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Outback countermeasure piston kit installation


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18 replies to this topic

#1 jcole01108

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Posted 25 May 2004 - 02:50 PM

Has anyone here had Subaru authorize installation of countermeasure pistons using a "piston kit" in their exisiting Outback's short block?

Just had a Subaru regional rep okay their installation to get rid of piston slap in my 2000 Outback. He also said that if the cylinder walls don't meet spec, that they would install a new short block. My major concern is obviously whether the dealer can do the work properly, though the dealership is highly regarded here in the Massachusetts and the work is warranteed by Subaru.

#2 Commuter

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Posted 25 May 2004 - 10:50 PM

I think it was at least 2 years ago, but I recall a member recounting in several posts that he complained enough (Phase I engine I would think) that they finally did something for him. His work order indicated "countermeasure" pistons. He said the piston slap was gone after that. IIRC, there wasn't even much noise when cold. I don't know how many miles he put on the engine after that (I think it was a least a year since he'd had it done last I recall seeing a post).

This was on the old ezboard, so you probably won't find any posts about it.

I don't know that anyone ever quite figured out what countermeasure pistons were (CCR Inc could probably tell us). My best guess is that they just put in pistons with tighter / matched tolerances to the cylinders. *shrug* Just a guess.

Commuter

#3 Tiny Clark

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Posted 25 May 2004 - 11:48 PM

Maybe they put in a real piston, the type with a longer skirt.

They probably tried to lighten the whole mass up by using those short-skirted ones, not that I have anything against short skirts, just not in an engine or on Rosie O'Donnell

#4 cookie

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Posted 27 May 2004 - 12:12 AM

Forester I would look at those pistons as well as open a few boxes from folks like TRW.
I would also be looking for a good length on the skirt as the tiny increase in power and fuel mileage is not worth the Peterbuilt imitation on startup to me.
At this point with 100,000 plus mies on my Forester the engine is holding out well but the transmission is getting more musical as the mileage goes up. I suspect I may be changing the tranny in the future but the engine may hold out till I am done with the car.

#5 mrk610

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Posted 28 May 2004 - 07:46 PM

I posted about 4 months ago about this . I had Subaru replace my #4and #2 pistons with the so called countermeasure piston . I have a 02 outback 2.5 4eat it had at the time of surgery 39k miles on it . I have had the slap since 6 k miles . My slap got so bad that it was always there even when the engine was fully warmed up . It never used any oil and it always ran like a top , but the slap was so bad It sounded like the engine was going to throw a rod . I have put 4500 miles on it and it has not been back to the dealer since . I was able to see my old pistons b/4 they sent them back to SOA for analysis. There was definent wear on both pistons around the wrist pin area's. I also saw my cylinder walls and they looked fine no wear at all . You could still see the hone marks clearly. I asked why no wear on the walls and the mechanic said that SOA uses a very hard iron cylinder sleeve in the aluminum block .SOA is not swapping blocks anymore they are installing the pistons instead . The mechanic said that the new pistons are alittle more barrel shaped then the old ones meaning they are a little wider. I still get a very lite knock on cold start up but it goes away within about 1 minute . When the outside temp is above 60 I get no noise at all on start up . The other good thing is that I also got the new updated head gaskets when they did the work . If you have anymore questions just ask .

Mike

#6 jcole01108

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Posted 28 May 2004 - 07:56 PM

Thanks for the info. I do have some concerns about the work being done properly. I thought I would have my independent tech take a look at it after the work is done. A complete teardown as the service manager said is not minor surgery.

#7 jcole01108

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Posted 23 June 2004 - 09:07 PM

Just thought you'd like to know that I got my car back from the dealer today. They spent two days replacing the #2 and #4 pistons to fix the psiton slap issue. So far, so good and it seems to have a bit more pep than it had before.

The entire process started quite a bit ago. It took a while to get the zone rep in to look at the vehicle (over a month) and then a couple of weeks for the dealer to get the parts in, but now it is done and all under warranty.

