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Need help installing neutral switch with auto harness


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18 replies to this topic

#1 CWP8

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Posted 23 January 2014 - 05:59 PM

Ok so I swapped my brat and there is an idle problem. I have confirmation from a Subaru mechanic that it is the neutral switch not being installed. I am curious what is the best way to install one? I have one, but I need to know what pins to attach it to. Do I put it on the tranny computer harness or what? i tried to wire it like a manual and the wires completely burned of their coating. :banghead:



#2 Scooner

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Posted 23 January 2014 - 11:32 PM

What is your idle problem?

#3 CWP8

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 12:14 AM

About 90% of the time it bounces between 500-1200 rpm, rather annoying and is kinda hurting my mileage. 



#4 nipper

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 12:50 AM

What did you swap with what?



#5 CWP8

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 12:17 PM

Ej frankenmotor



#6 nipper

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 12:24 PM

Was the donor hardware from an automatic or manual. It really can be as simple as just jumping/gounding the NSS terminals. Also the car should have a NSS in it to use.  



#7 CWP8

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 01:09 PM

The harness is from an auto and I have a switch i picked up at the junkyard. I had installed it as a manual would be and the wires basically caught fire.



#8 nipper

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 07:07 PM

hrmm, i would look on the Yahoo group for the subaru VW van conversions i thihnk they have a work around for it



#9 Gloyale

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 01:23 PM

Was the donor hardware from an automatic or manual. It really can be as simple as just jumping/gounding the NSS terminals. Also the car should have a NSS in it to use.  

 

No Neutral switch in Brat

 

The harness is from an auto and I have a switch i picked up at the junkyard. I had installed it as a manual would be and the wires basically caught fire.

 

Hmmm......No something is wrong.  There is no issue wiring an auto to a manual.

 

Let's get some basic info.

 

 

Year and model of Harness? (this will help us confirm you are using the correct pin)

 

Model of trans installed? If you swapped a 5spd you might have a Nuetral switch in the trans already.

 

And where did you hook up "a switch from the junkyard"  becasue there is nowhere to "add" a nuetral switch.  Did you get a Clutch switch?  and if so did you get the one for the Cruise control (Normally closed) or one for the starter lockout (normally open)?

 

 

 

 

 



#10 nipper

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 02:05 PM

You may want to get an Ecu from a manual tranny car



#11 Gloyale

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 08:53 PM

You may want to get an Ecu from a manual tranny car

 

That isn't nessecary.

 

Older ECU's you can tell them to be either by grounding a pin.  Newer ones simply wire it to think it's in gear with the clutch out, i.e "not in nuetral or park" and with clutch in to think it's in park. 

 

If the OP will post year and model of ECU....I can tell him excactly which pins to tap and ground

 

If you also have a correct VSS installed it should work fine.



#12 CWP8

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 11:20 PM

No Neutral switch in Brat

 

 

Hmmm......No something is wrong.  There is no issue wiring an auto to a manual.

 

Let's get some basic info.

 

 

Year and model of Harness? (this will help us confirm you are using the correct pin)

 

Model of trans installed? If you swapped a 5spd you might have a Nuetral switch in the trans already.

 

And where did you hook up "a switch from the junkyard"  becasue there is nowhere to "add" a nuetral switch.  Did you get a Clutch switch?  and if so did you get the one for the Cruise control (Normally closed) or one for the starter lockout (normally open)?

 

I believe it is a late model 95 Forester Auto(not quite sure harness was laying around my friends shop for a year or two).

 

5 spd Tranny im not sure i bought it from a friend of a friend but i do i know there is no neutral switch on the tranny

 
Now for the switch I removed the top bolt on the clutch pedal put the switch in its place. I saw that done to another brat at the same time i was swapping my brat the only difference was the harness for that brat was out of a 96 legacy 5spd.
 
The switch was off of the clutch on a 97 outback and its the starter lockout.

 

You may want to get an Ecu from a manual tranny car

 

ECU was the same for my harness and the 96 legacy 5spd

 

That isn't nessecary.

 

Older ECU's you can tell them to be either by grounding a pin.  Newer ones simply wire it to think it's in gear with the clutch out, i.e "not in nuetral or park" and with clutch in to think it's in park. 

 

If the OP will post year and model of ECU....I can tell him excactly which pins to tap and ground

 

If you also have a correct VSS installed it should work fine.

 

I used the pin out from the 96 legacy book, beings that it was the same computer. I have the VSS tied in to the back of my instrument cluster where the cruise control sensor would normally tie in and it reads accurately.

 

The brat with the 96 harness had the same problem as mine, with the same set up, and was fixed with the switch. So if we're going by the 96 harness diagrams, could I run a jumper wire from the Blue-red starter wire to pin 86 and just bypass it?



