newgen85brat Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 I just bought a 1996 Outback. It is in great shape. 227k. Burns no oil, pretty clean motor. The guy had listed and shown receipts of all work in the last 3 years. He just replaced the clutch last year (10k ago). He had done so much work to it in the last 3 years and when the clutch started making noise again, he decided to give up. I have searched a lot of threads and I am pretty sure that the TOB is worn and will require the sleeve and larger throw out bearing. I pulled the tranny today and found the throw out bearing is very sloppy where it rides on the shaft. Also the clutch fork was really sloppy. The front main shaft from the tranny is what I suspect (the bearing). You can pull the shaft about 1/8" forward and also wiggle it about 1/16". The sound it was making prior to this was that of a worn TOB. It would quit when clutched about 1/4 of the way. But it also would make a dragging sound like a bearing when the car was moving. This sound would quit when the clutch was depressed. I read GD said you can put the bearings in a day. Is there any good pictorials or videos (I have searched) that anyone can point me to? I am worried about tearing into the tranny. Any suggestions or hints? Do you just split it? Do all the guts fall out if you do it wrong? I have a Chilton, but lots of times the generic one application covers all approach makes me nervous. Please help, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikaleda Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 (edited) Its not your throw out bearing, its the input shaft bearing. A throwout bearing only turns when clutch is engaged and will only make noise when the clutch is engaged. Input shaft bearings are a comon failure in these cars and the transmission has to be pulled and the casing has to be split. For someone like GD with experience and a shop this only takes a day, but for the do it yourselfers it will take longer, but is worth it if its been caught in time. When you replace the bearing use the bearing for the turbo motor, its built better and will last longer. Before planing on doing this replacement I would suggest draning the fluid and inspecting it for metal particulate. If there is just a little bit of metal with no large chunks replacing the bearing is feasible. If there is a lot of metal particulate and metal chunks, start looking for another trans. From the sounds of it you caught it in time since your not having any other issues with drivability. I think there is a thread in here about changing the input shaft bearing, but I'm not sure where. Edited December 30, 2014 by mikaleda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikaleda Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Found it, this is actually about replacing the front seal but will get you where you need to go. http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=90182&highlight=input+bearing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxgap Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 Had this same problem with our trans in a 96 Outback. I drained and refilled the trans with fresh fluid, synthetic I can't place the name at the moment, I found the old fluid milky colored. A that point we just decided to run it the way it was cause the body on the car is REAL sad. The trans finnaly gave up the ghost, won't stay in 4th gear, 20,000 miles later. It made so much noise you had to turn the radio up. The same day the trans broke a huge chunk of the quater fell off so the car is now retired to being a field car. Car still runs and drives, ya just can't use 4 th gear. Amazing transmission!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 Large bearing at the rear of the upper shaft. When it goes the shaft can walk fore/aft in the case so when the sshift fork pushes the collar the whole shaft moves....instead of the just the collar.......When they start popping out of 4th or 5th you know it's bad. Replacement is fairly easy with just a simple press.....or remove shaft and take it to machine shop to press. Once fixed...the trans will work great again.....unless you let it go so long that debris damaged other gears. Sometimes there will be evidence of the bearing spinning in the case.......when this happens a series of "peens" from a pointed punch will bulge the inside area of the bearing seat enough to grab it again.......sounds ghetto but totally works. Make sure the large bearing is installed with the snap collar towards the back.....and don't forget the spacer collar when reassembling the rear section to the main cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 at 227K, you might get a used trans with 1/3 the mileage swapped in with less hassle. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newgen85brat Posted January 5, 2015 Author Share Posted January 5, 2015 Sorry guys, i have been sick and just got around to getting back to responding. Yes there was a little bit of shiny bits in the oil. Nothing big though. I will break the case apart when I get feeling better. Thanks for finding the great write up, I am not so worried now. I am worried about the suggestion for a new tranny. Is 227k a bad amount to have? Is there a measurement or something that you determine you should put the shaft sleeve kit on? My shaft does not look bad, just the center of the TOB was pretty worn. Thanks again. Influenza A sucks by the way, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newgen85brat Posted January 19, 2015 Author Share Posted January 19, 2015 Okay, finally got the tranny split front to back but not in half yet. On the rear section I found a little bit of metal in the bottom of the case. When you turn the output shaft, it is pretty loud but not really a bearing noise. It is one of the two bearings there. How noisy are these normally? How hard are they to replace? I will split the tranny the rest of the way tomorrow but still wonder if I should give up with 227K as suggested by 1 Lucky Texan. Maybe just go to U-Pull it? What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 it isn't really giving up. It's just which is likely to be the better approach to getting the car back on the road. You're kinda deep and seem to have a lot of confidence so, if one of the gurus responds with some advice, i bet you can get this trans going. Wouldn't hurt to price some used ones at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikaleda Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 i would say since you have the transmision out and partially apart already you might as well split it and see what kind of damage has happened. personaly i would go ahead and purchase a used trans and instale that one. then you can thoughly go through this one and make sure everything is good and just keep it for a back up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newgen85brat Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 I got it out and found the problem. The large bearing on the input shaft was toast. The cage was broken and the balls chewed up. Other than that, it seems pretty good. Someone had been in there before but just did not replace it. I think I will try to fix it. At worst case a pull it place only gets 65.00 for trannys. The only thing I question is the sleeve kit someone had already put in it. The TOB is pretty sloppy on it. The sleeve looks like new but the TOB is rather worn. I just need to see what TOB to get for it. Thanks for the help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 When the main bearing goes bad the shaft starts wobbling around and just beats on the outer race of the bearing. Yours was still in good shape if it wasn't popping out of gear yet. If there are no score marks on the thrust plate (the big half moon that sits a the back of the main case) to ahead and get a new bearing and press it on. If any of the teeth on the gears are rough looking then you're better off to just get a used trans. Gears don't last too long after they get chewed up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newgen85brat Posted January 22, 2015 Author Share Posted January 22, 2015 Great, thank you for the help. The teeth look good. Someone was just in there 12k ago, they just did not replace the main bearing or else it would not have occurred. Do you know what TOB they use for the sleeve repair kit? No one has replied about that and I will order a new one from the parts house and just check it out to make sure it is right. The one on the sleeve was pretty sloppy towards the outside of the bearing and was really moving around. Nobody put grease in there when they worked on it nor did they grease the pivot for the clutch fork. Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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