ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 First off, please forgive me, I am new to the forum - just got my first Subaru two days ago from a posting on Craigslist. Drove her once and fell head over heels in lurve on the spot. So. She was fine - drove like a dream until I leave the grocery store and BAM won't start, click click click when I turn the ignition. Classic signs of dead battery. However, the battery was new per last owner. Now either I am the physical embodiement of 'A sucker is born every minute' OR it's the alternator. Why I think it's the alternator: whine after the car was jumped + faulty gas tank reading + dimming lights (thought that was my imagination until the click click click). Keep in mind that I am committed to this beauty - if she is a she as the last owner claims- then I have found out something new about myself because so am I, but I digress. I love this car and I desperately want us to have happy funtimes together. So. I defer to the collective wisdom of the Ultimate Subaru Messageboard; does this sound correct? Could this be an alternator issue? If so, should I replace the core as well? I have done some work on cars, I have replaced the water pump/thermostat in an '84 Renault Encore (my first car and affectionately named 'The Bitch') I have an attached two-car garage with all sorts of tools. I should add that I noticed a distinct dimming of the dashboard lights as well, but chalked that up to a possibly overactive imagination. Oh and I am already plotting a belt/pulley job + valve cover gaskets job. I currently have a running '99 Jeep Cherokee so I could easily spend the time doing this. My question is: does it sound like an alternator issue? Should I replace the core as well? Is there anything special I should look out for? Attached is the photo of my newly found love. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmdew Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 Most likely the Starter. Are the headlights bright? The Starter contacts get pitted and you don't have the voltage going through them. You can search the USMB, Starter Contacts. Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Oh and just wanted to add: I am not a troll, just have a funny way of talking . I've wanted a Subaru OUtback since I was a lowly college student. So this is like a dream come true and I might be a little over excited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 the dash warning lights should appear dim or start glowing when they sould be out if the alternator is not charging. It's likely the alternator is failing. You can have it load tested. The serpentine belt and alternator mounting is very simple, it can be removed with 12mm tools. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbolt1003 Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 Did your brake light in the instrument cluster happen to come on once the car was running? I just replaced the alternator in my '95 Impreza a few weeks ago and the brake light coming on was one of the tell-tale signs I read about that the alternator was bad. When the car is running, what voltage are you getting at both the battery and the stud on the alternator? Should be up around 14.2V. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Oh! yes the headlights were bright after the jump AND I had all accessories - so maybe it IS the starter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 I have not checked the voltage, I will need to dig out the voltimeter. I just LOve. This. Car. The voltimeter will be tomorrow. I can replace the alternator and go from there. There was no brake light just the standard 'oh you turned hte key' lights and then click click click when I tried to turn it over. Headlights were bright AFTER the jump. But I keep thinking they were dim before. I'd driven it about 15 miles prior to the stop at the store Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 If you heard a steady fairly load clicking while trying to start the engine the problem is most likely due to poor battery connections on the battery posts. The first thing you want to do is remove the battery connections and clean the posts and the connections with a battery post cleaning brush. Hopefully that solves the problem. It's one of the most common causes for starting issues there is. Don't over tighten the battery clamps when you put them back on, another common problem. While under the hood make sure the alternator belt is tight and the output lead is in good condition and not showing signs of burning. Check the voltage getting to the battery while the engine is running about 1,500 RPM and the lights are on. You should have at least 13.5 volts getting to the battery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Ok. So I will check voltage tomorrow AM, provided she starts. I suppose I could do the alternator and starter. She's almost 20 years old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Battery posts are spotless, my jeep did have that problem earlier this winter. Was it dumb to buy a '96? She is so much fun to drive, I love the mix of car/SUV so much more than the stiff handling of the Jeep and the boxer is so quiet compared to the inline 6 of the Cherokee. I'm not kidding when I say that I drove her for two hours straight last night just for fun through drifting snow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 Starter contacts going "bad" is quite common in cars with a few years on them. Remove the starter, open the back of the solenoid and you'll see the contacts. Should be available for $10 or 15 at an auto-electric shop--or even on ebay. As Larry said, try a search on here--or Google "Subaru Starter Contacts"--and you'll find lots of help. Enjoy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Next question - the engine runs at 1000 RPM when idling - is this OK? I have two vehicles idle higher than this - a 99 Jeep Cherokee and an '05 ford Taurus. both seem to idle too high. Also there is a noticeable whine, which wasn't there before the issue at the store. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Thanks! Have many things to check tomorrow. Hope I am snowed in so I can work on car rather than go to work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subaru_dude Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 (edited) Is that a manual transmission car? And we've had a '96 Legacy sedan (mechanically the same as a '96 Outback with a manual trans [manual trans Outback comes with the same 2.2 engine as the regular Legacy instead of the 2.5 the automatic Outbacks got in '96]), and a '96 Outback and the alternators have gone out on both. Every Subaru I've ever had as a matter of fact has always needed an alternator at some point. I've had like ten.... Edited January 21, 2014 by Subaru_dude 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Is that a manual transmission car? And we've had a '96 Legacy sedan (mechanically the same as a '96 Outback with a manual trans [manual trans Outback comes with the same 2.2 engine as the regular Legacy instead of the 2.5 the automatic Outbacks got in '96]), and a '96 Outback and the alternators have gone out on both. Every Subaru I've ever had as a matter of fact has always needed an alternator at some point. I've had like ten.... I really wanted a manual, but no, it's an automatic with the 2.5L. Our Autozone has an alternator for $123 which seems high, but - it's an older car... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 You might want to consider other more economical options for an alternator--go to a pull-n-pay or salvage yard. Pull one from a wrecked car--that means it was probably running before it got there! Or check with a starter/alternator rebuild shop--there's usually a respected one in every region. Ask an old-timer mechanic for his recommendation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
