Flo4Legacy

Very nice !

Sorry, can't help you with the speakers. I only put speakers in a Station Wagon - thats another story btw. My question is off-topic: Weren't you planning to get a new(er) Legacy??? I see now that you are a proud owner of an Impreza - congratulations! How do you like it ? What mileage do you get with the 2.0 engine in an Impreza? I once had the opportunity to drive an Impreza with 2.0 and 125 HP for a few days and I felt that the acceleration is almost similiar to my Legacy 2.5 with 156 HP.

@HB_Dad: There are good news for you! The new 3.0R for the new Outback is confirmed. This engine has 250 HP at 6600 rpm (5 more than in Europe :argue: ) And it will have the 5-shift automatic (but without the shifting buttons at the steering wheel). Find out more at http://www.need-desire.com If anybody is interested in the power curve look at this link: http://www.subaru.co.jp/legacy/tw_30r/05/index.html

I am not very into the US prices. But I guess they add it to the top of the line for people that love to blow out money (I saw one of those morons when taking a look in the mirror ). For the other folks, there is still the 2.5 n/a version, which is (or should be ...) reliable, AWD equipped, ... and not too expensive. And for the people between "cheap" and "expensive" there is the 2.5 GT ! I would be a little bit more happy when the 3.0R wouldn't be sooooooo expensive. I have to pay more for it than in US. But I took the time to compare it with an Audi A4 (with Quattro), BMW 5 Series, and Mercedes E. Heck, the Subi is 8.000 - 10.000 EURO under the price of the mentioned cars (with comparable options, BMW and Benz without AWD!). Ok, I don't have THE brand car, but I can handle that. The 3.0R offers a good value for the money. This is a great car. Maybe not for everybody (but I like that). Also the current H6 found his lovers and I guess the sales should be better than for the SVX. Ok again, I quit advertising now ...

Hmm, the factory wheels are very nice, that's true. I was looking at the new Legacy during the IAA 03 in Frankfurt. They had one Station wagon with the factory 17" wheels and also one with 18" wheels. I have to admit that the 17" appear a little bit "small" for the car, the 18" look much better also the body of the car seems to be more compact. You can take a look at the 18" wheels under the following link: http://www.interpneu.de/DATENBLATT/P32.htm I am trying to get them elsewhere but Subaru (they want ¤300 for one piece!)

HB_Dad: Don't think that you'll be dissappointet. Guess they will bring the 3.0R for the US market, because it's very important for the sales. Can't imagine that there "big" sales of the 3.0R in Japan or Europe. This engine will be much more requested in the US.

As already stated I ordered a new Legacy 3.0R Station Wagon last saturday. Unforunately the delivery date is first week of May ... In the meantime I am trying to concentrate on what wheels to get. I asked Subaru of Germany what wheel and tire sizes can be used. So I received the answer today. No 16" allowed! The baby has to wear at least 17" shoes. The font brakes are too big for 16" wheels. The following sizes are already stated in the car papers for 17": 205/50 17 215/45 17 225/45 17 Hmm, that means I have to throw on 17" even for winter! Also possible are: 215/45 18 - 7,5x18 wheel 215/40 18 225/35 18 - 8x18 wheel 225/40 18 I am trying to find some aftermarket wheels with 8x18 and putting the 225/40 on it. Hope this will be a good comprimise of looks/handling and riding qualities. I don't know how this translates to the '05 US Legacy GT, but I guess that it will be the same brake system considering the power.

