Ceramiclover Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 I have an 04 Outback. Cranks but doesn't start. Seems I have no spark on coils 3 and 4. 1 and 2 are good. Wondering if there is an open in the wiring.Could use a wiring diagram if anyone has access to it. Otherwise advise would be appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bushwick Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 If coil is bad, just replace it. They are sealed units and far as I know, can not be repaired. Go with used to save a few bucks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 How many miles on it It should start but run like crap with jsut two cylinders firing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceramiclover Posted March 27, 2016 Author Share Posted March 27, 2016 160k, with 60k on a new motor, i guess. I am looking to buy it. The guy already swapped a used coil in there and the lack of spark doesn't change.That is why I was thinking one of the 2 igniter control wires must be open.But if Nipper is right and it should run on 2 cylinders, then I don't know.The only code was ECT, and it was unplugged. I plugged it in, but haven't checked the codes again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 Compression test would be warrented. You can throw a coil in it, but since it is a car your looking to purchase, I'm not sure how far you want to investigate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboobaroo Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 Have you checked fuel pressure at the engine? These are common to have fuel pump fail or the metal cap on the fuel pump module has broken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceramiclover Posted March 27, 2016 Author Share Posted March 27, 2016 I didn't check fuel pressure, but I did spray throttle body cleaner into the intake. That didn't help. I think I need to figure out why I have no spark on 1 and 2 before I go there. Towing the car tomorrow and will dig in then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 For grins, swap the coils. If the problem doesnt move you may have a bad ECU as the coils ground through the ECU to fire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceramiclover Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 The guy has already swapped the ECM and the coil.How are the coils controlled? Is it just a ground pulse on the 2 wires that tells the coil pack to fire on the respective 2 coils? Or is it 12v or AC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 It just grounds through the ECU 12vdc 1-2 and 3-4 fire together Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Also key KEY to dignosing these things replace ONE part at a time. If thats not the fault put the old part back. Otherwise things get confusing really quickly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceramiclover Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 Coil pack rests at 12v and ECU sends ground pulse then, just to be clear? I'm not so smart at some stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Yes, beleive it or not its not a terribly complicated system ignition wise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceramiclover Posted March 31, 2016 Author Share Posted March 31, 2016 A friend of mine is looking into this, so I apologize if the info is a bit confused. Also, we bought it from a Russian guy who didn't speak great english and may not have been particularly forthright.They ordered a used motor from Japan, it seems. Eagle Japan Motors. Original is USDM. New motor is JDM He used the USDM harness because some of the plugs on the intake were different, and I think he swapped some over.Test light on ignition control wires shows one grounded all the time and the other switched inconsistently then stops.My friend is wondering if there is a difference in the cam or crank signals.One thing that stuck out to me. Is there no mass air flow sensor on these? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboobaroo Posted April 4, 2016 Share Posted April 4, 2016 No MAF, these are a MAP based engine this year unless it's a Cal Spec car (3 cats, 5 oxygen sensors and a three piece intake). You need three things to run, spark, fuel and compression. These are notorious for the fuel pump to crap out which is why I mentioned the fuel pump. Even spark on two cylinders, it'll still run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceramiclover Posted April 4, 2016 Author Share Posted April 4, 2016 Thanks. As we looked into it more, it seems the problem stems from it being a 2.0 liter JDM motor. Going to try putting a USDM Crank tone ring and Cam sprocket and see if that helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bushwick Posted April 4, 2016 Share Posted April 4, 2016 Why would you change the cam sprocket, and with what sprocket? An ej22? I'd figure out why it's igniting the other 2 coils before doing anything else. If the coil is getting the signal to spark but isn't, than it's bad coil. If the coil is NOT getting the signal to spark, work you way back from the coil connector, all the way to the ecm until you find out why. Seeing as how the PO swapped things around (used coil, different ECM, etc.) you can NOT assume he did this correctly, didn't swap a bad part in, left wires unplugged, forgot a ground, etc. Or maybe it has a damaged CPS sensor and is missing a tooth so the crank sensor isn't sending the signal as it can't fully detect crank position. Really need to go over everything with a fine-tooth comb and see what jumps out. Changing sprockets is a good way to ruin the engine if the count is incorrect and the engine is interference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceramiclover Posted April 4, 2016 Author Share Posted April 4, 2016 The ignition coil gets signal intermittantly and then not at all on the 3/4 control wire. moreso on 1/2. checked continuity to ecm, which is all plugged in.We did not realize originally that he had put an EJ20 into the car. He gave us the EJ25 that was originally in it.From everything I have read, you need to use the USDM driver cam sprocket and crank tone ring and intake for it to work.I don't think the previous owner did this. He thought he could just drop it in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboobaroo Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 That is also an issue when doing an engine swap. The cam and crank sprockets need to match the intake and ECU you're running. These will also cause a fuel and spark issue. I was under the impression it was a running swap, not a swap that hasn't started. Just an FYI, the head gaskets for the JDM EJ20 aren't available that I have found from any supplier in the US. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceramiclover Posted April 8, 2016 Author Share Posted April 8, 2016 Would using the JDM intake cause it to run lean? I have a lean code and the engine wouldn't idle at a consistent rpm with upstream o2 plugged in.I assumed it was because all of the raw fuel had fouled it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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