#13 Gloyale

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 01:16 AM

I believe it is a late model 95 Forester Auto(not quite sure harness was laying around my friends shop for a year or two).

 

Well......Not sure bout that one.....Forresters didn't start til '98.....and all of them had the Phase II trans......and how does that have anything to do with the ECU from the 96 you mention and 96 5spd????

 

If the ECU is a 95 legacy it will have a connector that matches 96 harness, but different pins completely.....you need an ECU that matches the harness.

 

  IS you're 5spd a dual range EA box?  Do you have an adapter plate?  IF no to either of these you DO have a nuetral switch in the trans.   But this is side line.....see below

 

 

The brat with the 96 harness had the same problem as mine, with the same set up, and was fixed with the switch. So if we're going by the 96 harness diagrams, could I run a jumper wire from the Blue-red starter wire to pin 86 and just bypass it?

 

This is your problem.. Your confusing the Nuetral switch circuit with the Starter lockout circuit.  Which would explain frying the wire if you give it 12V during start up.  Or if you are grounding the starter signal wire......IDK....not sure exccactly what you have done.

 

Starter lockout circuit has nothing to do with ECU other than for the Signal to ECU upon start up.

 

Neutral switch is completely differnent.......You are trying to fool the computer to see that the clutch switch being depressed is like shifting into Nuetral (or P) with the automatic.  Understand???

 

Nuetral switch should be a Brown/yellow wire if IIRC.

 

IIRC  Starter signal wire will be Red/yellow if Harness and ECU are from auto car, Blue/red from manual.  Starter signal wire gets very large gauge shortly after the ECU plug.



#14 nipper

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 11:39 AM

Glad someone else was getting confused too

 

Neutral safety switch is called a inhibitor switch (on the automatics). 

 

According to this post http://www.subaruout...nual-trans.html  (since it is the OB forum i will post the last thread here)

 

"Just recently bought a neutral safety switch for my 98 Outback manual trans. So yes they do have them. I was having an erratic idle and hesitation at constant speeds. It seemed to help."

 

I dont know if that applies to this situation, but since we are not sure what we have here. Can someone decode the S?N on the transmission to see what we have?



#15 CWP8

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 10:20 PM

Ok well i have no clue for sure what years of harness i have but the same exact computer that came with the 96 legacy (It says 8D in big letters) and worked when I plug it into the other harness for the manual, so they are the same computers. All i need to know is where to place a jump wire or something. I want this to be an easy fix. i just want it to run correctly. Lets go back to basics.

 

I Have an auto harness computer 8D

EA82 D/R No neutral switch on tranny



#16 Gloyale

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 01:10 PM

Ok well i have no clue for sure what years of harness i have but the same exact computer that came with the 96 legacy (It says 8D in big letters) and worked when I plug it into the other harness for the manual, so they are the same computers. All i need to know is where to place a jump wire or something. I want this to be an easy fix. i just want it to run correctly. Lets go back to basics.

 

I Have an auto harness computer 8D

EA82 D/R No neutral switch on tranny

 

And what about the Neutral switch you installed?  you mean a clutch switch.  You really need the one for the Cruise control that is open

 

 

Start there.  Check the switch for continuity when depressed.....should be OPEN....no continuity. You need to mount the switch in the hole where it will be depressed when clutch is out. 

 

Then wire one side of the switch to ground.....wire the other end to the neutral switch wire....which should be Brown/yellow IIRC  loooking for the pin chart now.

 

This setup will Ground the wire telling ECU you're in "Nuetral" when the clutch is depressed.   Hook the big Blue/red wire to the starter circuit....not to the Neutral switch.



#17 CWP8

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 04:46 PM

That's how i originally had installed it and it melted the coating off of the wire within about 15 seconds.



#18 Gloyale

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 12:06 PM

That's how i originally had installed it and it melted the coating off of the wire within about 15 seconds.

 

Somethings wrong then.  This shouldn't happen, the Neutral switch is supposed to connect that pin of the ECU to ground in neutral (same wire that grounds and lights the "N" light in the auto dash indicator)

 

Is it possible you are using a 95 harness with a 96 computer?  The connectors are the same, but the wiring color and location of pins are different.



#19 Gloyale

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 01:11 PM

If it's a 96 ECU......you need to Ground pin 81 to tell it to be M/T.

 

Might need to add a wire....on MT cars there is a BLack/red wire that hooks to this pin and connects to the web of grounds in the harness.

 

Pin 86 Blue/red wire (or Red/yellow on MT's) should connect to the starter solenoid signal wire.

 

Pin 82 is the neutral switch wire....should be connected through the switch to ground when clutch is depressed.

 

 

These 3 pins should not be connected to eachother in any way.


Edited by Gloyale, 31 January 2014 - 01:18 PM.





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