I already had the opportunity to test drive the new Legacy 3.0R Station Wagon with 245 hp (the torque is 290 NM) Also drove the Outback H6 with 209 PS (here in Europe). There are big differences between both engines. The H6 was a small disappointment concering power - but the smothness is high above the 2.5 H4. I guess that the automatic transmission destroys a lot of the power. But I would prefer the H6 over the H4 if I would buy again. But now the 3.0R is available. Also with a 5 shift automatic. This is really a dream of an engine! It is so much improved over the "old" H6. For example - at first I felt that there is not "enough" power for what I was expectiong, but after checking the speedo and realizing that I was already cruising at 100 kmh - bang! Couldn't believe that. Really didn't hear the engine at 100 kmh (revs were appr. 2000 or lower, can't remember correctly). No vibrations could be felt. After warming up a little bit I decided to let the pedal feel the metal. Wow - what a difference! Must be the AVCS that turns that smooth cat into a wild tiger! Lot's of pulling power and a sound like a sports car. Also testet the direct shift - it's like shifting without a clutch. So I wanted to see how the power delivery is compared to my 2.5 H4 Legacy and gave it full throttle at several gears and speeds. Heck there is a enough power for all of us that are not satisfied with the H4 but don't like turbos (errrr ... we don't have a Legacy Turbo here in Germany anymore ....gggrrrrrr). The engine, the transmission and the suspension are superior (compared to the current H6 Outback). Only had the opportunity to drive the car at 160 kmh max (no time for autobahn driving...). But this was already enough testing for me. I would say that the 3.0R is a good piece faster than the '92 Legacy 2.0 DOHC Turbo with 200 PS that I owned some years ago. The 3.0R can be driven very relaxed. But if needed, it can turn into a racer. (Sorry, but there is no button for chassis transforming during driving - I was missing that...) Not to mention all the bells and whistles this model offers. Leather, electric seats for driver and co-driver, navi system (which offers some more infos during driving like mpg, acceleration and other stuff and could be programmed for inspection intervalls, oil changes ...), 17 inch alloys, VDC, and so on Ok, should stop the advertisement now. I am NO employee of Subaru or any Subaru dealer ... By the way, I fell in love with this car. This love is so strong that I ordered a new Legacy 3.0R Station Wagon in atlantic blue last Saturday! But I have to hold on and wait - delivery is proposed for week 19

AFAIK the agreement included speed limiters "in hardware". I've read several review were the drivers stated that the car won't go over 155 mph. But this special "hardware" could be neutralized by tuners. Mercedes even has the "AMG" brand which is a separate tuner company but can be ordered over the Mercedes dealer. In Mercedes AMG types there never had been this speed limiters! This was the back door concerning the agreement. Some month ago Audi started to produce the RS6 capable of speeds over 250 kmh but still with a speed limiter.

This is partly true. Some brands like BMW, Audi, Mercedes set up an agreement to set the top speed limit at 155 mph (250 km/h). This was an absolutely free decision and had nothing to do with the green party (maybe with the gouverment, but not only the greens). By the way, Porsche never took part in this agreement. In fact the green party wouldn't be satisfied with 155 mph - they would prefer to have a speed limit of ZERO (means no cars at all). But that is another story. Some years ago there was little discussion about a general speed limit at 80 mph but that fortunately didn't get real. There is a recommendend travel speed of 80 mph - but you are allowed to go faster. But at your own risk! This meas, if you are involved in an accident and it isn't your fault, but you drove more than 100 mph, you will automatically get a "part-fault" which means you have to pay 25 % (for example) by yourself. On the other hand, in the times of ABS - who could figure out what the actual speed was??? The agreement for the 155 mph speed limiter is slowly falling. Several brands are pronouncing cars with no speed limiters and top speeds exceeding 155 mph.

Pay attention of fast approaching cars by looking in the back mirror is the key on german autobahns. Frankly said it's hard to drive 130 kmh when there's a lot of traffic. There is an expression in german which translates like "swimming with the traffic". This what you have to do if you want to go the easy way. But take care of the limits! One thing I forgot to mention is the safety distance (right???) which is the half of the current speed in meters. If you are closer to your "front man" then allowed it can get also very expensive. The police will take a nice movie of your "following skills" and then forward the "invoice" to you. 0W-40 Motor oil from castrol or liquy moly is available at every "OBI" market for about 35-40 Euros (5 l). Or go to a "ATU" shop. They offer more brands, maybe also a 0W-50. But I think a 10W-40 will do it for you - this is the type you'll get poured in at the subaru repair shop. Especially if your Sube "needs" some oil. Oil changes are suggested every 12500 kms or every year at least.

