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I knew this day would come.... mickey mouse gasket....


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15 replies to this topic

#1 Speed Kills

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 07:43 AM

Well, My '88 XT6 has had a pretty good sized oil leak from the oil pump since I bought it (roughly a quart every 200 miles), as well as the tick of death. Oh well, I have $400 in the whole car right now, and it's intended to be a winter car/beater. A little oil leak doesn't bother me. Just buy a gallon of oil to keep in the car and go on 'bout my business.

Well, this morning, that relatively small oil leak turned into my Suby doing it's best Exxon-Valdez impression, and lost about 2-3 quarts within 20 miles, as I noticed it ticking, and the oil pressure about 10lbs. lower than it should be at highway crusing speed. Luckily I pulled over and got oil in it in time to avoid and damage to the top end. Happy f'in new year, right? Oh well, knew this day was coming.

Is there a good DIY on how to change the mickey mouse gasket? Or is it really that straight forward? I'd assume there's some torque specs needed for the pump bolts and what not. And where is generally the best place to get that goofy looking gasket? Is it a Subaru only type thing?


Thanks in advance fellas.


-Ian

#2 Frank B

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 07:59 AM

Subaru isn't the only company that makes/sells them, but get them from Subaru. Do you have a repair manual? All the info you need is in there. Do a quick search and you'll see that because of the amount of other parts that need to come off, it's a good time to replace the timing belts and tensioners, and water pump.
Are you sure it's the oil pump gaskets? could be the front crank seal too.

#3 Speed Kills

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 08:05 AM

I guess I'll just do the crank seal and oil pump gaskets at the same time. I was told the TOD was caused by the mickey mouse seal, and the leak is most definitely coming out of the oil pump itself where it meets the block. I pinpointed that much at least. I'm sitting at work right now, probably going to have AAA come get the car so I don't have to risk driving it home.


The WP/timing belts are decently fresh (+/-30K), and honestly, if they break, they break. It's a $400, 182K mile car.


And no, I don't own the repair manual. I was hoping maybe someone had a DIY somewhere, as this will probably be the only major repair I ever do to the car, and hopefully can save me the $15 cost of a manual, IF I can find one.


Snow is coming next week. I'm hoping I can get this thing sorted out before it hits.....

#4 Frank B

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 08:25 AM

Oh, keep looking around here and you'll be able to put together a step by step procedure. Did you replace the belts yourself? If so, it's basically the same job, but after you take the belts off, you take off the oil pump. If it were a new pump I'd say be sure to fill the pump with assembly lube, or Vaseline to lubricate it and to help it prime when you crank it up. Not sure if you really need to do that when you re-use the old pump.

The TOD has many causes. The most common are a leaking mickey mouse O-ring. Usually it won't leak oil, but it will harden and flaten with age and air will be sucked in from the oil pump. Those little bubbles get trapped in the lifters and will not allow the lifters to pump up. Other causes are lack of changing the oil regularly, and the use of cheap oil. After you get the leak fixed, try changing the oil, using a good filter and brand name oil with a quart of Rislone to clean out the lifters.

#5 Speed Kills

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 08:31 AM

Oh, keep looking around here and you'll be able to put together a step by step procedure. Did you replace the belts yourself? If so, it's basically the same job, but after you take the belts off, you take off the oil pump. If it were a new pump I'd say be sure to fill the pump with assembly lube, or Vaseline to lubricate it and to help it prime when you crank it up. Not sure if you really need to do that when you re-use the old pump.

The TOD has many causes. The most common are a leaking mickey mouse O-ring. Usually it won't leak oil, but it will harden and flaten with age and air will be sucked in from the oil pump. Those little bubbles get trapped in the lifters and will not allow the lifters to pump up. Other causes are lack of changing the oil regularly, and the use of cheap oil. After you get the leak fixed, try changing the oil, using a good filter and brand name oil with a quart of Rislone to clean out the lifters.


I found a service receipt in the car dated w/mileage after I bought it. So no, I didn't do the timing belts myself.

I've looked at the causes of TOD pretty extensively, done alot of reading on here, and I just kind of figured if it was allowing air into the pump, it could be allowing oil out. But I'll replace both just to be sure.

I mean, I'm sure I can figure it out once I get in there (I'm not exactly a newb when it comes to cars, just to this Subaru), but some pointers beforehand would be nice to cut down the amount of time put into the job. And a torque spec for the oil pump/timing belt tension would be nice....

#6 Frank B

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 08:32 AM



as this will probably be the only major repair I ever do to the car,


:lol:

#7 Frank B

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 08:33 AM

It is easy, and you won't have a problem at all doing it.

There are similar threads listed on the bottom of this page, and plenty of posts about oil pumps here to read.

