Sudden water leak--pump?

[ThosL]

I have had a sudden water leak over the last week; is this likely the water pump going on me as with other vehicles?  I checked the obvious places and it seems to be coming out of the center of engine, not hoses.  How would I do a proper inspection, or do I need to get to a garage asap?

[AdventureSubaru]

Water pump is just to the left of the drivers side cylinder head. A leak here would probably be coming out behind the plastic timing belt covers. You may be able to get a peek at it by pulling the drivers side timing cover and shining a flashlight down there.

 

Usually you want to follow your leak to the highest point to find the source.

 

If you confirm that it's the water pump, depending on how recently you've done your timing belt, now is a good time. Full timing kits are between $150 and $200. and can be done in a couple hours if it's your first time. There are some good writeups I can point you to if you want to do it yourself and save some $$$.

 

If your timing stuff is pretty new, a water pump with gasket can be ordered from rock auto for around $30. plus shipping. Same process as timing belt.

[idosubaru]

vehicle, year, mileage?

 

a small leak probably isn't ominous but it sure could be so hard to say.  the smaller the leak/loss of coolant the less concerned i'd be about driving it to a shop.

 

no coolant pooling on top the block - under alternator, power steering, a/c?

[ThosL]

The mechanic at the local Gulf station took a quick look and said it was water pump.  Car has 275K on it, as I am not the first owner and the engine was a 2.2 replacement, not sure when timing belt was done.  I have done water pumps on a GM pick up years ago, I'm just afraid I would be left with a basket case if I opened this one up.  

[AdventureSubaru]

if you've done water pumps before, you should be able to handle this job. It's a bit of a list of steps, but no one step is really difficult.

 

http://www.rs25.com/forums/f105/t154453-diy-sohc-timing-belt-change-w-pics.html

 

Here's a detailed pictorial writeup of the timing job. Just remove the water pump and install the new one before putting the timing belt on again.

 

What year is your car?

[ThosL]

'99 Outback.  What is the likely range of prices for water pump or timing belt?  I asked the mechanic whether it was a $400 or more and he was shocked that I thought it would be that little.

[idosubaru]

Make sure it's diagnosed properly - i would not trust a random persons diagnosis.

 

$450 - $700 for a timing belt job from Subaru.

Add $50 as water pump costs much more than timing belt.

$100 labor:  water pump requires a bit more labor and coolant once timing belt is removed

New totals are:

$600 - $850

 

Ideally you install a complete timing belt kit - particularly if it's an interference engine.  Gates kits on amazon are only $115.

 

Timing belt on your car can be done in an hour....say 2 hours since yo'ure int he rust belt, HA!

Add another hour for the water pump

3 hours at 80/hour labor and you could conceivably find someone under $400 if you shopped around.

[ThosL]

I was hoping this was just a leaking hose problem, as "Splash" oil change/car wash said;  I ran it by Monroe who after quite a while with a flashlight and looking at the schematic said it was the water pump.  $700 estimate there, same at another trusted mechanic for timing belt too, another shop with an hour drive away was around $400.

[1997reduxe]

i am assuming you mean the car was a 2.5 and now has the 2.2,

but fyi i just recently bought the best imo timing belt kit from ebay

for 132 bucks.

of course my 99 outback has the 2.5 and they are probably less valued.

but it comes with the oem water pump, aisin.

if you want to find the one i got, search ebay for TB277LK2

[AdventureSubaru]

Gates kits are reportedly pretty good, but the 2.5 has a different belt than the 2.2 so that particular kit would not work. Good deal though!

[ThosL]

The shop in Waterbury said the 2.2 is an easier job than the 2.5.  You never know what you are going to get when you open up the water pump/timing belt compartment someone said; so we'll see. 

[ThosL]

delete

Edited September 26, 2014 by ThosL

[heartless]

2.2 timing belt jobs are relatively easy - changing the water pump does add a bit more time to the job, but still not that difficult.

This would also be a good time to put new radiator hoses on it as well.

 

A good timing kit, with all idler pulleys, new tensioner, and an Aisin water pump runs around $175 - $200.

