ThomasJacobs Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 I have a 2000 Outback Sedan 2.5L A/T with 80K miles. I am beginning to see rough idle and hesitation during initial acceleration (lights and stop signs, etc.) and there is no check engine light displayed. The last time this happenned (Aug 03 @ 64K miles) the dealer reprogrammed ECM which did not fix it. During my next visit I was fortunate that the regional Subaru rep was visiting and overhearing my discussion with the counter person and the rep (not the mechanic) suggested they swap out the Front Oxygen sensor which did the trick. This was the second time this had been replaced, the first as a result of a recall in May 01 @ 36K miles. I still need to complete a tune-up (air filter, plugs, PCV, and fuel filter) as this was last done in August 03, before I brought it to the dealer with the hesitation problems back then. My questions: 1. Assuming the tune up has no effect, would you suggest I go ahead and replace the front oxygen sensor again? 2. If so, is this easy to do and are there any references anyone can share on how to do it? (I have the Subaru service manual for the engine and while it mentions the front and rear oxygen sensors as part of the removal of the front catalytic converter, there is no section specifically addressing sensor replacement.) I would add that while I have done and can do the tune up myself, I do not have any electronic diagnostic tools. I am loathe to bring it to the dealer or anyone else to diagnose because I have had nothing but problems every time I have done so in the past (usually multiple visits and sometimes ridiculous suggestions in excess of $1000 each time that scare the life out of me - what if I had let my wife bring the car in, etc.) Thanks very much for any comments or advice. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 O2 sensors don't typically cause driveability issues that early, more info later. are the spark plugs NGK and the ignition wires OEM Subaru wires? if not, they should be and i'd start there. particularly the wires. most aftermarket wires won't work well with the newer Subaru's (2.2 and 2.5 liter engines). the O2 isn't hard to replace, just hard to get to sometimes. best to crawl under and have a look. i saw the one on the 2.2 liter i just pulled last week, didn't look hard at all. hopefully someone will post a wrench size for you. hit it good with penetrating oil (use Liquid Wrench or PB Blaster, not WD40 as they are better products for this). spray it down good where it threads into the exhaust a day before and the day of to help it break loose. these are the three wire type O2 sensors. the plug is in the engine bay, follow the wire UP until you see the connector. pop the hood and disconnect it. then remove the O2 and install the new one and connect it. that's it, it just unscrews from the exhaust. access is the only issue, but it's usually not too bad, just annoying getting on the ground and under the car. i typically pop one side of the car or one front tire up high by driving up on a curb or something else elevated. approach any curb nearly head on with the tires, you want the tread to ride up on the curb (slooowly), not the side wall. side walls of tires are weak. i've done it a zillion times. this is much easier than getting out a jack and feels alot better too when you crawl under there. on a scale of 1 (easy) to 10 (hard) this job is a 1. you could try swapping out the coil pack as well. pick up a used one for a couple bucks and give it a try to see if your problem goes away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasJacobs Posted January 13, 2006 Author Share Posted January 13, 2006 Thanks for the reply. The plugs are Bosch (replaced in Aug 03) but the wires are original - never replaced. I have ordered Subaru OEM plugs for this replacement (I assume those are NGK?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 I have ordered Subaru OEM plugs for this replacement (I assume those are NGK?). yup. doubt that's the cause, but still a good idea to replace. be sure to verify the gap is correct, was that done last time the plugs were changed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasJacobs Posted January 13, 2006 Author Share Posted January 13, 2006 Yes, I followed the directions in the service manual (gap .039-.043 in). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friendly_jacek Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 I'm with you 100%. I suffered my share from subaru dealers and also have 2000. I also had the recall done on 01, this was when the machanics broke the plastic underengine covers and refused to fix. Recently, I changed the front sensor again (60000) hoping to increase MPG. The above advice is axcelent. Soaking in penetrant is the key to success (i use CRC6-56). Access is the major chalenge though. I used ramps and ended buying a special oxygen sensor wrench WITH OFFSET from Advance Auto, to get it out. As soon as was able to fit the special tool in, the sensor went out with no resistance. I could not fit anything other than the special tool, though. BTW, while I could not measure an improvement in MPG in city, there was some on long distance hwy trip (25 to 26 MPG). Good luck with yours. While it sounds a little like a long shot for idling problem, the sensor is cheap nowadays to try. Have you looked unto gentle cleaning of TB/injector cleaning? And yes, get rid of bosch, NGK is the way to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 I have a 99 Forester and I just leaned down from above and changed mine. I used an old SAE wrench that was fairly close, but not a real fit on it. I would think the special wrench would make it easier.Look at the new sensor to figure how the connector comes off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friendly_jacek Posted January 14, 2006 Share Posted January 14, 2006 I have a 99 Forester and I just leaned down from above and changed mine. I used an old SAE wrench that was fairly close, but not a real fit on it. I would think the special wrench would make it easier.Look at the new sensor to figure how the connector comes off. I remember people advising this. Yet it didn't work for me in my 2000. ? why, maybe i'm too short? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted January 14, 2006 Share Posted January 14, 2006 I'm only 5 ' 8'' but I suppose arm length could matter as well as I used to be a bus mechanic so I am somewhat used to a heavy load on a stretch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasJacobs Posted February 5, 2006 Author Share Posted February 5, 2006 I'm with you 100%.I suffered my share from subaru dealers and also have 2000. I also had the recall done on 01, this was when the machanics broke the plastic underengine covers and refused to fix. Recently, I changed the front sensor again (60000) hoping to increase MPG. The above advice is axcelent. Soaking in penetrant is the key to success (i use CRC6-56). Access is the major chalenge though. I used ramps and ended buying a special oxygen sensor wrench WITH OFFSET from Advance Auto, to get it out. As soon as was able to fit the special tool in, the sensor went out with no resistance. I could not fit anything other than the special tool, though. BTW, while I could not measure an improvement in MPG in city, there was some on long distance hwy trip (25 to 26 MPG). Good luck with yours. While it sounds a little like a long shot for idling problem, the sensor is cheap nowadays to try. Have you looked unto gentle cleaning of TB/injector cleaning? And yes, get rid of bosch, NGK is the way to go. Friendly_Jacek, I have finally completed the tune-up and located the Oxygen sensor. While the car is running much better, I am now writing to ask a follow up question to your post. Was there a Subaru special tool for removal of the the Oxygen sensor that you decided not to buy when you purchased the special oxygen sensor wrench WITH OFFSET from Advance Auto? There is not an Advance Auto nearby that I am aware of. Is this a standard type tool I could purchase at a NAPA or Pep Boys? Any other suggestions on alternative sources to buy a similar tool? Thanks. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friendly_jacek Posted February 5, 2006 Share Posted February 5, 2006 Friendly_Jacek, I have finally completed the tune-up and located the Oxygen sensor. While the car is running much better, I am now writing to ask a follow up question to your post. Was there a Subaru special tool for removal of the the Oxygen sensor that you decided not to buy when you purchased the special oxygen sensor wrench WITH OFFSET from Advance Auto? There is not an Advance Auto nearby that I am aware of. Is this a standard type tool I could purchase at a NAPA or Pep Boys? Any other suggestions on alternative sources to buy a similar tool? Thanks. Tom Hard to answer, did you ask around? How about internet. I still have the original package stating: "AmPro compact offset oxygen sensor wrench, T75518; 22 mm" Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.