ScottyC - 6 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Hello All, Sorry if this question was already posted before. I am new to this forum and looked around to see if anyone had asked, but couldn't find anything. Though I am new here, I am not new to working on my Baru. I currently own a 99' Subaru Legacy GT 2.5L Sedan - 30th Anniversary Limited Edition with a 5-spd manual transmission. I love it, but I have a list of modifications I would like to do to truly make it my own and love it a lot more. I might sound crazy, but I want to swap out the EJ25 model 2.5L (non-turbo) H4 and drop in an EG33 model 3.3L H6 from an SVX. I looked at the available clearances under my hood and think I might have to do something drastic like get rid of the A/C radiator and move the engine radiator forward to allow more room (if that is even possible??). Is this even a feasible thought to have?? So you might be asking WHY the heck I would want to do this. Here is why: I am generally disappointed with the performance of the 4 cyc engine. If the A/C is on in the summer and I try to get on the highway... It feels like I own a Honda and will die before I get to 60mph. More so, I have always liked the added performance of a 6 cyc. engine. I had a Ford with a V6 that had the same displacement (2.5L) and I was much more impressed with the performance of that engine than with the H4. Also, I am generally considered insane by my peers. So has anyone tried this? Was the project successful or a complete failure? What would be the biggest thing(s) to worry about when making this kind of swap? I already know that I should worry about what year SVX the EG33 engine is coming from so that it will be able to work with the OBD2 system (like 97'?). I have looked on eBay and found a couple of places that sell these engines pretty cheap, most of which are JDM (Japenese Domestic Market) engines... so they were probably chopped out of stolen cars in Japan. Regardless, I am not too worried about the condition of the engine because I plan to re-build it from the block up with performance parts before swapping it... but I am worried the effort might not be worth the trouble. If I do all this and realize I can't get it under the hood without MAJOR changes, I might want to just sell it and would lose out on some major money. But if I CAN swap it, I could just sell off my 2.5L H4 and recover at least what I paid for the 3.3L H6... making it a pretty wise investment. Please let me know what you think about this. I am extremely interested in getting some advice from the pro's! ~ Scott ~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman18 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 This kind of stuff has been done. I know that someone has even put one into an Impreza. Might try the search function and see if it brings anything up for ya. Good luck!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 it's already been done, a few people come to mind, one person even had a 99 Legacy for sale on this forum (he lives in your state even) with an EG33 not too long ago, though it had issues. a google search or some time looking would probably bring it up. since you haven't even tried to look it's hard to take the request seriously? just being honest. when i go into a huge project, i spend some time searching and looking. the EG33 is a great engine and i say go for it from project perspective, i think it's fantastic and you'll learn alot. but it would be a good idea to consider your options based on what you're saying. it's not likely to give you what you're after. there's no way i would do this swap from a performance stand point. pointless for the power to cost/time ratio. you can get gobs more power and less weight. the weight/dimensions of the EG33 affects handling too. is turbo an option? you could turbo your existing EJ25 and be way ahead of power, weight, ease, and handling of the proposed EG33 swap. and if you just want 250-300 hp that easy to do reliably with an EJ engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyC - 6 Posted October 18, 2009 Author Share Posted October 18, 2009 grossgary, I know what you are saying with the upgrades of the EJ25 instead of swapping for a EG33 to get the performance I am looking for. I also understand that the weight change will affect the handling. I am sorry that I didn't search through the forums more about this type of project before posting. I do want my questions to be taken seriously, but it's difficult to find enough time to sift through years of posts and read through hundreds of threads (that are sometimes mind-numbing and may not answer my specific questions). I truly am sorry if I seem rude for doing this. The problem I face with my project is that I use my car as a daily driver... and taking it out of commission for several days/weeks to upgrade/rebuild or even just adding a turbo would create lots of problems for me. I even considered buying an equivalent EJ25 and upgrading it to drop into the car and reduce the project completion time... but I figured if I was going to buy an engine, why not buy a better engine that could produce more power? There would still be some down-time on the car to swap the engines, but it would be less time than tearing down and re-building the engine while the car sat around. I also considered buying an EJ25 that was already upgraded (like something out of a STi or a WRX), but this option would put the project outside of my budget as some of these engines sell for a large sticker price. The EG33 seemed like a great deal because the cost is relatively cheap (like $600-1500) and would naturally have more power with greater displacement. I figured with a few decent mods, the 230 base HP could be up around 250-275 HP without major