i_c_the_light Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 So here's what's happened. I have my '86 RX/II to my mechanic with an engine that I borked pretty bad. I also gave him an '87 RX/II with a damn sweet engine to replace it with. The replacement engine was going sweet in the '87 body, I had it running for ages no worries. The engine that I rooted was going great till I annhiliated it too - don't ask, I didn't know that the EA doesn't like to be abused as much as an EJ. Anyways, fast forward to 2 days ago and I ring him up and ask how it's coming along. He says the replacement engine is in and going, the car can be driven around but has some issues. Despite the fact that the engine wasn't running right, I picked her up anyway. Now here is the fun part! Cold starts first time are no worries. Any starting afterwards while still warm becomes impossible. It constantly cranks and cranks and will only start if lots of throttle is applied. When it's going the idle is stupidly high, regardless of operating temperature, and there is lots of missing, bucking and jerking at decent throttle. It's also gulping through the fuel and when I pulled the freshly put in like 2 days ago sparkplugs yesterday they were black. So given all that information....What could be the matter? The mechanic has said that he'll remove every single electrical component from the old engine (including the loom) and put them into the new engine, and hoping that'll solve the issue...but I'm turning to you guys for a more expert opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joostvdw Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 no starting while it's hot is a classic broken coil symptom, I'm guessing you have 2 coils (one from the donor and one from the driver) just swap them and see if anything changes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 16, 2007 Author Share Posted August 16, 2007 Okay, that'll solve one issue, now what about the rest the symptoms. Heck, I forgot to mention it's lighting up a CE, and I've already tried to get the codes from it and it doesn't even want to give anything up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joostvdw Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 a bad coil will give you a rich situation because the plugs don't clean themselves. fix the coil first and then check for the other problems some simple things to check, wiring to and from the MAF and CTS, just wiggle the wiring loom, if the idle changes, you've found your problem. run the car at night, see if sparks fly between plug cables. no vacuum leaks? timing belts installed correctly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john in KY Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 Ruptured FPR? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calebz Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 The mechanic has said that he'll remove every single electrical component from the old engine (including the loom) and put them into the new engine, and hoping that'll solve the issue...but I'm turning to you guys for a more expert opinion. In the US, 86 to 87 was the time they went from Vane to hotwire MAF and associated changeds in wiring and ECU. Is this not the case where you are? Also, instead of changing every component and the loom, it is much less time intensive to simply swap the intake manifolds with the associated parts and wiring still attached. EDIT: +1 on the coil. If you have another parts car, slap the other coil in there. Takes 5 minutes and might help quite a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 16, 2007 Author Share Posted August 16, 2007 In the US, 86 to 87 was the time they went from Vane to hotwire MAF and associated changeds in wiring and ECU. Is this not the case where you are? Also, instead of changing every component and the loom, it is much less time intensive to simply swap the intake manifolds with the associated parts and wiring still attached. EDIT: +1 on the coil. If you have another parts car, slap the other coil in there. Takes 5 minutes and might help quite a lot. When the swap was done, the maf from the '86 was used, and I actually have no idea if the '86/'87 are different, but I'm going to assume that they are different. Now......that donor car....yeah...kicking myself for dropping off at the wrecker after the engine was pulled from it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 The 87 intake has a different TPS, used with a different type of ECU and MAF. It would be here in the US anyway. As well, 87 had a solenoid to control boost, you're 86 probably doesn't have this solenoid. Thirdly the Distributor are different as well. I'm assuming he must have swapped that at least already though cause IDT it would even run otherwise. The 86 ignition system uses a 2 prong Knock sensor, which needs swapped as well. So you will need to: Plumb a tube directly from the turbo outlet to the wastgate. Just run about a 6 inch hose from the nipple on the outlet to the wastgate. Swap over the 86 intake. Or swap these componets from one to the other. The harness, the TPS, the thermovacuum valve and re-route the vacuum according to the 86 chart. Make sure the 86 disty and knock sensor 2 prong are installed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 17, 2007 Author Share Posted August 17, 2007 The 87 intake has a different TPS, used with a different type of ECU and MAF. It would be here in the US anyway. As well, 87 had a solenoid to control boost, you're 86 probably doesn't have this solenoid. Thirdly the Distributor are different as well. I'm assuming he must have swapped that at least already though cause IDT it would even run otherwise. The 86 ignition system uses a 2 prong Knock sensor, which needs swapped as well. So you will need to: Plumb a tube directly from the turbo outlet to the wastgate. Just run about a 6 inch hose from the nipple on the outlet to the wastgate. Swap over the 86 intake. Or swap these componets from one to the other. The harness, the TPS, the thermovacuum valve and re-route the vacuum according to the 86 chart. Make sure the 86 disty and knock sensor 2 prong are installed You mean the boost control solenoid? Both have them though. Slight problem with the wrecker deciding the crush the car hours after I dropped it off to them. Didn't know that there was big changes over a year! Luckily the original engine was kept with all it's sensors. Now for the fun job of changing it all over! