ktdenali

I have a 2000 Legacy Outback (EJ252), 5 speed. (130,000 miles) It seems to be running great at all times, but when I go on steeper uphill, the engine temperature gauge climbs up. This makes nervous even though it has not been out of the safe zone yet. I believe it should be rock solid (as my old '96 Legacy EJ22 was) as this last time it went even higher than before, almost 3/4 of the way. When I drive it on level ground, or interstate with smaller hills it seems fine. But when I go skiing and have to climb up to the parking lot at a higher elevation, the temperature seems to climb too. It did not a few weeks ago when I went skiing, but this last time it did. Just don't know what the inconsistency is. The following I have checked: -Coolant fluid level is good, recently changed, and no leaks visible anywhere. - According to my manual (Chilton) if the radiator hose is hot the thermostat is working so I think that should be ok!? -Engine warms up to operating temperature in normal amount of time. -Cooling fan comes on when stopping (at red light etc.) All other fluid levels are fine. Does anyone know why the dashboard temperature gauge is not rock solid? Why the inconsistency? I know some of the 2.5 engines have head gasket problems, especially the EJ25D (96-99) but I heard this series (EJ252/251) does not overheat, but only leaks coolant externally on the back of the engine, easy to spot. Is my engine really heating up, or the gauge is lying to me? Any ideas?

I am on the same page with additives. I wondered the same things about what they want you to add to your coolant after they screwed up on the head gaskets. There is some sort of a Subaru Coolant conditioner out there that we are supposed to add to our fluid to fix it. Is that some sort of a bogus thing they are trying to sell us too. hmmm....???

thanks for you helpful comments. I will go ahead and get the regular gear oil then. I know about the head gasket issue. Unfortunately I bought his car at 126000 miles and have no idea what has been done to it as far as maintenance in the past. One big reason I am going through everything and changing all my fluids. It had a worn (no cracks, tears or anything like it) timing belt on it, which was either never change or recently changed. Going off of some pictures I posted on here, one mechanic suggested that someone may have done a head gasket on it early in its life. If you're interested, you can see the thread here http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=108388&highlight=ktdenali thread name is : Timing belt question (ktdenali) and the pictures here http://cid-5ffca51260a7352b.skydrive...7?uc=3&lc=1033 So I am hoping the head gaskets have been done. Since the problem is external leak, it is easy to spot, and there is absolutely not "wet" spots on the engine. My cooling fluid is consistently as the same level, at least at this point. No leaks. But I am keeping my eyes on it. One thing I have not figured out yet is why my temperature gauge fluctuates a little bit going uphill on interstate. It should be rock solid.

I have been researching different options on gear oil to put in my 5 speed manual transmission and rear dif. EJ252, 2000 Subaru Legacy Outback It is no question to use 75W90, but does anyone recommend any certain brands? Synthetic or regular? I have to say gear oil is kind of expensive, anywhere from $6-$15 per quart. I have been looking at the Valvoline High Performance 75W90 at Carquest, which does not say it is synthetic, and the more expansive one, Valvoline SynPower 75W90 (almost twice as much). Should I use synthetic (more expansive lubricant) or the cheaper kind. I assume the cheaper kind is mineral oil, which is why it's cheaper. Does anyone have any good advice here?

Got the timing belt changed on Monday. The Subaru mechanics here said they cannot tell if a belt is old or new, by pictures or even by looking at it. Only by miles. Unless of course there is obvious wear and tear. The belt we took out did not look bad at all, but since we have no idea how many miles it ran, we changed it anyway. Interestingly the only things they changed were one idler, nothing else. Nothing like the list people have been giving me. I guess all other, pulleys, waterpump etc just did not have any signs of too much wear, abuse or leaks. They helped me keep the cost low I guess, by only changing what was necessary. ($237 - TB, Alternator Belt, idler + labor) One thing we found interesting, and NOT good. After we took the old belt off, and putting the new on one, we noticed the timing was off 2 notches. How strange, that it even ran. The engine seems fine, no issues, so I am gonna have to keep looking it over and changing fluids and stuff. Next on the agenda will be changing the transmission and rear differential fluid. Book recommends, 75W90. Any particular brand recommended? I found that grade of gear oil I need, at WAlmart, the cheapest, but I do not know if I trust SuperTech, Walmart's own brand. that is all they had in that viscosity. ???

well shoot!!! Speaking of cooling fluid flush. Reading the Chilton manual, I did not realize there were two drain plugs on the engine block. Duuuhhhhh! That is why NOT all my fluid drained out. Other guys were telling me to just have it level ground and it will all come out, just takes time. I might have to do that all over again, now that I have two different, old and new, cooling fluids in there. "trial by error" wonder if this could be the cause of the temperature gauge fluctuation when driving uphill?!?!?

well shoot!!! Speaking of cooling fluid flush. Reading the Chilton manual, I did not realize there were two drain plugs on the engine block. Duuuhhhhh! That is why NOT all my fluid drained out. Other guys were telling me to just have it level ground and it will all come out, just takes time. I might have to do that all over again, now that I have two different, old and new, cooling fluids in there. "trial by error"

