Jump to content


Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, my lurker friend!

Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, an unparalleled Subaru community full of the greatest Subaru gurus and modders on the planet! We offer technical information and discussion about all things Subaru, the best and most popular all wheel drive vehicles ever created.

We offer all this information for free to everyone, even lurkers like you! All we ask in return is that you sign up and give back some of what you get out - without our awesome registered users none of this would be possible! Plus, you get way more great stuff as a member! Lurk to lose, participate to WIN*!
  • Say hello and join the conversation
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get automatic updates
  • Get your own profile and make new friends
  • Classifieds with all sorts of Subaru goodies
  • Photo hosting in our gallery
  • Meet other cool people with cool cars
Seriously, what are you waiting for? Make your life more fulfilling and join today! You and your Subaru won't regret it, we guarantee** it.

* The joy of participation and being generally awesome constitutes winning
** Not an actual guarantee, but seriously, you probably won't regret it!

Serving the Subaru Community since May 18th, 1998!

Guest Message by DevFuse
 

Photo
- - - - -

Subaru's Response re Timing Belt Replacement


  • Please log in to reply
21 replies to this topic

#1 skelly

skelly

    New User

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 18 posts
  • rockville

Posted 16 December 2004 - 02:33 PM

Subies-
I sent an e-mail to Kelly Shinault of Subaru America and finally got a response to the following question-
What is the currently recommended mileage for timing belt replacement? Is this an "interfearence" engine?
I have a 1997 Impreza Wagon VIN JF1GF ..... Engine Family VFJ2.2VJGKEK (2.2 liters, SFI) Engine Type EJ22ECX6FZ.

Kelly's response "I have checked with a colleague of mine and your vehicle is a non-interference engine and your recommended interval for changing the timing belt is at 105,000 miles or months; whichever occurs first. .... You can even locate this information from Subaru.com!"

So I go to Subaru web page, look at Specifications for North America, and see Camshaft drive belt, 2.2L engine, replace at 60 and 120 Miles. If I go Specifications for CA, I see replace at 105 miles.

Subies - I'm still confused !! Help!

#2 coloradosubarules

coloradosubarules

    Banned

  • Banned
  • 870 posts
  • Port St. Lucie

Posted 16 December 2004 - 03:08 PM

From what I was told about the 2.2's it is highly reccomended that you replace the TB every 60K. Just a Rule of thumb. It's cheap insurance if you think about it.

#3 SevenSisters

SevenSisters

    Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 512 posts
  • Cleve/Akron Ohio

Posted 16 December 2004 - 07:55 PM

It's good to know YOU can find out on Subaru.com, but little KELLY had to check with a colleague. How's that for customer service. Maybe she doesn't have a mouse.

#4 svxpert

svxpert

    Certified Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 777 posts
  • East Coast

Posted 16 December 2004 - 09:02 PM

<<So I go to Subaru web page, look at Specifications for North America, and see Camshaft drive belt, 2.2L engine, replace at 60 and 120 Miles. If I go Specifications for CA, I see replace at 105 miles. Subies - I'm still confused !! Help!>>


here is a quick sum up of your dilema. your 97 Impreza wagon came from the factory with a 60,000 mile timing belt. if your car was made Cal-Spec (california specifications) it would come out with a 105,000 mile timing belt as per california laws for emmisions. being that you live on the east coast, your car is prob not cal-spec.

timing belts are now made for (about) 1996 and up to either be a 60,000 or a 105,000 for the impreza and legacy (sorry no SVX). when you come up next week for your service at my shop, i will put in a 105,000 belt so you will have an extended period until you need to change it again. hope this helps.

#5 tcspeer

tcspeer

    1000+ Super USER!

  • Members
  • 1,444 posts
  • Walnut Springs

Posted 16 December 2004 - 11:36 PM

My 1997 2.2 that was in my Legacy wagon was a interference engine. And I dont have to take anyones word for it. There was no compression on three of the four cyclinders when it was put back together after timing belt faliure due to idle pully coming apart.

#6 1993 Legacy

1993 Legacy

    USMB Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 39 posts
  • Budapest

Posted 17 December 2004 - 04:22 AM

Hi SVXPERT,

Can you please give the official parts numbers for both belts. I would like to change the timing belt on my 1993/1994 2.2 l station wagon automatic as it is coming to the 100,000 km threshold and it owuld help me greatly yo have the exact number to be able to order the RIGHT timing belt for my car.

Thanks a lot.

Best regards

Dusan



<<So I go to Subaru web page, look at Specifications for North America, and see Camshaft drive belt, 2.2L engine, replace at 60 and 120 Miles. If I go Specifications for CA, I see replace at 105 miles. Subies - I'm still confused !! Help!>>

Hi SVXPERT,

Can you please give the official parts numbers for both belts. I would like to change the timing belt on my 1993/1994 2.2 l station wagon automatic as it is coming to the 100,000 km threshold and it owuld help me greatly yo have the exact number to be able to order the RIGHT timing belt for my car.

Thanks a lot.

