75 replies to this topic

[eulogious]

Ok ,so to start off, this is not a question about wiring or what to buy, I just have a question on a mounting location idea that I had for my amps that I am going to install. I could just go simple and install one under the seat, and then attach the other amp to the sub box when I get a sub and be all boring, but what's cool about that? I want to be different...

I would like to mount the amp where it is visible when I want it to be, and invisible when I want it to be and also not take up any useful space. So the conclusion that I came to was mount the amp(s) (soon to be one more for a sub) in the small compartment in the back of my wagon, right by the hatch, under the carpet. That space should be big enough for 2 amps and all the wiring associated with them. I was thinking about removing the metal door that is on there now and replacing it with a piece of acrylic and cutting the carpet back to have it always exposed. That way I could still put stuff in the back without having to worry about hitting the amps, and I could still show it off if I wanted too, and it doesn't take up any useful space (right now my compartment has rags and a funnel in it so those won't be hard to relocate), and it will make it easy to make room, because only the sub and it's box will be in the way. It's alot easier to remove just a sub, rather than a sub with an amp attached to it.

Then there's the problem of cooling/airflow for the amps. So I was thinking about just installing a couple 120mm fans the acrylic with grills on top of them in to provide air flow (2 of them, one blowing in and one blowing out) so I could still use the back area and not worry too much about it.

Granted it will take more wire to get back to that compartment, but what other downsides are there to installing my amps in that compartment? What's the access like to that compartment for wires and such? I am not going to be wheeling this car anywhere near water that is going to be getting back there, so that is not a concern of mine. The compartment is sealed from the outside now, so that shouldn't be an issue either, so it seems like a great place to put some amps!

What do you all think of this idea?

Edited by eulogious, 03 May 2010 - 06:05 PM.

[xbeerd]

i dont think it'd be hard to do, you run the wires along the sides of the car, then you might have to modify the bumper mount/sleeve etc to allow the wires to go thru, maybe weld in a piece of steel tubing as a channel from one side to the other, otherwise, i think there are a couple drain holes that are plugged on the back of the space you might be able to sneak wires to.

overall tho, i think the fans would work out just fine, as long as your have some air movement it should be ok, could probably only use one fan as it'll pull outside air in as it pushes it out.

[eulogious]

It looks doable for sure. The only thing I am not really sure about is how far back the rear bumper goes. It looks like it doesn't go all the way back, so I can drill through and run my wires...

I took some measurements and the dimensions of the compartment are: 37.5"L 11.25"W and then the depth is a little funky: from the left going right it's 3.25" Deep for 12" and then the rest of it is 4.5" Deep.

My amp(s) (Phoenix Gold Tantrum 600.4) dimensions are 14.25"L 10"W 2.35"H, so it fits no problem. The other amp I was considering is the Phoenix Gold rsd1200.1 for my sub that I get eventually. And that's a pretty big amp for sure. It's dimensions are 19.25"l 11 3/16"W 2 3/8"H so it would fit, but it would be super tight. Well nothing that a BFH hammer can't fix zzz

Here are some pics:

Here's the compartment I am talking about in case someone doesn't know:




Here's why it's deeper on side than the other...


So this looks like where I will have to drill to get access for my power wire. I think that the bumper doesn't come all the way back, so it should be easy to install some grommets to get the wire through safely...




Same deal with the other side, just it will be the RCA's instead of power.




Here's my HU, and old one but a gooder



I think that I am going to use some MDF and create a custom surround for it, I have just been lazy...

So I just found out that I have basically blown both sets of speakers I thought worked, so I am going to get some new ones here eventually :-\ Hopefully sooner rather than later. So I was looking at getting the PG Rsd 6.5cs'. They look like good speakers for cheap Anyway I go it's going to be components. So I am going to mount the tweeters here and make a nice fiberglass thing around it, and make it look all fancy. It should be a fun project...

