gunslinger Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 we started in on saterday about noon on swervey's '87 GL and everything was in by saterday night. now im sitting here still trying to figure out why it wont start on sunday night. harness from dash forward, fuel pump, fuel in the tank, batt charged, etc, etc etc. turns over, wont start. it wont even spark. nothing (spark) at the coil. theres power at the coil, but it wont spark. TDC, disty stabbed correctly. we're both fabergasted. he printed out the injection swap manual that we got from voodoo to the "T" after i realized it wasnt going to start with siimply plugging everything in. then we started the splicing/cutting the harness to run the required lines. nothing. couple things in the manual kind of contradict themselves so we made sense of what we could. like running a dedicated line to the fuel pump. and a couple of others......... also, every fuel "infected" (as we call them now) car has a long, narrow, clear/yellow plug near the fuse box (on the left side of the harness comiing through the fender/grommet) that no carbed car has so we're wondering if not having that plug in the car makes a difference? im wondering if simply getting the whole harness out of the dash so EVERYTHING plugs in and you dont have to splice SH*T is easier. seems so to me. PLEASE GET BACK TO ME!! he mistakingly doesnt have anything to drive now except for his work van. we're done untill we hear back about it, ran out of beer and patience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 It sounds like you may have a bad pick up loop in the distributor or a bad coil. You should see power on the minus side of the coil also. To prove out the coil circuit place a plug wire, with a plug in one end, into the coil high voltage output point. Place the plug body on a good ground point. Place a clip lead on the minus side of the coil and hold the other end of the lead near a ground point with the ignition on (don't touch the bare wire, hold the insulation ), and then touch and release the wire to ground. You should get a spark at the plug if the coil is ok. You will then need to see what is wrong with the pick up loop. If there is a transistor switch on the base of the distributor it may be bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunslinger Posted February 21, 2005 Author Share Posted February 21, 2005 The coil in his car is a brand new Accel Super Stock coil. Also we tried a different coil. There is power at both positive and negitive side of the coil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Make sure you ground your ECU's body or else it will fry, giving you no ignition pulse and an error code for your crank angle sensor. I did that twice. or you have a bad crank angle sensor Check juice on the power transistor, and make sure it is good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunslinger Posted February 21, 2005 Author Share Posted February 21, 2005 Is the ecu grounded when it is bolted to the car column. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 yes Mine wouldn't bolt in place b/c the bolt spacing was different - hence the problem I had. I would still run extra ground wires because the chassis on these cars is grounded, but not well. http://www.finleyweb.net/default.asp?id=142 this link goes to a site with a complete FSM section on SPFI FI and troubleshooting - sorry I did not think of it earlier good luck!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Sorry to hear that. Like 85sub4wd said, double check that the ECM case is grounded (i.e. use a meter to check for continuity). Also, double check that ALL of the power supplies are connected. Is the fuel pump or check engine light turning on at all? That will tell you if the ECM is hooked up and working properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Did the SPFI system come out of a known running car? Also, try plugging together the green diagnostic connector and see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swervey87gl Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Sorry to hear that. Like 85sub4wd said, double check that the ECM case is grounded (i.e. use a meter to check for continuity). Also, double check that ALL of the power supplies are connected. Is the fuel pump or check engine light turning on at all? That will tell you if the ECM is hooked up and working properly. Well the car getting the swap is mine. I didin't have a chance to sign on last night to start this thread. I checked everything over and over. At first when it didn't start I had the ECM mounted up. There was no ground on the car when I pulled it off and the body is painted. So from the manufacturer it isn't grounded through the body. I had a prob with the fuel pump relay hookup. The wire that I ran back from the fuel pump and spliced into the blue and white never sent power to the fuel pump. Then I have no spark. I honestly don't know how to tests the things related. Then one other question that might relate to the no spark issue is the wire that needed battery power. On Hooking Everything UP #5 it is explained that the Red and blue wire that went into a large rectangle plug. Well I hook the wire up that was described and my dash lights stayed on after I took the key off. So I knew that wasnt the wire. Then in #12 the diagram it says the Red and blue wire hooks up to ignition wire. It is easy for me to get the whole dash out of the donor car, actually its just sitting there I have to grab it. My big question is that if I replace the whole dash wireing would that work. The instructions were good. I would be lost without them. The two wireing questions were the only main ones I had with the instructions. I am now sitting here hoping to find some answers, I don't know what to do next and my car is all tore apart. :-\ . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Gunslinger, Did you try to do the coil function test I gave you? If so, how did it turn out? Going by your other posts it does seem the problem is with the distributor end of the circuit connection for some reason. You stated that the power was getting to the minus side of the coil and another coil also did the same thing (no spark). If you used the body of the coil for your ground reference when making the voltage test then the test I gave to you may not be necessary but I would try it just to double check the coil function. Check all your fuses, especially #5. I believe the horn works off of that one also, so if it isn't good, replace it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swervey87gl Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 No we didn't, I dont have the car infront of me now so I couldn't test that yet. I will be around it in the next couple of days. Sorry there is two of us replying to questions it is my car and we were working together on it. I am getting all the adivce I can then I am going to try it all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 I believe the red and blue wire is supposed to connect to ignition hot, not battery hot. I then checked in the manual and that's what is said. If you can't get is sorted out very soon, I would just grab the whole dash, then it would be a plug-and-play affair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swervey87gl Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 Is it the red and blue wire comming out of the ignition relay, ignition hot. Sorry for askin so many questions, I am totaly baffled and something not working frustrates me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 Yeah, that wire is ignition hot, and it should join up with several other red/blue wires that also need ignition hot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swervey87gl Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 Do you know how to tell if the ECM is good or not. Also you asked if it is out of a running car or not. No. It was out of a 88 that had 92k on it but the motor had water in the oil. Its out of a pull a part junkyard. Let me go over this Red, ignition relay, battery power (it already had b power so I didn't touch it) Red/blue, ignition relay, ignition power Black/white, ECM, #27, battery power Light green/yellow, ECM, #18, starter power only Two Black/white, fuel pump relay, ignition power Blue/white, fuel pump relay, positive on fuel pump Black/white, coil, ignition power Am I on the right track ? I snaged the wires from the FI harnes regarding the coil wireing for the tach and it looks like it was set up how you described. Is that true. One other thing I noticed is when I ran power manualy to the fuel pump to double check it. It shot fuel out the fuel line that runs along the frame rail. I thought that the fuel was suposto come out of the larger line just under the wiper motor. I would be easy to grab that harness but I feel so close to having it. I would like to figure it out now that I started it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archemitis Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 whenever i cant get an efi swap to work, its ususaly something totaly unrelated to the swap. like a mis stabbed disty. technicaly, you should be able to put a hot wire to the +side on the coil, that gives power to the coil, and tells the computer to turn on. the big red wire(the power wire for the injector) is power, that gets power all the time. hotwire your fuel pump, and it should start. to refine i use the original relay in the car, and the original +wire from the original coil. put that to the plus on the coil, and that parts done for you. wire inthe fuel pump relay the correct way, and put a fusable link on the main red wire.... mind you, this is the way to do it using just the computer,and harness(from computer to manifold/disty.), not the whole dash wiring and all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swervey87gl Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 Am I just bieng a idiot, The more I think about it the more confused I get. Can someone do me a big favor and take a couple of pics of what they have done so I can just see it. I am totaly visual and I just cant picture what I am suposto do. I will send money for your time.:-\ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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