stratman977 Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 I resealed my engine about a month ago. I got rid of the oil leaks for a few weeks and it started leaking out of the pan. I just used the cork gasket and no RTV. Last Saturday I pulled the pan and decided to replace the gasket again and I used some ultra gray on it this time. I noticed that the pan bolts weren't really that tight when I pulled it. This time it lasted 2 days and then I started leaking again. The bolts werent that tight again so I re-tightened them. That lasted about a day and not there loose again. My question is: Will using loctite on the pan bolts do the trick or is this more due to the gasket shrinking because of hot and cold cycles of the engine? I realize the gasket should eventually seat but I cant for the life of me see why this should keep coming loose. Also since I have leaked through the rtv do I need to pull the pan again and re-apply the ultra gray or wil it be ok if I just tighten up the bolts? I have another gasket but you all know how much fun it is pulling the pan while in the car. As a side note the pan is not warped in any way as far as I can tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Hate to say but some of the pan bolt holes may be srtipped. If it were me, I'd pull it......get rid of all the cork. Clean it completely of oil, and seal it with "the Right Stuff" and no gasket. Let it cure overnight (or at least several hours) before filling with oil. That's how all the newer engines are done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivans imports Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Ditch gasket and just use ultra grey as gasket like the new motors do the cork pan gasket was a pos and never sealed that well 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratman977 Posted November 22, 2013 Author Share Posted November 22, 2013 My bolts are not stripped. They tighten up just fine just they won't stay tightened. I will try it without the gasket this time and some loctite on the bolts. Anyone have any tricks to get the 4 rear pan bolts back in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobiedubie Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 I hate to say it but as the engine gets older, the heat cycles reduce the strength of the steel bolts, by making them softer. So it becomes easier to twist the head off in the process of tightening the bolt to stop the leaks. So be real careful about over tightening them. Loctite is probably a waste, because the hole and bolt would likely have to be free of all oil, before applying the loctite. Which is very difficult to achieve. The compression of the new gasket, is what is most likely causing loose bolts. Just keep retightening them on a periodic basis, until you grow tired of it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobiedubie Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 My bolts are not stripped. They tighten up just fine just they won't stay tightened. I will try it without the gasket this time and some loctite on the bolts. Anyone have any tricks to get the 4 rear pan bolts back in? Therein lies your problem. No rear pan bolts then no chance of stopping the leak. You have to loosen the engine mounting bolts at the three locations, and raise the engine up by about 4 inches. Avoid putting hand in between engine and frame as the engine can drop at any time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 4 rear bolts can be installed/ tightened with a long phillips head screwdriver through the access holes in the crossmember. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmashedGlass Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Gloyale, are you saying it IS possible to do the pan without raising the engine? Just wondering, as I haven't done an EA pan gasket myself yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quidam Posted November 22, 2013 Share Posted November 22, 2013 Victor/Reinz makes a cork/rubber oil pan gasket I've wanted to try. Just tried to tack it on to a RockAuto order but shipping for it alone like thirteen bucks. That would make it $19.00. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivans imports Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 there should be holes in the xmember to put long #3 philips thru to do up bolts or a ten mm swivel socket on end of 1/4 inch ex works to 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratman977 Posted November 23, 2013 Author Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) I did the pan with the engine in the car the second time. The access holes don't line up real well though so its a royal pain in the butt. I had to bend the screwdriver to get it into the Phillips hole but once its on the slot you're golden. You can also get at them with 1/4 inch drive extension and a swivel. The bolts are a pain in the butt to get back in though. I don't see why I couldn't get it clean from oil. I had the mating surface real clean when I used the ultra gray. Edited November 23, 2013 by stratman977 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notliving Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) Hate to say but some of the pan bolt holes may be srtipped. If it were me, I'd pull it......get rid of all the cork. Clean it completely of oil, and seal it with "the Right Stuff" and no gasket. Let it cure overnight (or at least several hours) before filling with oil. That's how all the newer engines are done. This 100%. Exactly what I did during my HG replacement. Cork gaskets are garbage. Drill holes in the crossmember to make it easier to get to the bolts. Edited November 23, 2013 by notliving Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratman977 Posted November 23, 2013 Author Share Posted November 23, 2013 Just pulled the pan and replaced with just ultra gray. I also replaced the pan bolts. 2 or 3 of them didn't look so great. The threads in the block are in good shape though. I got everything real clean and put some blue Loctite in the holes but I'm 100% sure some of the ultra gray got in the holes as well so I hope they stay snug. The new bolts didn't have the Phillips head so I packed a 10mm socket full of grease to hold the bolt. The grease helps keep the bolt from flopping in the socket and it keeps the bolt from sinking all the way into the socket. Took some finesse but they went in without too much trouble. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARJ Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 Hi Had the same problem with other engines , the secrete use loctite 587 blue max no cork gasket . a 3/16 to 1/4 inch beed around sump ,leave stand 1hr . New bolts with star washers to lock them , very thin smear blue 587 over the engine sump flange area ,fit sump straight away and tighten bolts to contact pressure only . 24hrs later tighten all bolts working from centre on each side . Be sure to clean both surfaces completely , white spirits or similar even thought 587 will seal with reasonable clean a perfect clean is best at all times The smear on engine surface gives complete seal and then your not so much relying on the pressure between two surfaces to seal the sump but to hold the already made seal WORKS ON ALL FLANGE SEALS AN OLD FRIDGY'S TRICK USED ON REFRIGERATION COMPRESSORS BUT WITH DIFFERENT SEALANTS ARJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 Yes, insert a #3 phillips to install the rearmost bolts. You can also accomplish inserting a 1/4 socket extension thrut the hole, then put on the socket for a straight shot. I have seen the rubber gaskets that have metal sleeves in the holes where you can tighten them up without splitting the gasket. you may just need to make several passes torqing the bolts, turning an additional 1/4 to 1/8 turns. make 3 passes. Start from the middle finishing on the corners each pass. Be careful not to split the gasket. If you are using only ultra greay, you can install the piece, let it cure overnite, and then add some torque to the bolts as there is no gasket to split. I like to use the cork gasket dry against the block, and ultra grey between the gasket and the pan. These 2 videos demonstrate my technique Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivantruckman Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 (edited) one thing to check., After a while the oil pan surface around the bolt holed tends to distort . causing high spots in the metal . I use a body file to flatten the pan before I use the grey silicone gasket maker. it can be as much as a 1/6th of an inch . Edited December 10, 2013 by ivantruckman 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ford'ssubaru's Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 This is very true. I worried about removing material from the pan so I took a ball pein hammer and flattened the bolt holes again. Every make a note. If SEALANT was used before the silicone will dry at the bottom of the hole preventing the bolt from going all the way in. You will see this and try tightening the bolts. The heads will break off or the bolt will break...........Just helicoiled 6 bolts from a common mistake. Just FYI. Cheers, Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapper 157 Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 Gloyale, are you saying it IS possible to do the pan without raising the engine? Just wondering, as I haven't done an EA pan gasket myself yet. Yep. On EAs it takes all of 10-15 mins to take off the pan if you know what you're doing. Getting the bolts in the back of the pan can be tricky, but doable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapper 157 Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 (edited) Gotta love the simplicity of these cars! Edited February 22, 2015 by Sapper 157 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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