Best regards

Dusan




here is a quick sum up of your dilema. your 97 Impreza wagon came from the factory with a 60,000 mile timing belt. if your car was made Cal-Spec (california specifications) it would come out with a 105,000 mile timing belt as per california laws for emmisions. being that you live on the east coast, your car is prob not cal-spec.

timing belts are now made for (about) 1996 and up to either be a 60,000 or a 105,000 for the impreza and legacy (sorry no SVX). when you come up next week for your service at my shop, i will put in a 105,000 belt so you will have an extended period until you need to change it again. hope this helps.



#7 1993 Legacy

1993 Legacy

    USMB Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 39 posts
  • Budapest

Posted 17 December 2004 - 04:29 AM

Hi SVXPERT,

Can you please give the official parts numbers for both belts. I would like to change the timing belt on my 1993/1994 2.2 l station wagon automatic as it is coming to the 100,000 km threshold and it owuld help me greatly yo have the exact number to be able to order the RIGHT timing belt for my car.

Thanks a lot.

Best regards

Dusan



<<So I go to Subaru web page, look at Specifications for North America, and see Camshaft drive belt, 2.2L engine, replace at 60 and 120 Miles. If I go Specifications for CA, I see replace at 105 miles. Subies - I'm still confused !! Help!>>

Hi SVXPERT,

Can you please give the official parts numbers for both belts. I would like to change the timing belt on my 1993/1994 2.2 l station wagon automatic as it is coming to the 100,000 km threshold and it owuld help me greatly yo have the exact number to be able to order the RIGHT timing belt for my car.

Thanks a lot.

Best regards

Dusan




here is a quick sum up of your dilema. your 97 Impreza wagon came from the factory with a 60,000 mile timing belt. if your car was made Cal-Spec (california specifications) it would come out with a 105,000 mile timing belt as per california laws for emmisions. being that you live on the east coast, your car is prob not cal-spec.

timing belts are now made for (about) 1996 and up to either be a 60,000 or a 105,000 for the impreza and legacy (sorry no SVX). when you come up next week for your service at my shop, i will put in a 105,000 belt so you will have an extended period until you need to change it again. hope this helps.



#8 camosuba

camosuba

    USMB is life!

  • Members
  • 137 posts
  • Brisbane Australia

Posted 17 December 2004 - 04:39 AM

Yes ,can you tell us what the difference is between the 60 and 105k mlie belts I's love to know as our service interval is 60k mikes here

regard camo

#9 svxpert

svxpert

    Certified Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 777 posts
  • East Coast

Posted 17 December 2004 - 08:35 AM

part number for the ca-spec 2.2 belt is:

13028AA150

#10 skelly

skelly

    New User

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 18 posts
  • rockville

Posted 17 December 2004 - 10:12 AM

Subies-

I cross questioned Kelly Shinault and got an apology- and finally got an agreement with everybody on this message board! Replace at 60K and 120K. When SVXPERT gets a chance to look at my car next week, maybe I'll also know for sure if it is an interference or non-interference engine! Hope I get there! Going on 93K with the original timing belt and have this sense of urgency ...

#11 ferret

ferret

    Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 673 posts
  • Northern NJ

Posted 17 December 2004 - 10:28 AM

There is an easy way to tell if your 2.2 is an interference engine or not:

Where do your spark plugs insert?

High up directly into the head..... 2.2 phase 1....single rocker assy...Hydraulic Valve lash adjusters...single row of valve cover fastening bolts in middle of cover assy.....Non-Interference

Thru a wide valve cover....to cover the dual row of rocker arms...valve cover fastens with bolts along the top and bottom........2.2 phase 2.....Interference engine.

#12 WAWalker

WAWalker

    Certified Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 829 posts
  • Montana

Posted 17 December 2004 - 11:01 AM

There is an easy way to tell if your 2.2 is an interference engine or not:

Where do your spark plugs insert?

High up directly into the head..... 2.2 phase 1....single rocker assy...Hydraulic Valve lash adjusters...single row of valve cover fastening bolts in middle of cover assy.....Non-Interference

Thru a wide valve cover....to cover the dual row of rocker arms...valve cover fastens with bolts along the top and bottom........2.2 phase 2.....Interference engine.


The second valve cover you describe is not a 2.2L. That would be a 2.5L DOHC, interference, yes. Rocker arms, no.

There are actually 3 variations of the 2.2L valve train but I don't believe any are interference engines.

#13 cookie

cookie

    Elite Master of the Subaru

  • Members
  • 3,058 posts
  • SFO

Posted 17 December 2004 - 11:30 AM

but I seem to recall the last version of the 2.2 had DOHC and was interference. I think I remember seeing one that was fitted to a dune buggey and the guy told me it was a late 2.2, not a 2.5.

#14 ferret

ferret

    Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 673 posts
  • Northern NJ

Posted 17 December 2004 - 11:32 AM

The second valve cover you describe is not a 2.2L. That would be a 2.5L DOHC, interference, yes. Rocker arms, no.

There are actually 3 variations of the 2.2L valve train but I don't believe any are interference engines.