The suggested travel speed on german autobahns is 130 kmh (80 mph). But this is only a suggestion and if there's no other speed limit - open end (on the speedo)! Some parts of the autobahn are speed limited, mostly with 80 mph. But the bigger part of the whole autobahn in Germany is not speed limited. Please note! If you ever are going to drive from Köln to Frankfurt on the A3 - please careful. There is a special downhill part near Limburg with a speed limit of 100 km/h (63 mph). There are three traffic sign bridges in a row. The second and third traffic sign bridge are equipped with a hidden speed limit camera! In general, the best advice for driving on german roads is: Stick to the speed limit! You'll never save more money. And take car of red traffic lights. Some also have cameras and if you pass the crossing during the red phase - ding ring ding - you'll be a nice amount of bucks poorer and make your drivers license a nice give away for a nice police officer (but it's only for a month). On the other hand, Germany is one of the cheaper places in Europe for speed limit ignorance. Don't spoil the speed fun with not so funny tickets.

Good to hear that you made up your mind to get a newer Legacy, finally. And not another brand ... From what I heard there are not very much problems with the 2.0 na engine. I am tending to say that it's better than the 2.5 (even sohc). The only thing what I don't really like about this combination is, that the engine is a little bit weak. In an Impreza, this engine behaves really different! It is not slow at all, but also not sporty. I am really surprised about the new 2.0 with 138 hp. Last week I had the chance to drive it for 3 days. It is a big difference to the 125 hp version. It is more quiet, you can "feel" the power increase, and it's getting a better mileage - about 1,5 liter less for 100 km. How much do you have to pay for it? 3years old sounds for about 35% value loss, or? Maybe can wait some month more and get the new model for 20 % less??? I am also having a dilemma at the moment. I can't decide what way to go: A new Legacy with 2.0 eninge and not so much options, or the 3.0R with everything but also a defeated bank account ... The 2.5 would be the way to go, but I don't trust the 2.5 anymore ...

Congratulations VABrat for the new Subaru! Hopy you will like your new toy. Today I took a close look at a silver Baja at the dealers lot. Really like it. The dealers here in Germany import the Baja from the US! There was a review in a german car magazine and surprisingly they liked it.

I own a european spec Legacy Wageon, third generation. My car has the dual range. Low gears by pulling a lever. Very good if you need more power to "take off". It's still AWD - the difference to standard manual gearing is that the dual range provides a "2nd set" of gears with other ratios (not quite 2x5 gears but it act like it would have) By the way, Imprezas Wagons and Legacy Wagons (I think the Forester also but I am not 100% sure) with manual gearing always have the dual range, also the New Legacy (already pulled this special lever for low gear in the new Legacy).

As stated on the other forum (NASIOC), a Subaru Rep gave a hint the Legacy STI will come in 2006/2007 with a 3.0 Turbo engine and 350 hp. The price will be in the near of $ 50.000. Regarding the diesel engine for Subarus there are lot of discussion on german boards. There is no detailed and trust-worthy information if it will come or not. Obviously Subaru is thinking about the diesel dilemma since a long time. But still there is the problem to have the right volume to produce the diesel engines cost-effective. The other problem with diesels are the emmissions - particel filters (now strongly marketed by french car makers!) will definitely help - but increase the costs. Now 40 % of the new cars are diesel engines here in Germany - that would be an interesting business. But I guess it will be getting interesting for Subaru if the American market demands diesel engines more and more. The two biggest markets for Subaru are America and Japan - and in the past both market didn't demand diesels that much. I personally don't like diesels - I always prefer gas engines - despite the advantages of better mileage and decreased costs. Don't forget the higher price of a diesel engine compared to a gas engine. And if you want to have very good diesel engine, you have to sell an arm and leg for it ! And by the way, torque is very nice, but not everything. What would you think, if you could rev your Subie only to 4500 rpm??? But that's the way the diesel works. Don't understand me wrong, it's not slow at all. But it's not that funny. So don't call too loud for the diesel - it's not the ultimate solution.

Subaru shows the B9 Scrambler during the Tokio Motor Show. Look at this webpage: http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/d/46099 Sorry, it's in german. But looks very interesting. Nice study. Why the name scrambler? My first thought was that you'll get scrambled ... hairs.

Legacy 777: I suggest you get a new Legacy GT (with a nice 2.5 Turbo) when it's available and then you have enough time to fix your old friend ... if you are still interested in fixing it. I am planning to get the new 3.0R (as a station wagon) at the beginning of next year .. if I can really afford it. Would prefe the Turbo but that is very unlikely to be offered here in Germany. So I am setting up my mind for "comfortable" driving with the 3.0R

Just looks sooooo shiny! Incredible! Like it just rolled out of the factory. It is good to see the nice results of hard work. Will you be able to separate from your car when the new Turbo Legacy is available???