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keppelk Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Hey another Dunedinite!! I've got a 1986 Vortex and have had some problems like what you are describing. My problem turned out to be the connection from the engine harness to the engine temperature sensor. The sensor is in the water passage in the inlet manifold and has a black plastic cnx on top (not to be confused with the temp guage sender on the thermostat housing). Somewhere on this site there is a write up on how to permanently fix the connector. Also sing out if you need any help, I have a set of the Subaru factory manuals for the 1985 model year. Good luck getting her sorted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 17, 2007 Author Share Posted August 17, 2007 Hey another Dunedinite!! I've got a 1986 Vortex and have had some problems like what you are describing. My problem turned out to be the connection from the engine harness to the engine temperature sensor. The sensor is in the water passage in the inlet manifold and has a black plastic cnx on top (not to be confused with the temp guage sender on the thermostat housing). Somewhere on this site there is a write up on how to permanently fix the connector. Also sing out if you need any help, I have a set of the Subaru factory manuals for the 1985 model year. Good luck getting her sorted PM in progress. It's indeed a small world! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 The changeover in ECU did indeed occur between '86 and '87 in our part of the world too. As Gloyale said, there are a number of parts that will need to be changed..... But your problem does sound a lot like an incorrect coolant temperature sensor was installed..... I'm not sure if these changed when the new ECU was brought in or not..... I had very similar symptoms when I installed an intake manifold on my ea81t which had been being used with a LINK ecu. Turned out that the CTS was just different. +1 for just swapping the entire intake manifold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 17, 2007 Author Share Posted August 17, 2007 Such a simple engine, with so many problems! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centrifugal Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Such a simple engine, with so many problems! hey, that's what i kept saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrlynx Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 I have an -86 EA82T and my sister have have an -87 EA82T both sitting in my garage. We have just rebulit her engine so I Know the harness is different. If you want me to compare any details in them just shout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Such a simple engine, with so many problems! yeah, get an ea81t, ohv all the way! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 18, 2007 Author Share Posted August 18, 2007 Well thanks for the help everyone. I'm going to give the go ahead to my mechanic to do a complete electrical swap on Monday, but I've got a bit of rust work to sort out before I can even get the car road legal again. Wish me luck, and hopefully my 2 doors sports car will give me a bucket load of fun again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 24, 2007 Author Share Posted August 24, 2007 BUMP AND UPDATE!! Well believe it or not I fixed all the issues with a sensor that wasn't even plugged in. So even though there are apparent wiring differences, the car worked like a dream. Note the word worked because 10 minutes later outside the mechanics workshop to tell him he doesn't have to replace the entire loom and sensors the engine decided to dump the contents of the coolant system onto the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 25, 2007 Share Posted August 25, 2007 BUMP AND UPDATE!! Well believe it or not I fixed all the issues with a sensor that wasn't even plugged in. So even though there are apparent wiring differences, the car worked like a dream. Note the word worked because 10 minutes later outside the mechanics workshop to tell him he doesn't have to replace the entire loom and sensors the engine decided to dump the contents of the coolant system onto the ground. That calls for the ol' whiskey-tango-foxtrot response... WTF?! how did, what happened? water pump crap out? Are you of Irish heritage perchance? This sounds like my luck... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 25, 2007 Author Share Posted August 25, 2007 I really don't know how what or why. I'll find out from my so called 'mechanic' in the next couple of days. This is the last time he gets to touch my cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 27, 2007 Author Share Posted August 27, 2007 The brand new water pump was defective, so no worries there. Car is pretty much going great, even with the supposedly different looms. Now to sort out an AWIC and one mean arse BOV. Gotta have the pssst! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted August 28, 2007 Share Posted August 28, 2007 Now to sort out an AWIC and one mean arse BOV. Gotta have the pssst! You'll find that gets a bit messy during gear changes, since all that air you're letting out has been metered..... BOVs are really only suitable for MAP based engine management systems.... better to go with a BPV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keppelk Posted August 28, 2007 Share Posted August 28, 2007 I have to agree with Ross there. A recirculating blow off valve still give you the psssssshhhhhh, but instead of dumping all that metered air into the atmosphere (along with all the pressure your turbo put into it) you put it back into the loop pre-turbo. That way the turbo doesn't suffer nearly as much deceleration and is faster to spool to boost in the next gear. I'm going to have my WAIC inlet and outlet pipes welded with some extensions so I don't need as many joins or silicon. I'll probably get a plate on the outlet pipe to mount a blow off valve with a recirc kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_c_the_light Posted August 28, 2007 Author Share Posted August 28, 2007 Yes I know all about the whole BOV/BPV thing, had one on my Legacy for a bit so I could spit fireballs out of the exhaust. Didn't notice that much of a difference. Now what I'm looking at Keppel is rotate the compressor housing so the turbo outlet is facing in the right direction. For the throttle body side of the intercooler I'm going to sort out some silicon piping for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted August 28, 2007 Share Posted August 28, 2007 I'm going to have my WAIC inlet and outlet pipes welded with some extensions so I don't need as many joins or silicon. I'll probably get a plate on the outlet pipe to mount a blow off valve with a recirc kit. I'm in the process of making some fibreglass pipes for a legacy awic on mine.... nothing like making things difficult for yourself ay! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.