YES...the 2.5DOHC has 2 Camshafts....But what I'm describing is the 2.2.

The phase 2 2.2 has 1 Camshaft mounted in the center of the head with 1 complete rocker arm assy on each side of it. Intake rocker assy on the top, exhaust rocker assy to the bottom, hence 2 rocker arm assemblies. No Hydraulic lash adjusters, but at 105K miles, the valve clearance should be checked or adjusted This IS the 2.2 Interference engine Subaru introduced during the 97 model year.

The Phase 1 2.2 also has a single camshaft in the center of the head, but here there is a single rocker arm assy mounted above it, with the exhaust rocker arms extending to the bottom of the engine, and the intake rocker arms extend to the top. The Hydraulic Lash adjusters are in the phase 1 only.

#15 MorganM

MorganM

    Do you Subaru?

  • Members
  • 8,390 posts
  • TwinCities

Posted 17 December 2004 - 11:53 AM

Sounds like SOA custy reps need to get on the USMB so they can get their facts straight! :lol:

#16 WAWalker

WAWalker

    Certified Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 829 posts
  • Montana

Posted 17 December 2004 - 03:03 PM

The phase 2 2.2 has 1 Camshaft mounted in the center of the head with 1 complete rocker arm assy on each side of it. Intake rocker assy on the top, exhaust rocker assy to the bottom, hence 2 rocker arm assemblies. No Hydraulic lash adjusters, but at 105K miles, the valve clearance should be checked or adjusted This IS the 2.2 Interference engine Subaru introduced during the 97 model year..


Ok, there is a "Phase II" 2.2L that looks like the SOHC 2.5L, that was used in the '99 Brighton, and in some Impreza's as I understand it. Don't know what year they started in the Impreza. Yes it has to rocker arm shafts. The timing belt replacement and valve adjustment mainttenance on these engines is 105,000 for all of them.

The Phase 1 2.2 also has a single camshaft in the center of the head, but here there is a single rocker arm assy mounted above it, with the exhaust rocker arms extending to the bottom of the engine, and the intake rocker arms extend to the top. The Hydraulic Lash adjusters are in the phase 1 only.


The Phase I 2.2, whitch is the engines that still have 60,000 timing belt replacment intervals, has 3 different valve trains. Standard rocker arms w/ HLA's. In 95 they went to roller rockers w/ HLA's. In 97 they went to roller rockers w/ solid lash adjusters.

#17 cookie

cookie

    Elite Master of the Subaru

  • Members
  • 3,058 posts
  • SFO

Posted 17 December 2004 - 05:26 PM

on the phase 2 2.2? I think I walked away with the impression it was DOHC but I must have been wrong from what is stated here. It may have just looked different to me becuse it was in the dune buggey and at a different angle than I usually see.

#18 WAWalker

WAWalker

    Certified Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 829 posts
  • Montana

Posted 17 December 2004 - 06:57 PM

Does the valve cover look different on the phase 2 2.2


It's like the 1.8L Impreza engine and the 2.2L. They look the same.

The Phase II 2.2L looks just like the '00 and newer SOHC 2.5L.

#19 cookie

cookie

    Elite Master of the Subaru

  • Members
  • 3,058 posts
  • SFO

Posted 17 December 2004 - 07:24 PM

Seems like there are as many variations as a small block Chevy.

#20 tcspeer

tcspeer

    1000+ Super USER!

  • Members
  • 1,444 posts
  • Walnut Springs

Posted 17 December 2004 - 08:15 PM

Ferret, You are 100 percent right. This started in 1997, and somewhere on this site their is a post explaining how Subaru had coned the pistons top for more horse power causing them to be interference engines. Like I said before I know this from experience. I lost a great 2.2 engine with 278,000 miles on it. I had time to fix my squealing idle pully but did not get in a hurry because I thought it was non interference.

#21 ferret

ferret

    Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 673 posts
  • Northern NJ

Posted 18 December 2004 - 08:52 AM

What really makes the 2.2 phase 2 and all 2.5's interference motors is not the 'solid' lifters or DOHC, BUT Subaru changed the valve angle. The valve face is now a little closer to the center of the cylinder, coming form further away. The angle is more acute. In doing so, Combustion is more complete, ie more power and less emissions, AND exhaust is also more efficient.


Down side, Valve edges now proturde further into the combustion chamber leaving a negative clearance to the piston. As described, the valve edges now can hit the piston like the edge of a chisel. Destroying the piston, and bending the lightened hardened valve stem.

The DOHC also can suffer from a slow cam turning (such as replacing the timing belt). This can damage the edges of the valve where they seat and seal. I haven't seen this one yet, but heard it can happen. That's why Subaru is so explicit about holding the cams when replacing the 2.5 DOHC, or which can be turned at which time, and in what direction.

#22 2002sf

2002sf

    New User

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 3 posts
  • Conway

Posted 18 February 2005 - 02:34 PM

my 2002 forester owners manual says to inspect at 60K and 90K replace at 105K Miles US




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users