RJC

I bought my wife a brand new 2005 Subaru Outback (basic model) one year ago. The car has 19,500 miles on it. This is her fifth Subaru, as she has owned only Subarus in the last 20 years. I present this question because it involves the EXACT situation that existed when she owned her last Subaru--a 2000 Legacy wagon-- except for the timing of the event. I'll explain. Her 2000 Legacy (which she traded in as the automatic transmission went at 140,000) started to emit a smell of antifreeze beginning when it had about 60,000 miles on it. She would park the car in the garage and I would smell a strong odor of antifreeze coming from under the hood. However, I would never see any antifreeze! I commented to her though, on a regular basis that there was something wrong with her car. I brought it to the Subaru dealer and was told that the head was NOT cracked nor was the seal leaking. Yet, the smell continued, and I KNEW there was a major problem. That went on for months. Finally, months later, when the car had 90,000 on it I received a defect notice in the mail stating that there was an antifreeze problem in the 2000 legacy model that required us to bring the vehicle to the dealer to get "repaired" (i.e. have a bottle of special solution added to the cooling system). The engine warranty was increased to 1000,000 miles according to the notice. ******So, I come to this present issue having had that prior experience. Now, the same thing is happening, but rather than smelling the antifreeze odor (it is DEFINITELY an antifreeze odor!) at a time when the car has been driven tens of thousands of miles, it began as soon as the car had no more than 1,000 miles on it!! On four--maybe five, occasions I have brought the car to the dealer where it was purchased and informed them of the strong smell of the antifreeze. That was my only "complaint" when I brought the car in the first two times, but I also mentioned that oncoming issue each occasion when the car was brought in for other matters. Each time I mentioned this issue to the dealer they would say that there is no leak and the smell that I smell is normal. The first three times I brought it in--when the car had less than 10,000 miles, I was told that "those are new car smells as there are many chemicals on and around the engine that take a great deal of time to burn away". Naturally, I did not believe that. I have a new 2005 car (a different make), I've had other brand new cars, and I’ve been around many, many brand new cars 2while being operated and I’ve never smelled antifreeze or other "chemicals that take time to burn away". Now I realize that except for the first time I brought the car into the dealer, my repair orders have NEVER had anything stated on them to reflect the fact that I had complained of am antifreeze smell coming from under the hood! They simply failed (for some reason) to note on the repair order the antifreeze issue. So, if I brought the car in for an oil change, and at that time said, I am still smelling a strong antifreeze odor I thing there really is a problem, please look into it, I would get the repair order back stating "oil change" and nothing about the antifreeze issue, other than a personal comment at the time of payment that "there is nothing wrong with the engine, the smell is normal". Well, the smell is NOT normal!! I should not be continually smelling a distinct odor of antifreeze coming from the car either while it is running (standing outside the car, not inside), or after parking it and getting out. However, there really is no evidence of antifreeze leaks, so I am mystified. This is exactly what happened with the 2000 legacy, except this is happening to the 2005 from the outset whereas the 2000 didn't manifest the problem until about 60,000 miles or so. So, of all you forum members who are experts on Subarus, I ask, "What in the world is going on here?" And I have really NO evidence that this has been a continuing issue, as the dealer never provided any record of my having expressed this concern on each of the many occasions I brought the car into the shop! I don't like the situation, and I am positive that something is not right, but I don't know what! The dealer keeps saying "it's normal", or it's "just the new car smell", or "it's the chemicals burning off and it takes a real long time for all of them to burn away". Well, I don't believe that, it's that simple! Any help from you forum members will be sincerely appreciated. Thanks, RJC

Thanks for the advise. However, I do not know that I can agree, respectfully, with your statement that this is uncommon, as I've discovered many others who have also had transmission problems. I guess only subaru knows the real numbers, as it is the one that is contacted (usually) by the complaining consumers, like me and my wife.

You got that right!! Just like subaru's automatic transmissions--inherently less reliable. I just posted an item about our 2000 Legacy L Wagon whose automatic transmission has failed at 90,000. One owner/driver, driven by a 50 year old woman who drives according to the actual speed limits all the time, and on tar roads only! And who had the transmission flushed at 60,000. Subaru's reply to our complaint? Sorry, things happen. There is no latent defect, we don't know what you are talking about. A three-time Subaru purchasers has to deal with this problem, and this type of response. Go figure. I told my wife she should by a Hyundai, at least they are confident that their engines and transmission are built to last and stand behind them for 100,000 miles!! QUESTION: Why doesn't Subaru provide a 100,000 mile engine and transmission warranty? And I have not even discussed the problems with the head and head gasket. I smelled antifreeze when my wife would drive the car into the garage. It had about 82,000 miles. I told her I thought there was a problem. But I didn't see any leakes, so I let it go. Two weeks later I recived the recall concerning the head gasket leaks. Took in the car. they put in the addative that was required and said that the defect had not caused any engine problems. Now the car has 97,000 miles on iot. I have again smelled the antifreeze from the engine area when she pulls into the garage. The engine was tuned up by the Subaru dealer several months ago. When she starts the car and begins driving in the morning the engine "shutters severly" making a shaking sensation. I discussed this with the dealer at the time the tune up was done. His reply? Yes, the 2000 Subarus have engines that shanke and shutter more than usual. My take on this is that there is some problem interanlly but whcih they do not want to reveal--it's just not "the way the 2000 Subaru engine behaves". DISGUSTED

