Noise from rear end, the binding, the AT Temp light blink. help!

[AWDWagonator]

So I've read alot on this forum about the problem I'm having and I need a hand figuring this out. WARNING: this will be a long post, but I want to detail it so you know where I'm at for the optimum assitance.

 

Background:

I bought the car knowing it had a noise in the rear, the guy said it needed a diff. I didn't even look into it, took his word and bought a diff for 160 bucks from a yard. Well, upon awaiting its arrival, I noticed the AT temp light blinked upon start up, and thought that shouldn't be. So I looked it up, and saw that meant stored code in TCM. I tried to pull transmission codes with an OTC Genysis scan tool, and I couldn't. So then I tried the secret handshake about...10 times...and could NEVER get the light to blink, it just stays solid.

 

Here's how I did the handshake.

 

I let the car warm up. then backed it down the street. Started it, let it run for a few seconds, Shut it off, turned the key to on, waited a few seconds, started it, drove it over 12mph (up to about 38 mph) for about 10 seconds, pulled over and stopped, put the shifter down in "1", then I shut the car off. Then I put the car in ON (KOEO) and put it in "2" then "1" then "2" then "3" then "D". My foot was on the brake ever since I stopped, but I didn't see where I couldn't do that. This seemed right to me, I never got anything.

 

Also, should that AWD light come on for bulb check when starting? I don't see it, and when I put the fuse in the AWD fuse holder, the AWD light doesn't come on either. When the fuse is in the fuse holder, I still have the noise from the rear.

 

Since I can't pull codes, I think the only way to verify whether its a diff, wheel bearing, or the duty c solenoid would be to disconnect the driveshaft from the diff and try driving it and see if the noise is still there.

 

 

What do you guys think?

Edited September 14, 2011 by AWDWagonator

[jarl]

The gurus may (will) chime in later on, but I think I read on the forum that if you don't take care of the binding quickly enough the plates of the center clutch (it's not a differential) can fuse together, giving you a permanent 4WD and the symptoms you describe.

 

Let's see what the Gurus say... In the meantime, search the forum for "torque bind". i.e. http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=125399

[idosubaru]

highly unlikely the rear diff failed - subaru rear differentials almost never fail.

 

if you have binding your issue is either the Duty C solenoid or clutches are hosed most likely.

 

The noise is likely something straining...could be a driveshaft, carrier bearing, you haven't really described the noise, could be a bushing or axle too.

 

Sounds like your Duty C solenoid is hosed and causing torque bind and the AT light. clutches won't typically cause the light to flash, the solenoid will.

 

The secret handshake is a real debacle to get it to work right, good luck is about all i can say, it's a silly game that i've yet to get to work right.

[idosubaru]

have you tried installing the FWD fuse int he engine bay to see if the torque bind/noise goes away?

 

probably won't, but worth a shot, it takes 23 seconds.

[AWDWagonator]

I'm pretty sure that's the problem too, I really wanted to pull codes so I was sure and wasn't throwing parts at it, but it sounds like thats gotta be it.

 

So the real question is: where can I get the solenoid and the clutches? Is it dealer only?

 

yes, I mentioned in my post I tried the FWD fuse to no avail.

 

 

The noise sounds like an awful grinding/rubbing noise like a bearing, but I'm pretty sure I'm experiencing the torque bind around the turns. Hard to tell honestly.

 

And as a Just in case question...Is a rear wheel bearing a dealer only item? Is there a post about it on here somewhere?

 

Thanks again.

Edited September 15, 2011 by AWDWagonator

[idosubaru]

those parts are probably dealer only or get a used extension housing.

 

if you've got noise that bad, it doesn't sound good at all. i'd be concerned the rear drum sheared off or is otherwise compromised too.

[AWDWagonator]

what years will fit, if I were to find one at the junkyard? All models?

Edited September 15, 2011 by AWDWagonator

[johnceggleston]

first, the secret hand shake only works on obd1 cars. what year is yours?

 

if you have an obd2 car, (95 - 99, maybe beyond.)

do a search here for ''transcodes" or ''readingtranscodes" and read the oldest posts first. you will find the info on reading the TCU code by grounding out a pin in a 6 pin connector under the dash. it is a diagnostic connector and has 2 loose, single pin, grounding wires as part of the harness. not all 6 positions in the connector hacve pins in them, but ALL of the pins that are there are for flashing codes, TCU, ABS, SRS (air bag) etc. so ground out a pin with the key in the run position and the engine off and see what you get. it the AT Temp light does not flash, try another pin.

 

if the FWD light does not come on when you put in the fwd fuse, then the duty c is not working. it sounds like your duty c is bad.

 

for the wheel bearing, have some one drive the car while tyou ride in the back . listen on each side of the car to see if you can identify more noise on one side or the other. try jacking up the suspect wheel and turn it by hand while resting your finger on the spring. if you feel some thing you have found your culprit.

[idosubaru]

you've never mentioned what car, vehicle, or anything you're working on but most 4EAT's are interchangeable when it comes to the rear extension housing. nearly any impreza/legacy/outback/forester you find in a yard should work.

[AWDWagonator]

you're right...1997 subaru legacy L 2.2l

 

Thanks.

[AWDWagonator]

so I found the black connector, and the 2 ground leads, grounded pin 5, and I still couldn't get the light to blink with key out, KOEO as well as KOER. I also hooked it to battery ground, still nothing.

[johnceggleston]

did you connect the ground wire first and then turn on the key to run? but not start.

[AWDWagonator]

you mean connect pin 5 to the ground wire, and then to run? Yes. I"ll go do it again.

 

EDIT: I just went out and messed with it a bit, I connected it, turned the key to run, and it just stays illuminated, will not blink. Whats the deal?!

Edited September 15, 2011 by AWDWagonator

[AWDWagonator]

Status Update:

 

So I was never able to get the ATF TEMP light to blink. But, I figured with the symptoms of no FWD light with fuse in, the fact there was a code, and what seeme to be binding in the rear wheels. I went to the junkyard and picked up a rear extension housing out of a '98 outback with a 2.2, only 130k on it, and the fluid looked to be in great shape, as well as the clutches and steels.

 

So I got it put in, I reset the ATF TEMP blink by disconnecting the battery, and viola, the FWD light came on with the fuse in. So that was great. I let it drive on jack stands, and everything seems to work.

 

But.....I drove it, and it definitely has a noise from the differential. Still no blinking ATF TEMP light, so I'm pretty sure it had a bad Duty C Solenoid anyway.

 

Thus lies my question. Can driving with a bad Duty C, and the torque bind, Cause the Differential to fail?

 

I'm gonna go back up to the yard and get the diff out of the same outback. Any write-ups on this on the boards?

 

Thanks.

Edited September 21, 2011 by AWDWagonator

[johnceggleston]

lots of parts will fail before a rear diff will wheel bearings are one and they will make noise in the rear. and the drive shaft u-joints are another and they can be damaged by the wear and tear torque bind causes.

 

of course a rear diff can go bad, but if it has fluid in it i would suspect something else.

[AWDWagonator]

I suspected wheel bearing too. But I ran it with it up in the air and crawled underneath it, Its Definitely coming from the differential, no doubt.