Here's my "sail panel":



The Speaker:



The cs' are a litte deep than my others, so I will have to probably mount them on the outside of the grill. Should be "simple"

The other door:



So that's my plan. Here it is boiled down. I think that I am going to go Phoenix Gold gear all the way. Except for the HU of course

1. Install my Tantrum 600.4 once I get it working.
2. Make a new surround for my HU.
3. Buy new front speakers, then make sail panels for the tweets.
4. Buy new 6x9 for the rears (thinking rsd here as well)
5. Buy a new class D amp (rsd1000.1, or maybe old skool PG stuff, or route 66 )
6. Buy a 12 RSDC and build a nice box for it.
7. Upgrade alt to a 90amp maxima one, the piss rump roast 55amper in there now can suck my balls. It might just kill it with my Tantrum
8. Upgrade wiring in car to handle new alt and amps
9. Add a cap just for ************s and giggles.
10. Enjoy my new stereo in my roo!

Granted all this is going to take some time. I am BROKE right now, so I am just doing what I can with the very little money I have. Come November after my wedding and all that crap, I wil be able to spend some money on myself, so we shall see what happens then

[xbeerd]

the bumper probably doesnt go more than a little past half way back in that box, if you wanted to, pop those black plugs out and just remove the bumper and measure the distance from the bolt hole in the bumper to the rear of the bumper post. then measure that much back from the center of the hole.

you should be able to remove the bumper with minimal effort. i think i swapped my bumpers in about 20 mins, and half that time was lining it up straight before final torques. i THINK its a 14mm socket on that bolt. i could be wrong tho.

is that small plug on the top on each side of the thing removable? if so, pop that out and look inside and see what you see. but if you stayed with in a few inches of the back *hinge side* you should be fine. just make sure you use some good gromets and then make sure seal it up so no water gets in.

why 6x9's for the rears? and not just a good quality replacement that fits the stock hole? or will you not be using the door holes?

[eulogious]

The 6x9's were installed by the pervious owner in the cargo area. I have no rear door speakers. Works out ok, since the 6x9 can have a lot more power to them

I poped those covers off on the back of the box and it just goes up at an angle to the top. About 2" of room, and that's it. So nothing to work with there. I will probably remove the bumper, or I just might be daring and see what happens zzz zzz

I will have to make sure once the wire is in, it's all sealed up for sure. If it's exposed, I just just run a pipe through first, even more protection. I will cross that bridge once I start zzz

[eulogious]

Ok, so in this image:



If I was to drill through the support towards the front of the car, is it exposed on the bottom, or is it covered up? My worry is that it is exposed to the ground, and that stuff could kick up into there and damage my wires. I got under the car and looked, but could really tell... So if that is the case I was thinking drilling the hole, and then running some plastic electrical conduit through the holes (easier than welding...), and then running my wires through the conduit. That way the wires wouldn't be exposed to the elements. Is that overkill?

Edited by eulogious, 30 April 2010 - 03:37 AM.

[crazyman03]

pretty nifty setup. 'corse this is probably too late into it but. I installed my amps in the rear side storage panels. origionally (when i had a smaller amp) i just installed it right in there.. but when i got a bigger one i made a door on the side and mounted them right in there and had a little show door on the side. no cargo area loss and airflow? i put fans on the sides in the cubby and put the exhaust fan on the side facing the tail lights.


I wish i had a picture.. i'm sure i have one laying around here somewhere but thats always an option too.. that and you can have both amps in a similar area and you dont have to worry about tools banging up your amps


-Justin

[eulogious]

pretty nifty setup. 'corse this is probably too late into it but. I installed my amps in the rear side storage panels. origionally (when i had a smaller amp) i just installed it right in there.. but when i got a bigger one i made a door on the side and mounted them right in there and had a little show door on the side. no cargo area loss and airflow? i put fans on the sides in the cubby and put the exhaust fan on the side facing the tail lights.


I wish i had a picture.. i'm sure i have one laying around here somewhere but thats always an option too.. that and you can have both amps in a similar area and you dont have to worry about tools banging up your amps


-Justin

I haven't actually started the install yet, I was waiting on my fets and caps to show up so I could fix my amp. It's all fixed up now though

That's a good idea to put them in the side, but this amp is WAY to big and heavy for that. It's a 75x4 RMS 600watt amp. It weighs at least 30 pounds, is 14" long and 10" wide. It would probably rip the interior panel right off! Not to mention where you are talking about I have 6x9 speakers that were installed by the previous owner. So that space isn't available to begin with. After both these amps get installed into that cubby, there isn't going to room for anything, let alone tools, so I don't have to worry about that. As it sits now, if I get that sub amp, I will have 3/4" on the long side of the amps les than 1/4" on the width, and about 1/4" before it hits the top of the cubby. It's super tight. Thanks for the idea though!