280.000 Km and still only 8l/100 km ??? You are lucky! And 280.000 km are not to bad at all. My 2.5 GX '98 needs at least 9,5 l/100 km and about 10.5 - 11.5 l/100 km on the highway (autobahn). Ok, I have to admit that the average speed on the autobahn seldom falls under 150 km/h - more in the near of 200 km/h

Yes that's right. It looks like the new 3.0 won't get a manual. The chances are at least ... low. By the way, the new sport shift automatic is said to be really improved. My brother drove a 2.0 with this new type and he was happy with it. Especially the manual mode seems to be good - you can shift similar to a "normal" manual gearbox. There is no "lag" when the lever is pushed. And it also will not shift by itself - although if you are at the redline! My brother told me it's like normal shifting - only without a clutch.

Hey, I want a horse, too! Is it cheaper than a new Legacy??? Yesterday I had the opportunity to test drive the new model. Unforunately it was only the 2.0 engine with 138 HP. But I was really surprised how quick the new Legacy is - this engine isn't bad at all! It's similar to my current 2.5 Legacy. Think that has something to do with the weight loss. The driving feel is improved. The car turns easier into to corners, and you you have a "safer" while driving. It's too hard for me to describe all the details that has been improved. But if you drive it, you surely will see what's gotten better. BTW, I don't understand why Subaru introduces the new models at different dates to several countries. First Japan, then Europe, than US. That's nearly a marketing suicide! :madder:

Today I I've been at at the IAA in Frankfurt/Germany. And of course, the first I did was visiting the Subaru booth. There was the beauty, the new Legacy (and Outback). I started to examine the 3.0 Wagon, took a seat and a look into the engine bay. All I have to say is: I am really impressed. Ok, for a Subaru, this is in fact a luxury car (although with sporty roots). It is a big step forward compared to the current model. It is also as good as other brands (Audi, Mercedes, BMW ...). Also the base model (2.0 in Germany) is very nice - in lack of leather but with very very fine seats! But I don't need to compare this Subaru with other brands! I love Subaru for what the are doing and it's always been another way of feel to drive a Subaru than any other brand. Of course, there are details that could be better. Or Subaru could offer more options. But what do you do with all the options if the base is no good??? I was on a business trip and drove our BMW 525d (diesel) over 1300 km. It is really a good car. But after that trip a brought the BMW to the company and got back my Sube. The Sube is not that silent as the BMW - but after I drove home I knew why I love my Subaru. You can't compare the sporty driving of the Sube with the "comfortable" driving of the BMW. I have to say there is something right with that what drquasievil said. A Subaru just can't be compared with other makes. And we all could be happy that Subaru don't tries to imitate Audi, BMW or Mercedes! Imagine what car we would get! No thanks. Subaru is doing a great job and they always looked for good technical solutions that don't have to be mainstream - but still are good (or even better). BTW, even I compared the prices of the new Legacy 3.0 with an Audi A4 3.0 (although smaller) and a BMW 530i. Not that I would be interested in buying that cars - only to see what the price differences are. The Audi was 7000 Euro more (incl Quattro) and the BMW was 10000 Euro more (without AWD) - all models with comparable options. Ok, hope this is not to much of a commercial for Subaru ... :wave: But what I saw today - I am just impressed! Don't know what the options for the US will look like, but I am sure that it is worth the wait!

Hmmm, is there any big difference between the schweizer und the german spec? The car seems to be cheaper in Switzerland. About 8 %. Hmm. I have to check this out when I buy my car. Do you know how much discount you can get from a schweizer dealer ??? Maybe I just have to push a german dealer a little bit more ...

Applegump, is the price of CHF 53.500 for the Wagon 3.0 incl. navi already incl. the VAT of 7,6%??? If yes, then the price would be in fact cheaper (by about 7 %) If not, then the price differnce is the VAT ! Also checked out the insurance classes for the new Legacy. The new 2.5 and 3.0 should be a slightly cheaper.