pi_1980 Posted May 22, 2011 Share Posted May 22, 2011 This summer I am going to pull the engine out of my wife's Subaru. It is a 96 Legacy Brighton, with the 2.2. It has head gaskets that are leaking oil out, and it is just a mater of time before catastrophic head gasket failure. I am hoping that I get to it before that. I also know that it has a leaky rear main seal so I will be doing that fore sure as well. I don't think this engine got ragular oil changes when It was young, hense Leaky oild gaskets at 100k. I replaces the timing belt and tensioner about 10,000 miles ago, I don't plan on doing those unless oil has gotten on the belt. We also have an intermittent rough running condition, that throws a cylinder 3 mis-fire. My question are: 1. Am I best off to get all my gaskets from Subaru, or are there some improved aftermarket ones, If so what brand and where can I source them from? 2. What other things should I plan on doing while I am in there? I was thinking about a new pan gasket, having the heads surfaced, intake and exhaust manifold gaskets, new front crank and cam seals, and of course the head gaskets and rear main seal. Is there an input shaft seal on the transmission? Any sensors, or switches that I would be a fool not to replace while the engine is out? 3. Are there any special Subaru specific or unusual size or shape wrenches I will require? 4. I have seen some talk about replacing the head bolts in the post I have read, Do I have to source those through Subaru, or is there an acceptable aftermarket parts that will not cost as much? 5. Does anyone have any ideas about the intermittent (once every 2-4 months ) rough running? 6. Any other helpful hints, tricks or links with good information would be appreciated. Thanks for your help, Paul Iverson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 Are you SURE it is leaking from the head gaskets? 2.2 head gasket failure is rare. Oil leaks are not, and quite often oil leaks can appear to come from the head gaskets, oil pan or rear main seal, though they stem from other sources. There are three places that very commonly leak on this engine. The valve cover gaskets, the cam seals, and the oil separator plate. One seal in particular that creates a lot of problems is the rear cam O ring on the back of the passenger side head. It's under a metal cap with 2 bolts securing it to the head. Remove the bolts and twist the cap to remove it and the O ring can be swapped. A generous coating of oil and a little twist the cap will slide back into the recess in the head. There is a similar seal on the driers side head. It's a round plug seal. It's very difficult to change with the engine in the car. Mostly because it has to be pressed/tapped into the bore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 Make sure it's the HG - what makes you think so? Usually 2.2 HG's burn white like a traditional HG issue. If it's on oil leak, it's probably an oil leak and not a HG. More likely valve cover or if appropriate spark plug hole Orings, or the 2" thin cam Orings, or other seals(crank/cam) - as pointed out in prior post. I NEVER replace rear main seals, unless they have already been replaced because when replaced they seem to leak. I ALWAYS reseal the baffle plate if I have the engine out. Most folks think it's the rear main (which it isn't) when it's really the baffle/oil seperator plate. Dealer crank & cam seals. Most folks still check oil pump screws on 2.2's although I've never found any loose like on 2.5's. Oil pump Oring. If you think you have an oil pan leak it's probably the bafflle plate. 14mm swivel socket for lower drivers side nut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheinen74 Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 (edited) doubt a 2.2 has a headgasket oil leak as well. check everything from oil pressure sensor, cam seals, valve cover grommits, etc. The EJ22 just doesnt commonly leak oil on a headgasket... If you get talked into a headgasket replacement when its not needed, then you blow away alot of unneccessary money, when something cheap might be the fix. If you have the 2.5 EJ25, then yeah i would never say what i have said. Edited May 23, 2011 by bheinen74 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 Paul, I suggest you do some searching here on USMB and learn more about your engine. You have the last of the wonderful non-interference EJ22 engines and it's virtually "bulletproof!" Yes, any engine can blow head gaskets but it's rather rare with yours. I don't think blown HGs usually leak oil anyway. And the oil leak at the rear of the engine is most likely the oil separator plate. Don't touch the rear main seal unless you're positive it is bad--you'll end up causing yourself even more problems. Fairtax, the driver side front seal you mentioned is the same O-ring as the passenger side rear. It can be changed quite easily without pulling the engine--just have to remove the cam pulley and rear timing belt cover to get to it. (Or did you mean the camshaft seal?) Anyway, good luck Paul. Feel free to ask lotsa' questions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 Do the baffle plate behind the engine. You can leave the rear crank seal alone if it's not leaking, which most likely is not, and only would be compromised if the engine was cooked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 Fairtax, the driver