outback_97 Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 This is kinda long. This weekend I replaced my OB's struts and springs with an enthusiastic but somewhat green mechanic... and I know about 10% of what he does, so you can see where this is going. Note the correct order when reassembling the struts is parts 20, 19, 18 as shown in the diagram. It seems we put them on 19, 20, 18 (19 and 20 switched). I can see the spacer at the top of the strut shaft as it enters the upper spring seat. My mechanic acquaintance (I just met the kid the day we did this) swears that was the order they were in when we took it apart. I think what happened is there was a slight amount of tension still in the spring when he took the nut off the end of the strut, everything popped off and the parts got scrambled around. In any event, have I already done damage to the upper spring seat, strut, or strut mount (or anything else) by driving it like this? It's been driven around 30 miles in the current state. I'm going to try to get them back in the right order ASAP, then I really need any alignment. In summary: 1) Can anyone verify the diagram above is indeed correct and I do need to take the thing back apart and reassemble? And the spacer goes in tapered side up correct? 2) What damage could be done by swapping parts 19 and 20? 3) Should I be allowed near a wrench and a Subaru again Thanks USMB! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frag Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 The only effect I can see is that the spring preload will be slightly less (proportionnal to the spacer's depth). If you feel no ill effects on the way the car handles over bumps, I woud'nt worry about it. Just an opinion though. Wait to see if a strut expert will chime in. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zack Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 This weekend I replaced my OB's struts and springs with an enthusiastic but somewhat green mechanic... I don't care how enthusiasic he is, isn't he going get pretty tired of holding up the front end of your car after a few months? (Sorry, couldn't resist. Best of luck getting your struts figured out. I'd love to replace the struts on my '90 Legacy -- I'm still running on the orginals after 165,000 miles -- but I lack the courage to even consider doing the job myself, and it's hard to justify paying more than what the car is probably worth in order to have the job done professionally.) Zack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LosDiosDeVerde86 Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 I don't care how enthusiasic he is, isn't he going get pretty tired of holding up the front end of your car after a few months? (Sorry, couldn't resist. Best of luck getting your struts figured out. I'd love to replace the struts on my '90 Legacy -- I'm still running on the orginals after 165,000 miles -- but I lack the courage to even consider doing the job myself, and it's hard to justify paying more than what the car is probably worth in order to have the job done professionally.) Zack see if you can them preloaded from monroe or something. that way it's just 5 bolts in and out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 On some cars that spacer is critical. The part on top is the bearing that allows the strut to turn. The spacer keeps enough clearance and loads the bearing in the right spot. I have heard of folks doing this on a BMW and having a grinding sound. If it was my car I would put it in correctly, but this is your car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a97obw Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 The upper strut mount contains a ball bearing where the strut goes through it. When you turn the steering wheel, the struts turn as well. The spacer is needed as a "bearing" between the upper spring seat and the upper strut mount. As far as which way the taper goes, I can't say that I remember when I replaced mine on my 97 OBW. You might be able to tell by wear marks on the parts. But I would definitely get it reassembled according to the diagram. NOTE: It is also a good practice to extend and compress the strut with your hand a few times before you assemble it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frag Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 Reading the subsequent replies, I must admit I was wrong. I did all four struts on my car two years ago but honestly dont remember the exact details. If that spacer is tapered it must be for a reason and that reason must be to make a point of contact between the strut seat and the strut mount so that contact and pressure only applies to the inner part of the ball bearing (the part that moves). So it means the tapered part must go on top and in contact with the mount. There would be no reason to install it the other way. With the spacer under the spring seat instead of on top of it, it's possible for the spring seat to rub against the outer part of the ball bearing (part that does'nt move) thus damaging the seat and the bearing in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 Every one I've seen has the taper as the top as Frag says. