gentle crank turn to align the friction plate and greased lightly , input shaft - and it was that easy. Only taken 25 years of wrestling them to think of this

A light coat of lube on all four studs also helped ( i like to think)