side front seal you mentioned is the same O-ring as the passenger side rear. It can be changed quite easily without pulling the engine--just have to remove the cam pulley and rear timing belt cover to get to it. (Or did you mean the camshaft seal?) I didn't understand the difficulty with either that thin Oring or the cam seal on the drivers side. Thought perhaps I was missing something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 I thought I said it was the one on the back of the head. Must have cut that part out by accident. (My replies generally consist of a bunch of rambling that gets cut down to the parts that make sense before I hit submit) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 That one can be a bit difficult to remove and replace that boomerang piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North to Alaska Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 (edited) Go to AAA "The Shop" old seward highway & 37th. They will sell you all the Subaru gaskets (parts) that you need. cheaper the continonal motors too. Use SUBARU part only...I get my head gaskets from them. Don't forget to replace the spark plugs while you have the motor out Plus they give good free advise. and if you screw up. Ed, their oldest Subaru wrench can fix anything on a Subaru and I mean anything !!! P.S. if your dad's name is Pete, then I have flown with him many years ago. Edited May 23, 2011 by North to Alaska Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi_1980 Posted May 23, 2011 Author Share Posted May 23, 2011 Go to AAA "The Shop" old seward highway & 37th.They will sell you all the Subaru gaskets (parts) that you need. cheaper the continonal motors too. Use SUBARU part only...I get my head gaskets from them. Don't forget to replace the spark plugs while you have the motor out Plus they give good free advise. and if you screw up. Ed, their oldest Subaru wrench can fix anything on a Subaru and I mean anything !!! P.S. if your dad's name is Pete, then I have flown with him many years ago. I am planning this work based on AAA's recommendation. The last time my wife took the car into them for an oil change they said that the head gaskets were leaking oil out and would need to be replaced soon. The first time we had the car in there they told me that the rear main was leaking and we would be lucky to get another 10-20K out of that seal. There were some other leaks that I repaired when I did the timing belt. We couldn't be sure where all the oil was coming from till I fixed the leaky oil pump. I don't think this engine had many oil changes when I was young, and all the seals are trashed. All the previous post's made it sound like I am crazy, but AAA is reputable right? It looks like my head gaskets are leaking to me also. I have fresh oil dripping off the bottom of the inside of the heads. The source looks too high to be the pan, and too far toward the center to be the valve cover gaskets. I have no oil that is visible when I look under the hood, all of the oil is under car. I realize that the 2.2 should be rock solid, that is why we bought one, but this thing leaks like a sieve. Thanks, Paul Iverson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 typically oil leaks will find their way down to the middle of the valve cover seams to drip off, even if the oil is coming from the top of the engine. Check to see if the oil pressure sensor under the alternator is leaking, as t can make a mess. Chances are the HG is not bad as long as there is no bubbles in the coolant, and it passes a compression test. The advice from AAA is probably related to later model cars with MLS gaskets, and therefore assumed to apply to your car when the word subaru is mentioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North to Alaska Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 (edited) I know & trust Kurt (owner) and his team with both of our Subaru's. 98 OBW & 09 WRX Just look at his parking lot, Im not the only one that trust him and his company. Thats why their more Subies being fixed at his shop then at the Subaru dealer just down the street (old seward highway). When our new subaru WRX needed warranty work, we took it to his Subaru warranty service shop in Kenai. Next time your in AAA, ask to meet ED (old man) This guy has forgot more about subaru's then most subaru mechanic know. Once you talk to Ed you will see what im saying !!! Im very impressed with him. I would say "good luck" but with you working with the best. Luck has nothing to do when it !!!!! Edited May 23, 2011 by North to Alaska Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Well in this case it sounds like a reputable and knowledgeable shop diagnosed it, and likely are correct. Have the heads machined by a machine shop before you reinstall them to give the best possible chance for a good seal. And be sure to be familiar with the torque sequence before tightening the head bolts. You do not need new head bolts on Subaru engines. Tools. You will need a 14mm 12 point socket for head bolts. At least 1/2" drive. An accurate torque wrench is a must. A torque angle gauge may come in handy, but if you are good with judging angles (90°) it's not necessary. Other than that, an assortment of regular hand tools, metric sockets and wrenches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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