So I did some more digging around, and it looks like I can just drill through that area and be fine with some grommets. Now I have to go remove my RCA's from my MR2 and find all my old wiring :-\

Here's a pic of the amp:

Edited by eulogious, 01 May 2010 - 02:54 AM.
Pic...

[crazyman03]

Thats a nice looking amp. I havent done much with installing in my 'roo. I dont want to put too much money in this one.. at most, offroading gear.

I never thought of putting the 6x9s in that cubby. thats a good idea too. Ya know what you could do, build a wall on both sides, relocate the 6x9's up a bit and you'd have a bit more room. same idea as before.. more than likly you'd have to take the entire side trim and re-do it. i donno, I'm stingy when it comes to where i can and cannot put tools especially when the car practically comes with its own tool box. Just an idea.

Under the seats work. but you have to watch it when people get in the back with wet feet. I did it on my jeep but i have a cubby under the back seats.
Pic:

album: http://albums.mo-pow...t=albums&id=167


I've done it with my old GL-10, (under the front seats) but i play with my amps too much and they are hard to get to.. that and i like to show them off.


-Justin

[crazyman03]

just to add. I'm not trying to steal your topic and say its not any good. I think it'll work out great whatever way you do it

-Justin

[xbeerd]

That part is part of the frame i believe, should be sealed all the way around unless you have a rust problem. gromets should work fine.

[eulogious]

Thats a nice looking amp. I havent done much with installing in my 'roo. I dont want to put too much money in this one.. at most, offroading gear.

I never thought of putting the 6x9s in that cubby. thats a good idea too. Ya know what you could do, build a wall on both sides, relocate the 6x9's up a bit and you'd have a bit more room. same idea as before.. more than likly you'd have to take the entire side trim and re-do it. i donno, I'm stingy when it comes to where i can and cannot put tools especially when the car practically comes with its own tool box. Just an idea.

Under the seats work. but you have to watch it when people get in the back with wet feet. I did it on my jeep but i have a cubby under the back seats.

I've done it with my old GL-10, (under the front seats) but i play with my amps too much and they are hard to get to.. that and i like to show them off.

-Justin

I really like this amp. I have had it for about 6 years, and after I fixed it I should have many more years with it. It's a very solid amp. Phoenix Gold makes some quality stuff. I have been very pleased with this amp. I am glad I got it when I did, and kept it around.

So far I have been able to piece together my install stuff for super cheap. Like under $40, including stuff I had kicking around already. I am broke, so I don't have a choice to do this on the cheap

I don't ever use that space for tools. I have a rubber maid container already in the back on my car for my tools, and my tool box is always in my car, so I still have plenty of storage in my roo. In fact I never use that area at all. I think I have opened in my 5 time in the last 6 months, and that was to see if something just happen to be in there. So I will not miss the space at all. I fact I will finally be able to use it for something!

I like your install in the jeep. Hidden is good I thought about putting them under the seat, but I wanted to be different and try something new. That and I really like projects, and this will be my first install were I actually am going to try to do a really nice job, just to see if I can. I like the challenge

just to add. I'm not trying to steal your topic and say its not any good. I think it'll work out great whatever way you do it

-Justin

It's all good! That's why I started the thread, to get ideas about installing this stuff! Thanks for the tips and info!

That part is part of the frame i believe, should be sealed all the way around unless you have a rust problem. gromets should work fine.

Sweet. That's kinda what I thought when I got under the car. It looked like it should work ok. Thanks for the confirmation though

So I changed the title and figured I would post pics of the install, and the install process, that way if someone else want to do this, they have a good starting point

I have been busy acquiring parts for the install, and still been able to do it for cheap!

Here's everything:


Here's my 8" Solobaric that I decided to use out of my MR2 and my cap with a digital volt meter. I figured I might as well get some bumps now since I have a sub and an amp



Here's my 17' RCA's, 40' of 16awg speaker wire, 17' of 0awg for the power (thanks true2blue!), some 4awg to run to my amps, some connectors for 0awg wire, and 20awg remote turn on wire.



Here's some wire loom, and my LPL for my amp to control the bass remotely.



Here's my power distribution stuff for my amps and some fuses as well as the grommets...