#8 Speed Kills

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 08:39 AM

:lol:


In the sense that if it needs any more major repair than this, it's going to scrap.:)

#9 Frank B

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 08:41 AM

I'd bet that more than half of the people on this board paid $400 or less for thier Subaru, I did!

http://www.ultimates...ead.php?t=50768
Timing belt procedure shows the oil pump, see how it's driven by the timing belt?

#10 grossgary

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 09:24 AM

One note that will differ from most of what you'll read here even though the oil pumps are very similar: You'll need 2 parts to reseal an XT6 oil pump - the mickey mouse gasket and the shaft seal. (The EA82 - what most folks on here have - have an additional oring that the XT6 does NOT have).

The drivers side timing belt tensioner is kind of quirky and strange, but just requires screw drivers to do it right. The hard part is reinstalling the belt, holding the tension off or having someone hold the spring loaded screw tensioner while you install it. I have a picture on subaruxt.com of how to use a right angle screw driver so you can do it by yourself. Sears sells right angle screw drivers, one was a perfect fit for sticking in the hole (some are too large) and screwing the tensioner fully retracted. Once retracted install the tensioner with the right angle screw driver still on it - then let it "press" against the engine block, it will hold in place, then pull it out once you're done with the belt. Since it's a flat head - there are two possible positions - 180 degrees apart - the one "closest" to the engine will work, the other will not. it's really simple once you just have a right angle screw driver that works, you'll get the idea. you can even sure a screw drive and vice grips but that's really annoying. Subaru has a special tool (clip) to hold the tensioner, i acually have two of them but don't even use them because the right angle screw driver is actually easier.

pictures is worth a thousand words, here's a picture of it:
http://www.subaruxt....light=tensioner
*** i think you need a screw driver with a 1/8" tip - not all of them have that size. too big and it won't fit.

This drivers side tensioner is also different from all the EA82 sttuff (which is what many people on here have).

The timing belts are lined up different than newer belts - both cam pulleys are 180 degrees out from each other - not the same like all new stuff. install drivers side first, rotate crank 360 degrees then install the other side.

That's about everything you needed to know.

Since this is a beater car, just rip the timing covers off and don't reinstall them, at least the outer ones. They're typically annoying to get off, rusted, the inserts spin inside and won't come out - just a PITA. I've owned like 20+ XT6's and I never reinstall them on my daily drivers.

subaruxt.com is an XT6 specific website and is where i have pictures of the right angle screw driver.

Edited by grossgary, 31 December 2009 - 09:30 AM.


#11 phantomcrooner

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 01:40 PM

Yes replace the oil pump shaft o-ring at same time, should come with the mickey mouse gasket.

These will get hard and loose and start to pour oil, if the shaft moves around at all when you try to move the pully from side to side then it is prob also leaking.

#12 Speed Kills

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 01:57 PM

Negative. Found my oil leak.


Finally went and got enough oil to start it back up, driver's side front cam seal is TOAST. Lost about 1/4 qt. of oil in a little less than 45 seconds of running.


Now to have AAA tow it home. Anyone have any tips on that? Grossgary?

#13 grossgary

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 02:02 PM

cam seals are easy. all the same as the oil pump - remove the timing belts.

remove timing belts, remove cam sprocket (just the big gear the belt wraps around), rear timing cover - none of that is special, just all unbolts.

remove cam cap - it's the thing the seal is pressed into. it's held in place by 3 10mm bolts. remove it and replace the oring under the cap and the seal. thepartsbin.com sells cam seal "kits" that have the oring and seal. Subaru parts are better quality though probably, but i have used those kits before so take your pick.

done, very simple.

if you replace the crank seal, i definitely would buy a subaru crank seal, i've had these not seat properly aftermarket.

you're going to need to replace the timing belt as well - when they get oil soaked, they break quickly. i replaced a friends leaking seal and the brand new belt (which i had installed only months prior) was coated in oil. not wanting to charge him more i wiped it off and reinstalled. the brand new belt lasted a month or two and broke.

#14 Speed Kills

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 02:10 PM

Thanks Gary! My cam seal kit (o-ring and seal) will be ready for me tomorrow morning, and I'll get a T-belt while I'm at it.


Looks like I kinda dodged the bullet here, and I can get my beater back on the road!

#15 grossgary

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 02:16 PM

Are you resealing the oil pump too? I'd give that a whirl while you're in there, might take care of that TOD.

johnfromky had some XT6 timing belts for sale recently but looks like you want it done now. i bought three of them, thought he had another left?

I'd rank the crank seal as the hardest thing behind the belts to replace, I hate doing those, not much room to work with to press them in.

Good luck.

#16 Speed Kills

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 03:33 PM

Honestly? Probably not. As all this thing has to do is last me through the winter. And the lifters make a little noise now anyways, probably from the lack of oil. Again. $400 car. :rolleyes: Oh well!




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