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outback_97 Posted May 8, 2006 Author Share Posted May 8, 2006 You guys rock On my lunch break I took the front right one out and got it reassembled correctly... took me about an hour, not bad for such a rookie. Helps to have done it four times two days ago. Oh, and air tools >> socket wrenches for the spring compressors Indeed it seems to make much more sense now, things turn freely, and I think my car will be much happier. Spacer = taper on the top as you guys confirmed. I wish I had been more assertive and a little less trusting when I was working with the guy this weekend and assuming he was doing it right. Oh well, that's how we learn. I don't think I did any serious damage to the components. I am reinstalling the OEM top cam bolt (#26 above) in the top spot and putting an Ingalls cam bolt in the bottom setting for additional camber adjustment to compensate for my Scorpion springs (2" taller). Hopefully the alignment shop will be able to get things set up well with that. When 5:00 rolls around I'll do the other side, I hope it goes as smoothly. I have keys to one of our company trucks if I screw anything up and can't drive my car home. Finagling the strut assembly in and out of the wheel well is a pain with only two hands, that's the only tricky part really. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 That is kind of a pain to hold it up while you get the bolts in. I usually get one top nut on to hold it up and then put the bottom in. Once I have that held in by a bolt I put the rest of the nuts on the top. Sometimes you can hold it up with a jack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outback_97 Posted May 9, 2006 Author Share Posted May 9, 2006 Update: My car is no longer borked I think that it would have damaged something had I continued to drive it incorrectly installed. The upper spring mount on one side was a little teeny bit tweaked... I used my precision machinists 24 oz framing hammer to solve that. But now, it tracks straight... the steering wheel is correctly aligned... it doesn't make unhappy noises when turning around... doesn't pull to either side after sharp turns... all is well! Thanks USMB! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorch Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 it's hard to justify paying more than what the car is probably worth in order to have the job done professionally. Why do you say that? There are a lot of scenarios where it would make perfect sense to pay more than the kelly blue book value of a car on a major repair item, if you intend to keep the car on the road for a long time, and especially if the repair in question (such as struts) effects its safety on the road. Cars are transportation expense items. They aren't "investments." (If you think of a car as an "investment," you get an F for financial smarts - I've got a bridge to sell you if you think a rapidly depreciating asset is an "investment"). It's usually not smart to consider the resale value unless you otherwise are considering selling it anyway. What does the kelly blue book value of a car have anything to do with anything? The more logical question to ask yourself is this: for the price of this repair, could I buy a car that is as good or better than this car will be after the repair? If the answer is no (and it usually is), then it's usually smarter to go ahead and get the repair done and keep you perfectly good car on the road. Unless, of course, you are using the whole issue just to "justify" spending gobs of money on something newer so you can have the new car smell and ego gratification. But that's a different issue entirely.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamal Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 You guys rock Finagling the strut assembly in and out of the wheel well is a pain with only two hands, that's the only tricky part really. Steve heh, especially when you do what I did the first time and forget to disconnect the brake line first. I was worried about the tapered washer until I took everything apart. Then it doesn't make sense to me any other way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zack Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 Why do you say that? There are a lot of scenarios where it would make perfect sense to pay more than the kelly blue book value of a car on a major repair item, if you intend to keep the car on the road for a long time, and especially if the repair in question (such as struts) effects its safety on the road.[snip] The more logical question to ask yourself is this: for the price of this repair, could I buy a car that is as good or better than this car will be after the repair? If the answer is no (and it usually is), then it's usually smarter to go ahead and get the repair done and keep you perfectly good car on the road. Unless, of course, you are using the whole issue just to "justify" spending gobs of money on something newer so you can have the new car smell and ego gratification. But that's a different issue entirely.... Good points! My 1990 Legacy wagon is the perfect vehicle for its present use -- stored for several months at a time, used a few months a year for access to a pretty remote cabin. The car was inexpensive to buy, gets reasonable gas mileage, has AWD (potentially necessary for winter snow and spring mud) and has been (to date) completely reliable. On environmnetal grounds alone, I'd far prefer to keep it on the road as long as possible, rather than wasting the resources involved in getting a new car. The struts, though old, are still usable and I don't believe (nor does any mechanic who has looked at the car) that they currently represent any safety issue. I guess what I meant to say was that if the car were newer, or if I used it more regularly, I'd go ahead and spend the money to replace them. Given the car's age and infrequent use, I'll try to get by as long as I can on the old ones and postpone the decision to buy new ones as long as safely possible! Zack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 Zack, When you replace your battery consider a deep cycle marine. Boats have much the same use type you do. You might also look into a wind or sun trickel charger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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