modifications like a supercharger or turbo. But since you and bratman18 have told me that this has been done, the project dream is still alive. I will take some time over the next several weeks to look through the forum and see if there is any informative posts that will help guide me through making this project successful. Thank you. I truly do appreciate your help. ~ Scott ~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 I have been involved in numerous 33 swaps. now is a not ideal time for information...will post later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi subbie Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 (edited) Hello All, I already know that I should worry about what year SVX the EG33 engine is coming from so that it will be able to work with the OBD2 system (like 97'?). I have looked on eBay and found a couple of places that sell these engines pretty cheap, most of which are JDM (Japenese Domestic Market) engines... so they were probably chopped out of stolen cars in Japan. ~ Scott ~ What year does OBD2 start from? Im pretty sure you wont find a 1997 JDM EG33.. Because the info I had found out that there were only 2 1997 JDMs reged in Japan.. Most of the JDM motors Ive seen seem to be out of 92s SVXs Edited October 18, 2009 by kiwi subbie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 copy that, the EG33 is definitely a beast in terms of power and inexpensive availability. considering you were talking a rebuild, the cost factor did not seem to be much of an issue since rebuilds are rather pricey to do right. you should even be able to get one cheaper than that. if you're rebuilding it then mileage and such doesn't much matter. with the scope of this project i personally wouldn't worry about OBDI or OBDII. none of the existing harness is really going to be used. you're going to be swapping the entire engine, body side, and ECU harness into the car to make it work. so doesn't seem like it would make much difference. EJ22's are dirt cheap. might be worth looking into rebuilding one of those with turbo pistons then you're not out the expense of the expensive EJ22T. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyC - 6 Posted October 18, 2009 Author Share Posted October 18, 2009 numbchux, I will be interested to read what you know when you have the time. kiwi subbie, I think it all depends on the vehicle manufacturer. My old Ford was a 93' and that model of car didn't get OBD2 until mid-96'. But in general, OBD2 didn't really become a standard until mid-late 90's. grossgary, I will keep that idea in the back of my mind about the EJ22... though I didn't want to reduce engine displacement. I definitely know what you mean about the cost of rebuilding an engine correctly. I tore down a V6 to the block before to replace piston rings and re-work the heads (they were leaking and my car was drinking oil like it was gasoline), which easily cost me about $3k and a couple of weeks to do. It was a first for me, but I had expert help and learned a lot. Still can't believe how much manufacturer head bolts cost... but I guess it's better to be safe than sorry with very important parts like that. BTW, any good places to buy parts for an EG33?? I might as well start collecting website links and business cards now so that the project can get completed without too many issues. Thanks for all your help! ~ Scott ~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted October 18, 2009 Share Posted October 18, 2009 ibut it would be a good idea to consider your options based on what you're saying. it's not likely to give you what you're after. there's no way i would do this swap from a performance stand point. pointless for the power to cost/time ratio. you can get gobs more power and less weight. the weight/dimensions of the EG33 affects handling too. what? I ENTIRELY disagree with this statement. The EG33 is the first option I would consider in looking for a performance motor. they use the same winning bore/stroke combination as the legendary EJ22. perfectly balancing cylinder wall strength with displacement. And the EG33 DOHC heads flow wonderfully. take a stock GC impreza, drop a stock EG33 in it. and it will hang with Stage 2 WRXs all day. turbocharge an EJ25, and you'll be outrun by stock WRXs, and drastically compromise your reliability. the weight difference is definitely there. but some stiffer springs in the front, and relocate the battery to the trunk, and the difference is very small. a slight adjustment in driving style would easily compensate. I'm working on my 3rd, full hands-on EG33 swap right now (first 2 in GC imprezas, and this into a '96 legacy brighton wagon). I've also done the wiring harnesses for 2 others. Mechanically.....the length is the only issue. transmission bolts right up. engine mounts fit perfectly. fuel lines, throttle linkage, etc. all very easy. but, something has to happen with the radiator (as you know).you can cut and modify existing mounts to move the radiator forward a few inches. you will most likely loose your hood latch. the 2 GCs I worked on both had a smaller, thicker radiator that they were able to mount further forward with minimal modification elsewhere. Dao mounted his up in the bumper like a front-mount intercooler.....leaving his core supports and hood latch in tact: more info on his car: http://www.numbchuxconversions.com/daoimp.htm and Colin had one made that had brackets on it that actually replaced the upper support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 19, 2009 Share Posted October 19, 2009 right on chux, i concur. hard to beat a reliable 230 hp out of cheap and easy to find EG33's/SVX's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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