#8 blitz

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Posted 24 June 2004 - 05:24 PM

Hey jcole01108,

Glad the work turned out alright.

Did you happen ask anyone what's up regarding #2 & #4 slapping, but not #1 & #3?

#9 cookie

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Posted 24 June 2004 - 06:17 PM

direction of rotation. But you know I'm senile blitz.

#10 blitz

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Posted 24 June 2004 - 07:34 PM

LOL :) Thanks.

#11 jcole01108

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Posted 24 June 2004 - 07:56 PM

You know, I left the dealership and the first thought that entered my head was, why just the left hand side of the engine? Next time I am at the dealer I will ask the question. The car is dramatically quieter.

#12 blitz

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Posted 25 June 2004 - 11:42 AM

Cookie explained it: gravity. One bank has the thrust side of the piston facing down while the opposite bank has it facing up.

#13 rjp98outlook

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Posted 22 February 2005 - 05:31 PM

Hi. How did you manage to get your pistons replaced? My 02 is pretty darn noisy at only 18,000 miles. Can I have this fixed under waranty too?


Thanks
Rich

#14 mrk610

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Posted 25 February 2005 - 10:54 PM

I had my #2 and 4 pistons replaced under warranty last Jan 04. The only way I know to have them install countermeasure pistons is if the noise is always there . . In my case my piston slap noise never went away even when car was fully warmed up . They say it could take up to 10-15 mins untill noise goes way . I had them done a 43k miles i now have 53 k miles and this winter i got my start up noise back . Not as bad as before and it only takes 1-3 mins for noise to go away . . I do have a 7year 100k miles warranty so I am not worried.

Mike

#15 rjp98outlook

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Posted 28 February 2005 - 09:57 AM

The noise I hear also never goes away. It occurs only under very light acceleration at about 2800 RPM. It is a hollow knocking. It does not start until the car is warmed up. When did your noise happen? COuld you hear it at idle, or only at a certain RPM or load?



Thanks







I had my #2 and 4 pistons replaced under warranty last Jan 04. The only way I know to have them install countermeasure pistons is if the noise is always there . . In my case my piston slap noise never went away even when car was fully warmed up . They say it could take up to 10-15 mins untill noise goes way . I had them done a 43k miles i now have 53 k miles and this winter i got my start up noise back . Not as bad as before and it only takes 1-3 mins for noise to go away . . I do have a 7year 100k miles warranty so I am not worried.

Mike



#16 Setright

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Posted 28 February 2005 - 11:42 AM

Oh dear, the sound apears when the oil is warm? That could mean a worn bearing. These get noisy as the oil thins out.

#17 rjp98outlook

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Posted 28 February 2005 - 11:57 AM

Yes, it is probably due to oil thinning out when it warms up. (btw, no additive or oil change makes it go away so far). How can I investigate this further. I took it to my dealer twice (it only has 19K miles on it and is under waranty). They say this sound is normal, I say it is not and sounds embarrasing. There is clearly a hollow knock every time under the conditions I described. Something is banging against something, and I don't think it should be. They did replace the timing belt tensioner last week, but it did not have any effect on this nocking, however, it totaly fixed another noise I was having when the engine was cold! That was great service I thought. We were hoping the same defective tensioner was causing both noises, but apparently not. Anyone have any clues as to what this might be? I think I will record it and bring to the dealer.

Thanks
Rich

#18 mrk610

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Posted 28 February 2005 - 11:05 PM

My piston slap noise was only when the engine was cold . It would knock even when it was 90 deg outside . It only did it on cold start up and got quieter when the engine got warm but was always there.

Mike

#19 grossgary

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Posted 01 March 2005 - 12:09 AM

on the cylinder walls, if you open up a 200,000 miles subaru that's been well maintained the cross hatching will look new in the cylinders as well. i haven't seen one yet that didn't have excellent cylinder walls and cross hatching at 200,000 miles. seen one block that had some tiny divots along the lip of the cylinder from driving on a blown head gasket but otherwise the cylinder walls have always looked perfect at the ones i've looked into.




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