Phaedras Posted April 11, 2005 Share Posted April 11, 2005 Can't seem to find anything on search about this, but are Xt6s able to handle a turbo? I'm thinkin' that 145hp are fine and dandy but that they can easily take another 30-odd without falling apart... Even if there isn't a "bolt-on" solution, or the engine can't handle that high compression, one could use a small, efficient aftermarket turbo. Low boost is better than no boost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted April 11, 2005 Share Posted April 11, 2005 The XT6 is turboable, and it has been done before (though I do not know who did it) The pistons from an EA82T will fit the XT6 engine to lower compression, though some sort of boost control system will need to be added, as well as some sort of mixture adjustment system to accomidate boost. Custom copper head gaskets will also be needed, not to mention all of the intake/exhaust fabbing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoodsWagon Posted April 11, 2005 Share Posted April 11, 2005 Hmm. I believe what you are looking for is the holy grail of xt6 owners. There were thoughts that the pistons from EA82t's could be put in to lower the compression to take the boost, and somebody was building a supercharged one. I believe that the clutches are fairly close to the EA82's, just a different flywheel machining, so I don't know how much power you could hold with the clutch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phaedras Posted April 11, 2005 Author Share Posted April 11, 2005 Couldn't one just go an easier route and install a relatively small turbo that doesn't push it that hard? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted April 11, 2005 Share Posted April 11, 2005 Very true, the clutch would be my big concern too - just of note, the XT6 engine has the same bore as the EA82T, and the SVX engine has the same bore as the EJ22T - so it would be possible to create an SVX turbo too ... and I KNOW that has been done before Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted April 11, 2005 Share Posted April 11, 2005 Couldn't one just go an easier route and install a relatively small turbo that doesn't push it that hard? not really - a smaller turbo will probably just spin faster - and wear out quicker - the best way would be to put decent sized one on and set it to a low boost (waste gate opens earlier) - but then again, I am not a turbo-guru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoodsWagon Posted April 11, 2005 Share Posted April 11, 2005 Go for it, if you feel like it. Me and a friend tried turboing a suzuki samuri 1.3 liter with an old ihi oil cooled turbo. We did it low budjet style, used plumbing fittings and steel gas line tubing to tap into the oil pressure sender for the feed and a rubber hose for the return. PVC pipe for the intake, cut and welded 1and 3/4" exhaust. The turbo wouldn't spool up because it was all coked up and somehow the compresser was interfering with the housing, but everything was set up to work, and it would have been interesting to see what happened. The XT6 motor is harder to come by, so blowing one up might be frowned upon. But hey, someone's got to have the spirit of adventure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myxalplyx Posted April 11, 2005 Share Posted April 11, 2005 Can't seem to find anything on search about this, but are Xt6s able to handle a turbo? I'm thinkin' that 145hp are fine and dandy but that they can easily take another 30-odd without falling apart... Even if there isn't a "bolt-on" solution, or the engine can't handle that high compression, one could use a small, efficient aftermarket turbo. Low boost is better than no boost. Dave of ProECM has a turbocharged XT6. Little is known about it. I posted some pics of the setup at XT6.net but it was incomplete. Dave stated the car was able to handle 14psi or so without an intercooler before problems started. I do not know the current status of the car but I've been bugging him for the setup for over a year. Paul Singer has a supercharged XT6 that has been being built up for god knows how long. It's still not finished. Last I remembered, it had issues with hood clearance for the supercharger. It had been engine dyno'd with 80 more hp than stock (around 230ish). No word on where it stands as of late besides the hood clearance issues. I've been trying to get someone to help me turbocharge my XT6 practically since I've owned it. Had it at Rallispec and my $$$$ went out the window before the project got started. Recently had 'Nightrider' at a shop called FSM (First State Motorsports) from January up until about 2 weeks ago. The guys never got started on the project. They kept putting it on the backburner to do never ending Honda projects. I was hoping to surprise a lot of people here by having it turbocharged and busting out some good 1/4 mile times and dyno power. Oh well! Yes, it is turboable. Even Subaru engineers spoke about it in an old article I posted up. I'm to lazy to look for it now, maybe later. If you pursue this route, good luck. I'm just settling for nitrous for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archemitis Posted April 11, 2005 Share Posted April 11, 2005 if hood clearance issues was a problem, you probably shouldnt be building a ragin xt6 motor. =] *sawsall emoticon here* i think a t3 at low boost with an intercooler would be very very cool. i think its gotta handle 5-7 lbs without any fuel management at all. the maf sensor would just sense more air going in, just like if you cammed it. and put big exhaust, and all that good stuff. but an extra two injectors, right at the crotch of the manifold would be nice, and easy too. if i didnt go offroad with my hatch, id turbo the crap out of it, but thats just asking for broken axles, with my big tires. very turboable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted April 11, 2005 Share Posted April 11, 2005 I was looking at the parts manual for a legacy turbo, and realized that he pumbing for the legacy turbo may be close to bolt-on for the XT6 - not sure about clearence of crossmembers - but that still leaves issues with the CR and boost management. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Davis Posted April 12, 2005 Share Posted April 12, 2005 I like MAFs right up until they become a big fat restriction. I get a little iffy about unknown EFI setups with respect to MAF/injector limitiations, or fuel cut. Small turbos are good for one thing: blowing hot air. Plenty of goodly sized stuff in the junkyard for the thrifty minded individual, feel free to go a little bigger and cool those charge exit temps, make more power, and make that extra power with safety. HY35 or HX35 off of Cummins Diesel Dodges can be had in used/low mileage form for $150-300, HX35 is good for over 500 to the wheels in a gas application if figuring for 15% (aka 2WD) drivetrain loss. I think the Megasquirt guys would be who I'd look to for a project like this; affordable and thorough engine management. Piggybacks are a good way to detonate by confusing the ECU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerFahrer Posted April 18, 2005 Share Posted April 18, 2005 I have been missing all sorts of stuff on this board lately :-\ There is nothing wrong with small turbos as long as you can accept the fact that you can't run high boost with them. They will spool up a lot faster and turbo lag will be almost nonexistant. If you can hold yourself back on boost enough where you don't need an intercooler, then you will REALLY have boost anytime you want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Davis Posted April 18, 2005 Share Posted April 18, 2005 There is nothing wrong with small turbos as long as you can accept the fact that you can't run high boost with them. They will spool up a lot faster and turbo lag will be almost nonexistant. If you can hold yourself back on boost enough where you don't need an intercooler, then you will REALLY have boost anytime you want. Hi. I'm going to disagree a whole lot. I'm not trying to be an rump roast, just hear me out and ask for clarification or debate the finer points with me. I'm not trying to be rude, just my $0.02 When I ran a .50 trim Saab T3 with .48 AR turbine my B18B spooled it at 2500 rpms. I ran up to "11 psi" with no intercooler upon occaision, despite commonly held urban myth represented as fact stated I needed an intercooler for anything past "7 psi." This is because I tuned for MBT (minimum best timing) and therefore made best possible power with least chance of detonation. When I upgraded to a .60 trim T3 with .48 AR turbine, I noticed spool was no different, yet I made "more power per psi" than with the smaller compressor. IAT logs were also 10-15 deg F cooler "per psi" When I simultaneously upgraded the .60 trim T3's turbine housing to .63 AR, and installed a 24"X11"X4" IC (approx 50% more volume than some of the "600 hp" cores found in magazine builds) I got really "laggy." As in, an extra 600 rpms, golly gee whiz. Gosh, that sure ruined things for me. Utilizing a hybrid of pulse flow and pressure wave exhaust manifold design, I am able to spool a Holset HX35 200 rpms later than the above .60/.63 T3 with overly large volumed IC. The HX35 is good for nearly twice the airflow (horsepower) that a .60 trim T3 is, and the turbine wheel's exhaust exit is right at twice the size (proportionally less restriction). The joys of running a turbine wheel/housing designed sometime after the stone age, sitting at the end of a turbo manifold based on Alfred Buchi's specifications! Here's a picture of the .60/.63 vs the HX35 - ignore the puny T3/04E hybrid sitting between them: Can you guess how much I have dropped my IATs, and the corresponding lowering of my knock limit on pump gas, through using this turbo (and manifold design)? Intake manifold psi compared to atmospheric psi is an invalid comparison. It has nothing to do with anything. For general purposes, a rise in hp per psi indicates a gain in system VE, but there are several instances where it does not. VE is also not as important as some people hold - actual air mass inducted is god, and VE compared to power can wander all over the place. The exhaust has to breathe past the exhaust manifold/turbine, and the smaller that passage is the more it strangles the engine despite the intake manifold psi. Compare intake manifold pressure to turbine inlet pressure if you must compare anything. Personally, I don't care about anything except a thermally safe AFR, and MBT - on racegas or with water/diluent injection to raise knock limit where applicable. I pay attention to heat entering my engine (small turbo = heat = bad) and I pay attention to how easily my engine can shed it's heat (small turbo = bottleneck through which exhaust heat must pass = bad). The more you can cool things, the better for power, peak power potential, engine longevity, bsfc, ad nauseam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingbobdole Posted April 18, 2005 Share Posted April 18, 2005 What ever happened to Dave? I baught a pulley, and he was gonna give me a ride, but we never hooked up..... Last time I talked to him it seems as though he was kinda frustrated with the limits of the car.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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