nedriver Posted May 15, 2006 Share Posted May 15, 2006 Hi all, I have a 2002 Outback with the 2.5, and 126Kmiles. The check engine light came on while I was on a trip so I visited the local dealer. They told me that the "catalyst efficiancy below threshold" code was activated. I was also told that this means the converter(s) are failing. $900-$1500 ouch.... The car also accelerates poorly, and sometimes does the "shake and shimmy" for a brief time. Air filter, coil, fuel filter, plugs, and wires all new. Questions: - 1. does "failing" mean plugged or not working correctly? 2. Does anyone know aftermarket converters? 3. Will I also need to replace sensors, etc? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyjo Posted May 15, 2006 Share Posted May 15, 2006 you may want to change your o2 sensors... i believe those are the only sensors down there to measure wether the cats are doing their job... i think. As for aftermarket cats... all i know is that you can't 'buy' them from junkyards... but you can buy an odd shaped 'muffler' from some of them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted May 15, 2006 Share Posted May 15, 2006 I had PO 420 and changed my front ox sensor. It was cheap and only took a few minutes. The car has been ok for some time now. Good luck and I hope this simple and cheap cure works for you too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMattyD Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 Someone correct me if i'm wrong, but the code you pulled can have many causes, the only one costing hundreds and hundreds of dollars being actual catalyst failure. I did some research earlier and found one common cause of this code being a leak in the exhaust system in the area of the cats. Another problem could be poor performance of one or both O2 sensors. I believe the ECU calculates the efficiency of the catalyst by comparing the measurements taken by the two sensors. If they don't fall in the right ranges, it will misinterpret the info. So, i would suggest first looking for any leaks, then changing the O2 sensors. If that solves the problem, you're all set, and if you were to need a new cat, you would probably replace the o2 sensors at that time anyway. Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawsonmh15 Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 mmmm. 420................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedriver Posted May 16, 2006 Author Share Posted May 16, 2006 Thanks to everyone for your help! I think I'll replace the sensors first..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vic/se Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 Thanks to everyone for your help! I think I'll replace the sensors first..... And do like Matt said check the Y for leaks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlsimpso Posted May 16, 2006 Share Posted May 16, 2006 That is one of the codes I got on my 98 Legacy GT at about 150K. I would check in to replacing the O2 sensors before the cat. There is a back pressure test that can determine if it is plugged, which could account for some of the poor performance. Check this article out: http://www.troublecodes.net/articles/catfailure/ Is your an auto or manual? I had a bad misfire that was caused by a failing knock sensor. You may not be able to feel it with the slush box. Replaced it the sensor and it is gone. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laush Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 I have went through this lately with my 02 Outback. One dealer said it was the Cat and the other told me frt 02 sensor. I first bought the 02 sensor, and wasted 130.00. The code returned on my first drive on the freeway. The converter is still covered under warranty until 8 yrs 130000 km, so now Subaru is going to reluctantly pay for the converter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotshot Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 The check engine light that was on in my 97 OB apparantly was a catalytic convertier problem too. The dealer said that it really wasnt that big of a deal, and that you could just drive it untill the whole thing failed. So if you cant tell a difference, I dont think I would worry about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 It's only an issue if you have an emissions inspection to worry about. At oover 100K you are past the life design life of the o2 sensors, and the cat. Could be a bad O2 sensor, thats cheaper to replace then a cat. I bought my last cat from JC whitney, i dont know if thats an option since it says your international. The JC Whitney cat was a name brand, and worked fine at 1/3 the cost of OE. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattgold Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 It's only an issue if you have an emissions inspection to worry about. At oover 100K you are past the life design life of the o2 sensors, and the cat. nipper Hey nipper, is that true that the cat only has a lifetime of 100k miles? I really don't know how a cat works, but is this likely to affect the exhaust flow or just the emissions? My '99 leggy is getting close to 160k kms on the clock. I guess I'll need to check that o2 sensor and see if it has ever been replaced (I'm sure either that or the maf was when I bought the car). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2X2KOB Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 Ugh. I certainly believe you that the design life of a cat is 100k, but it would sure be nice if it were more. Since they cost so much and all. Do you know what company makes the JC Whitney cats for them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 The cat has a DESIGN life of 100K miles. They last much longer then that if the car is kept in tune and has been fed good fuel (they can also fail earlier cause stuff happens). Last time i bough a cat from JC Whitney it came from Walker. The major mechanical parts from JC are name brand, the silly odd ball stuff, is well, just silly. I have never bought from these guys, but the prices look good http://www.discountconverter.com/ you may want to try them. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 I really don't know how a cat works, but is this likely to affect the exhaust flow or just the emissions? My '99 leggy is getting close to 160k kms on the clock. http://www.howstuffworks.com/catalytic-converter.htm nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted May 18, 2006 Share Posted May 18, 2006 I put a rebuilt cat on my last Mercedes at about 250,000 miles. It was still going at 300,000 when I sold it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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