tforce
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Posts posted by tforce
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this is in fact the way you test to see if the front and rear diffs are matching.
with the TCU unplugged, the front and rear wheels should be locked together.
so turning one by hand should turn the other.
(and if the diffs match they shaould turn the exact same number of times.)
so it sounds like a transfer clutch issue.
the basics:
no fluid pressure = no power to the rear wheels
this is why you can jack up the rear and spin the by hand with the engine off.
putting the FWD fuse in ''dumps'', redirects?, all the fluid pressure.
full fluid pressure = Torque Bind, front and rear locked together.
trans fluid is operating the transfer clutch at full pressure, not regulated by the duty C.
TCU disconnected or bad duty C.
fluid pressure regulated by the duty C and the TCU = AWD, power to both the front and rear.
the power split weighted more for the front, ~80 /20, but in certain situations it will approach 50/50.
it never gets to 50/50, and it always allows for some slip between the front and rear.
this avoids TB.
i hate to see you give up,
but i certainly understand.
i don't think you need a trans, but probably a good working rear extension housing .
the clutch disks may be worn out.
That would be handy. I'll see if I can put together a decent Ext housing and maybe try that first. The tranny does have some other signs that make me wonder though. Shifts have been a little rough when it's cold and it takes awhile before it will shift from 3rd to 4th as it warms up. I did have to reseal the tranny pan recently...maybe it's leaking again and the fluid is getting low.
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Where is the front VSS located on the car? I have been looking for diagrams online but no such luck so far.
On the passenger side of the tranny right behind the bellhousing.
Pictures here.
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I saw this in another thread so I decided to try it just out of curiosity. I jacked up the drivers side of the car, unplugged the TCU, started the car and put it in neutral. Both wheels started spinning forward. I hit the brakes and after that, just the front wheel spun. I could move the rear wheel by hand in either direction while the front wheel was spinning and I could stop the front wheel by hand. There wasn't enough power behind it to move the car. Putting it in gear only got movement out of the front wheel. I plugged the TCU back in and tried it again. Same deal except the rear wheel didn't spin this time. I got a tiny bit of movement out of the rear wheel for just a second when I put it in Reverse.
I have no idea what that means aside from fluid flowing where/when it shouldn't and I still need to swap the tranny. Just thought I'd share.
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it is either the sensor, the TCU or the AWD transfer clutch.
disconnect the TCU wire connectors under the dash.
(or the large connector on the rear of the engine passenger side.)
this will put the trans in ''limp mode''.
you will have reverse and 3rd gear, no electronics.
it will / should also cause torque bind in slow tight turns.
(no power to the duty c solenoid)
if you do not have TB, the transfer clutch is gone, does not clutch / grab.
has the AWD ever worked right?
test the speed sensor, (old one if you still have it).
use a very slow speed on an electric drill and measure the output with an analog volt meter.
or jack up the front right wheel and turn by hand while measuring the output.
the needle should jump several times for each rotation.
if it is not working you will not have AWD.
i do not know why there is no CEL if the sensor is bad.
No TB in limp mode.
Time for a tranny swap or maybe just time to get rid of the car and move on....or maybe I'll just park it till spring and work on it then.
Anyone want an LSI for a project? It's got a few dings and rust spots already and it needs suspension work so it's a prime candidate for becoming an offroad toy.
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it is either the sensor, the TCU or the AWD transfer clutch.
disconnect the TCU wire connectors under the dash.
(or the large connector on the rear of the engine passenger side.)
this will put the trans in ''limp mode''.
you will have reverse and 3rd gear, no electronics.
it will / should also cause torque bind in slow tight turns.
(no power to the duty c solenoid)
if you do not have TB, the transfer clutch is gone, does not clutch / grab.
has the AWD ever worked right?
test the speed sensor, (old one if you still have it).
use a very slow speed on an electric drill and measure the output with an analog volt meter.
or jack up the front right wheel and turn by hand while measuring the output.
the needle should jump several times for each rotation.
if it is not working you will not have AWD.
i do not know why there is no CEL if the sensor is bad.
I do have the old speed sensor so I'll have to track down an analog meter. The AWD did work at one point. I replaced the old tranny with a used one that had TB. I swapped the old rear ext on after grinding down the grooves on the clutch. Everything worked fine till the speedo bounce showed up. Replaced the speedo and that seemed to cure it...pretty much. AWD always seemed to be a little off after that but it did work for the most part.
I'm curious to see what results I get from test #1. I doubt it's the sensor because I replaced it with the one from the old tranny and nothing changed but I'll test it anyway.
Thanks John.
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Well, the AWD has stopped working again. The first hard snow hit the other day and........suck. No indications as to what the problem is. No CEL, AT Oil Temp Light, Torque Bind, Speedo Bounce....nothing. Just no AWD. Tranny is shifting fine. Just replaced the pan gasket and the fluid looked fine. I little bit of sparkle in the bottom and some gunk on the magnet but no burning, metal fragments or anything else obviously wrong. Getting tired of working on this car. Was just about to put in a new steering rack, halfshaft and reseal the oil pan. Needs new struts and assorted suspension bushings too.