 

Someone with experience can do the job in about 4 hours, give or take - takes me a little longer with frequent breaks to allow my back to relax (at 50+ it doesnt like bending over cars anymore)...

 

Getting all the air out of the cooling system is the biggest issue with this job. Back-filling the block through the upper radiator hose is the best way to accomplish this task.

[lmdew]

Make sure it's a shop that works on lots of Subarus!

[upnorthguy]

Mizumoauto has 2.2 timing belt kits with an Aisin water pump for $136 (free shipping).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/260925109309?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

 

Too bad you're not closer.  I'd help with that replacement for a six pack (beer or maple syrup)!

 

If you do it (and we all think you should, from the sound of the comments) spray the timing cover bolts with some penetrating oil.  Hopefully the 2.2 swapper used some anti seize on those bolts.  The covers often crack because the captive nut in the back cover gets a nice rust bond with the bolt and when you try to loosen the nut breaks free and cracks the tab on the cover. 

 

That rs25 link above has some excellent photos.  I typically take out the entire radiator instead of just removing the fans.  I've found that the bolts holding the fans to the radiator are often frozen as well (and there are more of them!).  Two bolts and the entire radiator/fan assembly slides out.  (Note: if you have an auto, this requires that you disconnect the transmission cooler lines, which is just two hose clamps) that are on the driver's side of the radiator.)

[ThosL]

Mizumoauto has 2.2 timing belt kits with an Aisin water pump for $136 (free shipping).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/260925109309?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

 

Too bad you're not closer.  I'd help with that replacement for a six pack (beer or maple syrup)!

 

If you do it (and we all think you should, from the sound of the comments) spray the timing cover bolts with some penetrating oil.  Hopefully the 2.2 swapper used some anti seize on those bolts.  The covers often crack because the captive nut in the back cover gets a nice rust bond with the bolt and when you try to loosen the nut breaks free and cracks the tab on the cover. 

 

That rs25 link above has some excellent photos.  I typically take out the entire radiator instead of just removing the fans.  I've found that the bolts holding the fans to the radiator are often frozen as well (and there are more of them!).  Two bolts and the entire radiator/fan assembly slides out.  (Note: if you have an auto, this requires that you disconnect the transmission cooler lines, which is just two hose clamps) that are on the driver's side of the radiator.)

 

If you were closer I would gladly share one of the areas best IPAs:   http://everythingontap.com/2014/07/19/two-roads-road-2-ruin-double-ipa-review/

 

This job is beyond me in terms of my experience and I would have to do it in a parking lot and hope that no one would try to enforce the no work on vehicles rules.

[heartless]

If you were closer I would gladly share one of the areas best IPAs:   http://everythingontap.com/2014/07/19/two-roads-road-2-ruin-double-ipa-review/

 

This job is beyond me in terms of my experience and I would have to do it in a parking lot and hope that no one would try to enforce the no work on vehicles rules.

 

that does complicate things a bit...

[ThosL]

The mechanic has scheduled the water pump job for Monday.  I asked him how driveable it is and he said I should be OK if I keep the radiator full.

 

So I have driven it on the highway today; this morning I was OK, then drove it this rather hot afternoon and it is overheating.  

 

I have a 30 mile or so ride back home, is there a way to drive this carefully so as not to overheat the engine again?  It did not get into the critical area with the temperature gauge, how accurate is that?  If I keep putting water in the radiator will I be OK and pull over when it gets above the 60% level on the gauge?

[ThosL]

I had the job done today, a little under 4 hours for the water pump alone.  When the water pump compartment was opened up, the shop manager said look at how the plastic melted, a bad sign for the head gaskets; ie though we could not see them if other plastic gaskets melted, they were probably damaged.  The old timing belt looked OK, so we decided to keep it, no other parts were replaced but water pump and thermostat.   The job was done under $400.  After the job was done it looked like we had the tell-tale bubbles in the radiator and overflow tank with overheating.  But I was able to drive the car 50 or so miles without any indications of a serious problem.  Time will tell. 

Edited September 29, 2014 by ThosL