My plan is to run my amp in the following config:

Front speakers run off the front channel on the amp under a 4 ohm load (75 watts rms x2) and then bridge the rear channel to run my sub on a 2 ohm load (300 watts RMS x1, yes it is 2 ohm stable and within it's specs ) and then run the rear speakers off the deck power for now. That will give me plenty of power up front to power the mids and the highs, and then the sub will have plenty of noise to be able to hear it as well. This is basically the same setup I had in the MR2 before I blew the amp, and then gutted it for it's wires.

Hopefully tomorrow I will get a chance to start running the power wire, the RCA's and speaker wire. I have also picked up a piece of wood to use in the compartment so I can bolt the amps to something.

I think I now have everything I need, I just have to throw it all into the car. This is the fun part for me though

[eulogious]

Made some more progress on it tonight. Got all the wires I needed into the wire loom for easier installation.







I have 5 wires in the wire loom now. My RCA's, 2 20' runs of 16awg speaker wire, my LPL cable, and remote power turn on. I am glad I got the 1/2" wire loom instead of the next size smaller! This will make it much easier to run the wires and keep them organized. Now I just have to put them in the car...

[eulogious]

Progress! And answers to my own questions



If you couldn't tell, you can drill through there no problem and install grommets and be good to go!

More pics!





















I haven't run the power wire yet, but I wanted to make sure it worked with the grommets so I took some pics...







Here's what the amp looks like sitting in there kinda hooked up, to get an idea of what it's going to look like





So ya lots of progress. I got the wood I need to put down as well, so if all goes well I might just have a working amp tomorrow! After I install the power wire I will see where I am at and see if I have time to hook up the amp. That should be fun! In order to run the power wire I am going to remove the fender, good times!

[eulogious]

It works! I got it going today. Man 0 gauge wire is a pain. Luckily I had 17', because I used all 17', and I still can't hook up my cap. I can't find any 0 gauge wire I can buy locally :-\ Oh, well. But it sounds WAY better. No more distortion when I crank it! I will post pics tonight, I am to tired to get them ready, so I will get to that tonight. My car is still torn apart, I ran into a few issues, fixed them, but it works and I tested it and it didn't break on me!

Tomorrow I will put my car back together and really see what it sounds like! It will take some more time to make it pretty, but once it works, I can gussy it up later. I am stoked to finally have bass again!

[crazyman03]

Pretty slick install. Now to make it pretty in the back. Oh, and you might think of bolting your sub down. Makes it harder for people to steal it. Or, and this is what i did.. Build a shelf in the back. Unless you have the pull curtain... Keeps honest people honest... if they cant see it they don't know its there :-D

Oh, i found some pics of an old install i did on my first 'roo



http://mo-power.net/...-shot/09282005/

http://mo-power.net/...era/random/car/

-Justin

Edited by crazyman03, 06 May 2010 - 05:37 PM.

[bobwires]

nice wiring job. now it's time to do a nice wrapping job of that box!

[eulogious]

nice wiring job. now it's time to do a nice wrapping job of that box!

Thanks! The box was one I did about 4 years ago, and it didn't last That is on the list. Now time to make it all look pretty, that's going to be the hard part :-\ but also the fun part

I have pics of my progress, but I left the camera card in the camera, so I don't have access to the pics right now, oh well. I will post pics when I get it almort done.

Edited by eulogious, 07 May 2010 - 07:31 AM.

[eulogious]

Ok, so here are the pics! It's not completely done at all, but it works and I lost no room in my car! I had to consolidate, but everything that was in my car before I started is still in there. I also had to clean up my parents garage before they got home and get out, so I will have to pretty up the install later becuase I ran out of time, but that will be a slow process anyways since I am trying to do it nice for the first time

I ran the power through the fender so I didn't have to punch through the firewall and what not. This was way easier for sure...



This is the factory grommet for the engine wiring harness, so I have lots of extra room to poke through



Feeding it through and running it back







Where I installed my cap. Still don't have a ground for it :-\





Connecting it to the battery



It's all wired up and ready to go!



Testing it...



My car will probably never be this clean again. That and it's so empty...







My LPL (remote bass control)





All back together again.



Here's an idea of what it will look like with th top removed. Needs to be prettied up, but you get the idea.