"nipper" I bought the Outback for 2 reasons #1 'cause of its higher clearance. #2 it was a 5 speed - realy hard to come by. Got tired of bottoming out, as I do a lot of driving in the mountains and dirt roads.:-\ "grossgary" when I bought it i checked the fluids. The cooling fluid was nice looking but not quite good enough for our weather only testing for about +5 F. So I drained it out, but not all came out. I thought the entire cooling fluid capacity was 5 qts, but I only got about 3.5 qt when it stopped dripping. Unfortunately, no I do not have fancy tools to flush it out with, so some must have got left in the hoses.The car was on level ground. Then I flushed it with distilled water and filled it back up with Prestone 50/50, which tests for -20F Here is the kicker - it does not have a bleeding screw. My '96 Legacy did, so I was expecting to use it on this one. Could not find it, so I asked a Subaru mechanic and he said they no longer have them on the 2000s. Too bad. It is kind of fool proof, because the air bubbles out when the engine gets warm, in the overflow tank. Which I actually saw, you just have to make sure to fill it up to level. All my fluids seem consistent as of now, not loosing anything anywhere. I never heard of the Subaru additive, where do I get that? I did think it was strange that the temperature gauge fluctuated, as my '96 was solid. This has a EJ252 engine ( at least written on top of the motor) but it says EJ251 in the Owner's Manual. I assume to believe the motor tag.

I was talking 5 speed. I do not like driving anything automatic (glitch of being from Europe - also wish they had Subaru diesels here too) What you say makes complete sense. That is why the automatics have the fuse on top of the engine to turn off AWD, which some call "fix" the viscous problem, by just driving 2WD.

it's going in the shop Monday and we're gonna get at least the TB, as well as look at all the rest of the gadgets. You made a good point, saying maybe it was done early with something else major, which is why it would look as it does now. Speaking of head gaskets, that is another thing I wish I knew if they were done or not beforehand. I suppose there is no way to tell that, unless at one point it starts to over heat on me. So far it has been great. The only thing I noticed on uphill climb (interstate driving in Montana) that the engine temperature gauge goes up just a little more than the half mark, and then comes right back down. My old '96 Legacy Wagon 2.2 engine - did not do that at all. Boy that was a great car. 28-33 mpg, while the Outback has been 22-26 mpg

my current milage is 130,000. if that belt looks significantly worn then the previous owner must not have done the 100,000 mile belt change, because if he has, it is only 30,000 miles old and should not look so worn. I am confused!

Thanks for all your comments. Again, very very helpful for someone like me, who wishes to know much about mechanics , but doesn't. I drove the car 3000 miles since I first got it. got my oil changed yestreday It has not used any oil whatsoever, I think. Did not notice any leaks, and I check my oil every week or so. I thought the belts were 60,000 mile-life too, but the first scheduled timing belt change is at 100,000 in the book. So maybe the original one has a longer life or something. I think I will take it to my usual mechanic, and I can only hope he uses good Subaru parts, not trash stuff from local autoparts stores. When he did my wife's '94 Subaru Legacy Sedan, he put a charge of $85 for timing belt. He also did R & L cam seals ($40) front crank seal ($20) Oil pump o-ring (10) TB ($85) TB idler pully ($28) something else TB (cannot read his writing $36) Valve cover kit ($45) 1 qt of oil ($3 - when oil was down to $2/qt in the store:-) and $150 for 2.5 hours of labor so $417 total

Any particular place you get your parts from? Do we need to be picky about parts? What am I looking at for cost on all these gadgets, if I do the whole shabang? this is one place I have been looking at https://www.chaplinssubarugenuineparts.com/oe_parts_cat.html There is a very good Subaru mechanic where I live, who does great work for a reasonable price. But last time I went to him, changed an O2 sensor, he got the part from Carquest next to him. I could have done that myself, but the reason I went to him 'cause I thought he would be using Subaru OE parts. Everybody said O2 sensors are very picky parts and we need to use originals. Seems like its a matter of personal opinion.

see, I am not even sure what all should be done along with a TB. Actually, I do have a Chilton's manual, which may give me a list.

I will wait for a few more comments, especially the one guy who asked to see it. I have never done a timing belt, and hear it takes quiet a but of mechanical knowledge, as well as the same time a bunch of other things get replaced. According to the dealer (just a plain car dealer not Subaru specific) I bought it from, it had a 100,000 mile service done by the previous owner. Whatever that means, if he was even telling the truth. So that TB can be 30,000 miles young, which is not that old. So I need some more opinions on those pictures. Thanks for the comments, helpful for novice.

here some of the pictures I took of the timing belt. "grossgary" - you've asked to see them. I was only able to do it as a url link, NOT as attachments. USMB says they no longer do attachments, for it is too expansive for them to be the host. please follow the link, and you should see the pics. thanks for your help http://cid-5ffca51260a7352b.skydrive.live.com/browse.aspx/November%2017?uc=3&lc=1033

"nipper" thanks for your advice. I did not see any oil leaks at all, in fact all around the portion of TB I saw looked clean. When I say I bought it from a dealer, I do not mean a specific Subaru dealer. It was a car dealership who happened to have a SUbaru, that actually came from an auction. So who knows where it has been. It sure looks like it's in good shape (cosmetics-wise), but I know nothing about its engine. I am gonna try to post some pics of the TB if I figure out how.