later_Peter Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 or: go to the local Subaru dealer. get a remanufactured Subaru alternator for under $80, with a warranty...replacement is an easy job to do... (if it is your alternator... starter sounds very likely, though) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasy Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 Next question - the engine runs at 1000 RPM when idling - is this OK? I have two vehicles idle higher than this - a 99 Jeep Cherokee and an '05 ford Taurus. both seem to idle too high. Also there is a noticeable whine, which wasn't there before the issue at the store. I have a 96 Outback with auto. The idle speed with a warm engine is 650-700 with AC off. Has been like this in the past 17 years. This is measured with a Scangauge II which gets its info from the car's ECU. The rpm needle on the gauge is in the middle between 0 and 1. If you need an alternator, many people suggest getting a remanufactured one from the dealer. They was a recall for your car's alternator many years ago (I had mine replaced under the recall around 2001). So the dealers have plenty of reman for a very reasonable price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 An autozone alternator will bite you in the rump roast and costs more than a dealer Reman. If it turns out that you need an alternator, get it from a dealer. Worn Starter contacts would be my first thought, but If the lights were dim that suggests the battery charge is low. Which would point to the alternator. As said before, check the battery voltage with the engine off. You should have about 12.4v. Less than that indicates a low charge. Start the engine and check voltage again. Should be about 14.5v. It could be higher than that for a few seconds as it brings up the battery charge. If it stays above that for more than about a minute that's a good indicator that the battery is weak and needs a thorough re-charge. With the engine running and everything warm (after a 10-15 minute drive) check system voltage again. Should be about 13.5v. Turn on all the lights, rear defrost, blower on high, and check voltage again. It should still be close to 13.5v, or a little higher. Below 13v means the alternator can't produce enough amperage and needs to be replaced. Whining sound could be many things. Could be the alternator. Check the power steering fluid level. The PS pumps tend to leak. Could also be the idler tensioner for the AC belt. Use a stethoscope or long handle screwdriver to find the source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Thanks for the information on the rebuilt alternator. I'll check the dealership in town. After work I'll do the battery voltage testing and check possible causes for the whining. This engine is so quiet otherwise. I'm wondering if the previous owner replaced the cap/plugs/wires/battery because he thought that's where the problem was but it turned out to be the alternator all along. We'll see. The other bit of investigating that I have not done yet is confirm that it's the stock 2.5L engine and has not had a 2.2 swapped in. Just because the seller kept saying it WAS a 2.2L which is not possible unless there was a swap since it's an automatic. It's been very cold the last few nights and I have not been able to crawl around it to see. I've looked at the battery and it's contacts and ...that's about it so far. Yes. Not certain what engine is in it yet bought it anyway....no regrets. Would be awesome if someone HAD swapped in a 2.2L though. I think the whine could be the power steering, now that I think about it - very familiar noise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 2.2 swap is VERY common since its the a more reliable alternative to the DOHC 2.5 that came in that car originally. They like to pop head gaskets, then eat the rod bearings because they are usually overheated multiple times in the course of figuring out that the head gaskets are bad. Very easy to tell by the shape of the timing cover, and the shape of the valve covers. 2.2 valve covers have 4 humps on the top. 2.5 covers are mostly flat. 2.2 the plug wires stick out at an angle above the valve covers. 2.5 the plug wires stick into holes in the middle of the valve covers. 2.2 the timing cover has rounded ends. 2.5 timing cover has large squared ends, kinda looks like a bow-tie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 You would be wise to get on Ebay and purchase a factory service manual for the car. There is no good substitute for a factory manual and it will save you a lot of time when you need to work on things, especially the electrical systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 You would be wise to get on Ebay and purchase a factory service manual for the car. There is no good substitute for a factory manual and it will save you a lot of time when you need to work on things, especially the electrical systems. Yep, been scouring for one. I am anxious to get home now. 2.2 swap is VERY common since its the a more reliable alternative to the DOHC 2.5 that came in that car originally. They like to pop head gaskets, then eat the rod bearings because they are usually overheated multiple times in the course of figuring out that the head gaskets are bad. Very easy to tell by the shape of the timing cover, and the shape of the valve covers. 2.2 valve covers have 4 humps on the top. 2.5 covers are mostly flat. 2.2 the plug wires stick out at an angle above the valve covers. 2.5 the plug wires stick into holes in the middle of the valve covers. 2.2 the timing cover has rounded ends. 2.5 timing cover has large squared ends, kinda looks like a bow-tie. Thanks for the information. I am setting aside the time tonight to really check it over. I haven't had it long and life keeps getting in the way of me playing with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghageysh Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 YES! local dealership has them for $78. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthguy Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 No need to scour eBay for a FSM. Electronic copies are available online: http://jdmfsm.info/Auto/Japan/Subaru/ or http://www.main.experiencetherave.com/subaru_manual_scans/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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