My wife has a 2000 Legacy L Wagon she bought new (**Just made the last payment this month!) It has 92,000 miles and the transmission now has developed sever delay between gear changes (Reverse to Drive, Drive to Reverse). And now, the problem is so bad that when she is stopped at a light with the automatic transmission still in drive, the car will not move when she pushes on the gas pedal when the light changes to green. She has to keep pushing on the gas pedal several times before it finally catches gear. She is the only owner and driver of the car. Just to emphasize her driving style, let me stress that in 30 years of driving she has never been in an accident and has NEVER had a speeding ticket, or any moving violations!! We changed the transmission fluid at 62,000 miles (transmission flush). The dealer says there is a problem. I called Subaru USA to complain that this should not be happening under the circumstances. Spoke to the area factory representative. He says, "well, things happen". Imagine that response, "...things happen"? Basically Subaru's response is "...sorry, but....". This is her third Subaru. The factory rep told me yesterday that "Subaru has not had very many problems with customers of 2000 Legacys needing automatic transmission replacements. Then, I check here, and other sites and found that there are a significant number of 2000 legacy owners who have also complained of early transmission failures. Just as I told the rep, there MUST be some design flaw with the transmission--a latent defect--that exists prior to the 60,000 mile warranty, but which does not manifest itself until a late date when the symptoms become noticeable to the average driver. In short, the defect is latent and exists early in the car's usage (maybe even at the time of manufacture!!), but the nature of the defect is such that it becomes apparent only after extended use (unless a transmission expert actually took apart the transmission say at 30,000 miles and could actually see the defect, it would not be noticed by the consumer). I explained that to the rep. His response? "Well, it may actually be a latent defect, but I don't see how you could prove it". Nothing like really caring about a loyal, three-time purchaser of your product!! What more can I say, I think you know what I think, and how we fell about this. So much for the "rough and tough" image of the Subaru. And we didn't even drive it on dirt roads, over bumps and in the rough terrain--you know, like in the commercials that are made to express how rugged, tough, and well-built the Subaru vehicles really are. SURE!!!! Have any of you had this transmission problem? Do you know whether many others have? (****PLEASE, no Subaru employees need reply, I am interested in honest, unbiased, replies from real Subaru owners/users) Thanks

My wife has a 2000 Legacy L Wagon she bought new (**Just made the last payment this month!) It has 92,000 miles and the transmission now has developed sever delay between gear changes (Reverse to Drive, Drive to Reverse). And now, the problem is so bad that when she is stopped at a light with the automatic transmission still in drive, the car will not move when she pushes on the gas pedal when the light changes to green. She has to keep pushing on the gas pedal several times before it finally catches gear. She is the only owner and driver of the car. Just to emphasize her driving style, let me stress that in 30 years of driving she has never been in an accident and has NEVER had a speeding ticket, or any moving violations!! We changed the transmission fluid at 62,000 miles (transmission flush). The dealer says there is a problem. I called Subaru USA to complain that this should not be happening under the circumstances. Spoke to the area factory representative. He says, "well, things happen". Imagine that response, "...things happen"? Basically Subaru's response is "...sorry, but....". This is her third Subaru. The factory rep told me yesterday that "Subaru has not had very many problems with customers of 2000 Legacys needing automatic transmission replacements. Then, I check here, and other sites and found that there are a significant number of 2000 legacy owners who have also complained of early transmission failures. Just as I told the rep, there MUST be some design flaw with the transmission--a latent defect--that exists prior to the 60,000 mile warranty, but which does not manifest itself until a late date when the symptoms become noticeable to the average driver. In short, the defect is latent and exists early in the car's usage (maybe even at the time of manufacture!!), but the nature of the defect is such that it becomes apparent only after extended use (unless a transmission expert actually took apart the transmission say at 30,000 miles and could actually see the defect, it would not be noticed by the consumer). I explained that to the rep. His response? "Well, it may actually be a latent defect, but I don't see how you could prove it". Nothing like really caring about a loyal, three-time purchaser of your product!! What more can I say, I think you know what I think, and how we fell about this. So much for the "rough and tough" image of the Subaru. And we didn't even drive it on dirt roads, over bumps and in the rough terrain--you know, like in the commercials that are made to express how rugged, tough, and well-built the Subaru vehicles really are. SURE!!!! Have any of you had this transmission problem? Do you know whether many others have? (****PLEASE, no Subaru employees need reply, I am interested in honest, unbiased, replies from real Subaru owners/users) Thanks