"grossgary" thanks again for your replay. I would love to post some pics but still have not figured out how. Working on it. As for the oil on the plugs. They did not look to bad at all, and it has been doing a lot of city driving, in the Montana cold, and short distances (such as 5 minutes to the gym once a day). My dad actually guessed the same, so thanks for seconding his opinion. I was already looking into replacing the valve cover gasket, but it may not be necessary. The TB's teeth also looked good to me, not just the writing, but I have not seen a new one, so..... I will try and post pictures if I can figure that out. Thanks again

Thanks for you all you posts. "i_subi" I did what you said and inspected the timing belt. It was easy, and I think it looks great. I saw no cracks, or even wear. The writing is still on there (SUBARU....), which makes me think it maybe newer then. I took many pictures and I would love to post them, but have no idea how, in this forum. I tried inserting img, but it comes up and a url, whatever that means, I do not know much about that side of computers. Anyway, I also just recently changed the oil, and whoever did that before me put too much in there. I think. Looks like almost 5 qts, instead of the required 4.2. I am surprised it did not get whipped. Also changed the spark plugs, and put new (copper core) Champion RC10YC4 plugs in there, what the book recommended. The ones I pulled out were NGK, probably platinum - not sure. The old ones I pulled out did not look too bad, but the threads were covered in oil, which is a red flag isn't it? Could be a lot of things. If it is not one thing, then another. We shall see how the car performs now, on milage and cold start up. My milage has been bad (22-24). I am used to 30-33 with a 96 Legacy with the 2.2 engine. I have not changed the spark plug wires yet, and contemplating not to, as they look just fine, no cracks, or zaps coming out through the wires. Should I change those too? What is the best brand to use (NGK)? Again, thanks for all your help. This is a great forum. If someone tells me how to post pics I will post the pictures of the TB.

Thanks for you all you posts. "grossgary" I did what you said and inspected the timing belt. It was easy, and I think it looks great. I saw no cracks, or even wear. The writing is still on there (SUBARU....), which makes me think it maybe newer then. I took many pictures and I would love to post them, but have no idea how, in this forum. I tried inserting img, but it comes up and a url, whatever that means, I do not know much about that side of computers. Anyway, I also just recently changed the oil, and whoever did that before me put too much in there. I think. Looks like almost 5 qts, instead of the required 4.2. I am surprised it did not get whipped. Also changed the spark plugs, and put new (copper core) Champion RC10YC4 plugs in there, what the book recommended. The ones I pulled out were NGK, probably platinum - not sure. The old ones I pulled out did not look too bad, but the threads were covered in oil, which is a red flag isn't it? Could be a lot of things. If it is not one thing, then another. We shall see how the car performs now, on milage and cold start up. My milage has been bad (22-24). I am used to 30-33 with a 96 Legacy with the 2.2 engine. I have not changed the spark plug wires yet, and contemplating not to, as they look just fine, no cracks, or zaps coming out through the wires. Should I change those too? What is the best brand to use (NGK)? Again, thanks for all your help. This is a great forum. If someone tells me how to post pics I will post the pictures of the TB.

I just bought a 2000 Subaru Outback, 5 speed, 126000 miles. The dealer could not tell me any maintenance history at all, other than he thought it had a 100,000 mile tune up/scheduled maintenance. He seemed like one of those dealers who either had no clue or he only lied when he lips were moving just to make a sale. Well I got it for it is in great shape and took a long time to find one with a manual tranny. I am not a mechanic, only know a few things in theory and can do basics in practice. Does anybody know if there is a way to find out if the timing belt had been changed without taking the whole thing apart? I have a Chilton's manual, and according to that inspection looks complicated. Remove and then inspect. I'd rather not pay a mechanic to tear it apart to find out the belt was recently done. Any ideas???? Also, when I test drove it the engine was already warm and acted normal. At that time did not think much about that. As soon as I had it at home the first start ups in the mornings seem a little rough, until the engine warms up. At first it almost sounds clunky on acceleration until the engine gets warmer. Kind of like if the engine was low on oil and the pistons were crying for oil BUT my oil level is just fine. I am very used to the sound of a '96 Legacy, with the 2.2 engine - so quiet. This car almost sounds like a diesel at first. Thanks a bunch if anybody has ideas, I would appreciate the help.

Do either of you know when Subaru swtiched from viscous coupler to the electronic system? I have a 96 legacy, in which the VC is shot. Quit at 230000 miles. Just bought an Outback 2000 and was wondering if i can expect similar problems with it, or does it have a different sysyterm in the AWD?