Anyone have any deeper insights on what could be causing this issue? I have access to another tranny but I'm not sure I really wanna keep pouring time and money into this thing.
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Buy a cluster from a you-pull-it junkyard for $20 and plug it in.
I would love to know where you get them for $20. Most of the local yards wanted $70+ to bring them in from another yard cuz they didn't have anything out back. I finally found a lot that had one left (out of 5 or 6 cars) for $35. Front end wreak so it wasn't in the dash anymore and the bezel was hosed.....don't know how long the thing was exposed to the weather.....and they still wanted the full $35. Luckily it still works. No more speedo bounce and the AWD seems to be working. Waiting for one last snow storm to really test it out. Thanks again for the help.
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Gauge cluster was fine. No loose screws. VSS isn't stripped. I'm assuming I need to replace the speedo....is there anyway to test it to make sure it's bad?
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Auto. Parts are from the old tranny and worked fine before it was pulled. Haven't checked the gauge cluster but will do that next. Thanks for explaination on the speedometer system Woods.
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Didn't want to start a new thread so I'm hoping someone will pick up on this.
I have swapped out both speed sensors and still have speedo bounce below 20mph.....doesn't tend to happen when the car is cold and first driven. Pan bolts were loose so some fluid had leaked out. Tightened em up, topped off fluid and things seem a little better than before. AWD seems to be decent above 30mph or so but barely there at driveway speeds. Rear left and front right wheels spun when I had the car lifted.
Wandering where to go next. TCU, ECU, gauge cluster, pressure test the line to the tail housing? Just say screw it and put in a cheap tranny that I know is good?
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Bleeding the hydraulic system is difficult at best, most who have experience with it here recommend compressing the slave cylinder completely with a c clamp while bleeding the lines.
The speedometer gears can't be swapped without opening the case. Much cheaper to buy a speedometer calibration box that will alter the output signal from the sensor.
Subaru recommended using a Vacu Bleeder.....never seen or heard of that but assuming it's a powered vacuum device of some sort. I just bled the system like you would a brake system. Only got a few small bubbles. Seems to fine working fine at the moment....weird. Can still push the slave cyl in by hand and pump the system back up to normal working pressure.
Any recommendations on brand or place to buy a calibration box?
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I know it's been awhile but I finally got the car fixed. I found a 03 Forester tranny at a shop in Bend, OR for $650. He got the tranny with torque bind and put a rear ext from another used tranny on it. The Forester has different inputs for the front driveaxles so the guy swapped the Forester inputs for the ones off my tranny and kept my old tranny for the work.
There was nothing obviously broken in the old tranny but there was small flecks of metal scattered throughout the transmission....mainly in the teeth on some of the pieces in the rear ext. As far as we can tell the front driveaxle seals were leaking and the transmission got too hot. There were scorch marks in several spots. The most noticeable was on the areas between chambers where the carrier bearings sit.
Car is driving great but there are two issues looming.
1. The speedo gear in the tranny is different then one on the Legacy my speedometer is reading 5mph higher than my actual speed. Anyone ever swapped one of these or know if can be swapped? I wouldn't care except I'm planning to sell the car.
2. Either my Master or Slave cylinder on the clutch system is failing but I don't know how to figure out which one it is. No leaks anywhere. No air in the system. The system randomly loses pressure slowly but can then be pumped up and then it's fine for awhile. I can push the plunger on the Slave cylinder by hand and recreate the pressure loss. Takes me about 30 secs to pump the system back to full pressure.
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I can't seem to find the right wrench for pulling the front VSS. Crescent wrench is just going to strip it out. It's not a 17 or a 16mm, not a 5/8ths. 16.5mm maybe? Anyone have any tips on getting this thing out?
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If it was the ring and pinion I think the oil coming out of the drain plug would have been extra chunky. The drain plug is directly below the differential, so anything falling off of the diff will end up right at the drain hole. The rest of the gears in the trans are sort of cordoned off from the front diff by walls inside the case, so if any of the other gears blew up you might not see the chunks.
Honestly these transmissions aren't worth rebuilding. Its way too time consuming and way too expensive. You can get a good used transmission for way less than half the price of rebuilding the one you have, and all you have to do is put it in the car. Yank out the one that's in there and take a look at the clutch. If the clutch disc is in tact open up the trans (takes about 25 minutes to get it opened up) and take a peek inside to see what happened.
The oil seemed fine. The clutch is good. Do I need any special tools to open up the tranny?
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Fair enough. I've got one of those on the spare tranny too!
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yes 2 tips,
1. there is no wire connector so you will have to splice it.
B. it is not the problem, i have never heard of it failing.
III. don't do it , it is not the problem.
Ok. You obviously have some experience with this. What do you think it is? Instrument cluster.....bad connections?
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usually it is the front one and that is the one that lends it self to be replaced. the rear one does not have an easy disconnect wire like the front.
the hard part is getting the wrench on it. a deep well socket may be your best bet.