I ran into some other issues was well. One pair of my RCA's is broke. The end has a bad connection on it :-\ At least that's better than my rear inputs not working on the amp which was what I originally thought it was. So I will get some new end for RCA and see if that fixes it. I have the dreaded alt whine as well, but I am going to look at that soon. I am going to be ordering up some more install pretty stuff soon as well. I am going to replace a bunch of my older stuff with new, but I just want to get something in there for now. I also need to adjust the amp as well. I haven't had time to fiddle with the sound, so that will be happening soon as well.

Other than that it sounds great (minus the alt whine)! I am happy I can finally hear the bass again. What a difference a sub makes for sure!

Edited by eulogious, 08 May 2010 - 02:58 AM.

[eulogious]

Pretty slick install. Now to make it pretty in the back. Oh, and you might think of bolting your sub down. Makes it harder for people to steal it. Or, and this is what i did.. Build a shelf in the back. Unless you have the pull curtain... Keeps honest people honest... if they cant see it they don't know its there :-D

Oh, i found some pics of an old install i did on my first 'roo



http://mo-power.net/...-shot/09282005/

http://mo-power.net/...era/random/car/

-Justin

Nice, you had some bumps for sure in there! You lost some of your storage though, but that ok. It's all in what you want.

I got the pull curtain and I always have that over my stuff. I do not want people to see what I have, unless I show them it

I was truly surprised on how much I don't miss that compartment! I got rid of a few things that I found out I didn't really need, after not touching them in my car for 6 months, and that ended up clearing up all the space I needed. Also I was surprise that my sub fit PERFECTLY in the back. I couldn't believe it. It's seriously like I made it to fit in there, right next to my rubbermaid container. I will take pics of the back all put back together to show what I mean.

I also went out and adjusted the amp, and all I can say is, WOW. What a difference it makes after you adjust the amp and get it tuned in. It sounds really good for just one amp! Once everything was adjusted the alt whine almost went away. It's there, but hardly noticeable. I am going to try to get rid of it, but for now its totally tolerable. So far I really like it. Now I just have to pretty the compartment, and the amp install will be complete!

[bobwires]

that sub will be a little deeper, and probably a little louder if you aim it backward. It's a cheap box. I'd recommend building a new one and wrapping it up right. nice work on your end. wiring looks great

[eulogious]

that sub will be a little deeper, and probably a little louder if you aim it backward. It's a cheap box. I'd recommend building a new one and wrapping it up right. nice work on your end. wiring looks great

Well, it's not a cheap box. I built myself. It's made out of 3/4" MDF and it's screwed and glued, and the woofer still takes about 7 seconds to come to rest after being fully pushed in so it's still very much sealed. It's designed for the minimum cf for that sub, as per the manual to fit behind the passenger seat in my MR2. I just didn't use good glue for the carpet I just really don't care right now to fix it. I will probably reglue the carpet and do it nicer and take my time at some point in time. I also didn't really sand the edges of the box or anything I was just in a hurry to get it done, then it sat in my MR2 for about 5 years, so ya. Either way the sub and the box are staying together because it will go back into my MR2 when I rebuild it.

This car is going to getting a Phoenix Gold 12" rdsc sub, and a new box, when I can afford it I just ain't got no moneys!

[eulogious]

I guess I should add that this sub is only temporary as well. It was sitting around not getting used, so I decided to use it, instead of having it collect dust like it has for the last year or so

[bobwires]

Gotcha. I was assuming it was a cheap mass-produced box with the pre-carpeted panels. I think you're method of wrapping is what made it peel - wrapping a box without tuck lines or side inserts is tough, but you can do it in such a way as to avoid the seams on the box corners. The seams there will pull up no matter what glue you use.

[eulogious]

Gotcha. I was assuming it was a cheap mass-produced box with the pre-carpeted panels. I think you're method of wrapping is what made it peel - wrapping a box without tuck lines or side inserts is tough, but you can do it in such a way as to avoid the seams on the box corners. The seams there will pull up no matter what glue you use.

You are correct This was my first attempt at wrapping a box, so I am really not to sad about it. In my MR2 you couldn't see it so I didn't care But next time I will take my time and try to do it better. This install I am doing now is kinda a trial run for when I do the MR2. I am going to completely rewire it and make it better, so I am practicing on my subie. That way in case I mess it up, it's not a big deal