No speedo cable....yay! I unplugged the front sensor and the speedo didn't work at all. So, I happen to have spare tranny and am going to rob the rear speed sensor from it. If that doesn't fix it I'll be back with more questions. Any tips or cautionary words on replacing the rear sensor?
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Is there a flashing ATF light? For some reason they do not always throw codes.
Unplug one and drive. If there is no change it is that one, if there is nt its the other.
Another possible scenario is that if it is cable driven the cable drive gear can be stripped and cause the same issues. First look and see if you have a cable or not.
No flashing ATF light. I'll check on the cable tomorrow and go from there. Thanks for the quick response Nipper. Too many car issues lately and I really need to focus on the house. It's reassuring that it may be a quick fix.
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VSS's.
There are two. When one fails the other takes over and drives the spedo. Whne one fails AWD is shut down since the car has no way of telling if wheeels are spinning or not. 1995 may or may not have a cable driven spedo as that is a switch year. If it is cable then it would be a bad spedo cable and may still very well be a bad vss sensor also.
Any good way to tell which one has failed?
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Never really got anywhere on this before I got busy with other things. Starting to think about it again so I thought I'd try to revive the thread.
The car rolled just fine with the clutch disengaged. Pulled it out of the car and the clutch is fine. No metal in the oil that I saw...nothing big and shiny anyhow. Really hard to move through the gears. Talked to the Subaru Guru in Seattle and he said ring and pinion failure before I even finished telling him what happened.
Anyone torn one of these apart? I'm wondering if I can fix this thing myself. I can get a rebuilt for $1700 but it would be really tight on the bank to drop that right now. Junkyard tranny with decent miles is looking like $1000 - $1500. Maybe I could drop in a tranny from an older GT?
I just want to get it running and sell it. It's killing my garage space and I really want to move onto finishing my EA2EJ project.
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95 Lsi Sedan
AT
AWD
170k'ish
Speedo bounces from 0-20mph. Gonna check tomorrow and see if I have a cable or not. Started doing it this summer. Car still seemed to run/drive fine so I didn't think much about it.
AWD quit working. No CEL or AT lights. Did a tail housing pull and grind gooves repair last winter to fix torque bind. Worked great all winter. Did not replace my Duty C.....oops? I thought I noticed something off about the AWD this summer on some gravel hills but I never got stuck or anything so I thought I was just imagining it. Started up my snow and ice driveway last night and had to try 3 times before I made it. I've got really good studded tires. No help at all coming from the rear wheels. Gotta get those babies back in the game.
Duty C? VSS? Bad AT Temp light not telling me something is wrong?
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Pulled the engine out of my 95 legecy and R&R'd all the oil seals, resealed the oil separator cover, new water pump and thermo, timing kit, oil pressure sender, inner pass side timing cover. Got the engine back in and it wouldn't run for SH(#. I'd start it up and it would run rough (missing) for a few seconds and then die. CEL was on and would start flashing if I tried to rev it up. Turns out that water had pooled around the spark plugs when I hosed off the top of the engine to clean off all the oil from the leaking Oil PS.....Ooops. Runs great now but I forgot to shift the timing tension plunger to the left before I pulled the pin. And I maybe should have replaced the driver side HLA's but the tick really isn't that bad.
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Didn't bother reading the whole thread but I did have a similar problem with my 2002 Lego. Car would try to stall sometimes when I pressed the clutch in but corrected itself before it died. Turned out to be a combo of a bad IACV and a fried shunt in the ECM. Replaced both and it pretty much went away. Every now and then it will throw a CEL with the same code but without any stalling or any other issue.....just throws a code randomly. Turns out that some of the ECM's were programmed with too narrow of a parameter set associated with the IACV. Supposedly you can get your ECM flashed to widen the parameters and cure it. But it's really hard to find a dealer that knows about it. Gresham Subaru in OR had to dig into their troubleshooting laptop to find any info on it for me....wasn't on any bulletins, etc. Haven't bothered yet cuz it only throws the code once or twice a year and caused zero problems.....no reason to spend the money.
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Helped a little, but still had TB. Also tranny shifted hard from 1-2, and shifted erratically at times ever since I got it running.
I have that hard shifting issue from 1-2, but only when the car is cold. And once it's made the shift the 1st time, it's smooth from then on. I'll check the grounds and see what I find there. I had a 99 OBW years ago that started having major tranny problems and it was due to a wiring problem under the dash. I didn't know #$## about cars at the time so I got overwhelmed and just got rid of the car. Kinda wish I still had that thing.
95 Lego AWD and Speedo Issues
in 1990 to Present Legacy, Impreza, Outback, Forester, Baja, WRX&WrxSTI, SVX
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Before I go the route of just replacing the rear ext there's one question that's been nagging at me. I've read a few posts about the tube that sends fluid to the rear ext housing coming loose. I'm not clear on that one. Does it come loose inside the tranny or the rear ext? I'm hesitant to take the chance of putting together a good ext housing and then find out that the problem is inside the main part of the tranny.