unobtainium Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 I've searched for symptoms like these and see that it's a morass, with JDITCO relays maybe playing into the situation, but let me list the symptoms and see if it clicks with anybody: Last week my '93 Legacy wagon died on a corner. It would not re-start for ten or fifteen minutes - it felt as though no fuel was getting through. No CEL. I took it home and changed the fuel filter, which clearly needed it. Pulled codes and I got 32 - O2 sensor - but that is the first time I have pulled codes in several years and that was the only code. Reset the ECU by pulling fuse 14 according to Legacy777's instructions. Yesterday and today, when I have gone around a particular corner, I've had ten seconds' worth of mis-firing. It happens cold or hot. Once the misfire stops, all is good. I've been wiggling wires under the hood for a while but nothing seems to make the misfire return. Still no CEL. Ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fnlyfnd Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 Do you have at least a half tank of gas. Could be a failing fuel pump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 check the intake hose for cracks. check underneath where you can't see as well. if cracks are just starting they will "open" more as the engine torques and moves (motor mounts give) or you go around turns and the chasis moves. i doubt this is the case, but all i can think of. that and a wire is exposed somewhere, grounding out around turns. i've seen O2 wires have the insulation rubbed off where they pass through crossmembers or around exhaust. they will ground out intermittently and cause strange things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unobtainium Posted June 1, 2006 Author Share Posted June 1, 2006 Good suggestions. I hadn't checked the intake hose. The only common link I can think of when the car's done its trick is that the curves were -downhill- and pretty tight. The time it really died, the tank was close to full, and now it's at 3/4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 1, 2006 Share Posted June 1, 2006 You may have a weak coil. The tin can coils had oil in them to insulate the wiring. i'll be honest and im not sure about the new coils. ANother possability is a fuel filter. What is the level in the tank when this happens. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unobtainium Posted June 2, 2006 Author Share Posted June 2, 2006 Today the car was even worse, sputtering when I was going downhill. If I release the clutch the engine feels like it's going to quit. So: after disconnecting and reconnecting every connector I could reach, checked the intake hose and horsed it backwards and forwards while the car was idling. No difference. Wiggled every wire I could see. No difference. Checked insulation on the O2 sensor, which looks fine. Checked and wiggled the vacuum lines. No difference. After all the downhill sputtering and all this wire wiggling (remembering I cleared codes yesterday) I pulled codes and got "all clear". Evidently the car doesn't know any of this is going on. The tach reads about where it should when the engine feels as though it's dying. On some cars the tach will have a fit if the spark's not working, so I'm thinking this means the ignition system's fine at least up to the igniter. What's left is air leaks and fuel system issues, as far as I'm able to tell. Thanks for the suggestions so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 2, 2006 Share Posted June 2, 2006 exactly when does the car do this? is it hot or cold? first drive in the morning or after its been sitting a few hours? Is it predictable or intermitent? Subaru tachs dont work off the coils, the tach gets its signal from the ecu. When was the last time the car had a tune up, and yes dont rule out the ignitor. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unobtainium Posted June 2, 2006 Author Share Posted June 2, 2006 It will do this hot or cold and I can make it happen by driving down a hill and turning sharply right. Gear doesn't matter. It has no problem whatever going uphill, you can stand on the gas, crank the wheel right and go uphill with no problem. The car had plugs, air filter and wires about 10k ago. It sat for a few weeks during the winter. When I started driving it again it started doing this, before I parked it, it was fine. Fluids are fine, no bubbles in the water tank and no goop in the oil. Tank was probably at 1/4 when I parked it, and hmm, I wonder now if water in the gas (heavier than the fuel, it will go forward when the car's pointed downhill) would explain this and the right-hand turn problem, when the water would go to the left, where the tank pickup is. Sounds pretty weird, but a can of Heet is cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 2, 2006 Share Posted June 2, 2006 actually with ethanol dry gas is almost a moot point. You may have dirt in the tank. If you have used more then one tank of gas since storage then any water should be burned up. Another possability is that the jet pump is clogged (fancy term for in tank siphon) or clogged. Soobies have split gas tanks, and use a siphon to drain gas from the left side. You make a right turn, gas moves to the left, and for some reason isnt getting sucked up right away. i vote for dirt. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unobtainium Posted June 2, 2006 Author Share Posted June 2, 2006 Thanks, Nipper, I'll pull the pump and see what's what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unobtainium Posted June 11, 2006 Author Share Posted June 11, 2006 Yesterday I pulled the fuel pump. Inside the tank is -pristine-. The filter sock on the pump intake is bright white with nothing loose on it. There is no rust or anything in there. Pulled codes again, got #24 (IAC). I can replicate the exact feel of what happens after the car dies, if I take the hose off the IAC - the car will run unevenly but won't idle. (During one of the stuck-by-the-side-of-the-road incidents it takes a few minutes before the car will start at all.) Now, the car won't idle with that hose off so I sort of sneaked some carb cleaner into the IAC while it was running (just made a tiny gap in the hose end), and washed it out with more cleaner after that. I've been looking around a lot on this board and cannot find a walkthrough for cleaning the IAC. This valve has four 10mm cap screws holding it to the throttle body. There are two coolant hoses, one air hose and a three pin electrical connector. There's a grey plastic body held to the main valve with two #2 Phillips screws. I loosened these and found I can move the grey plastic body around, but it doesn't feel as though it wants to be yanked out. Is it OK to pull up on the grey plastic part of the valve, or do I have to try some other method of disassembly? Is fixing the IAC the end of this problem, or should I still suspect something else? Thanks for the help so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted June 12, 2006 Share Posted June 12, 2006 Is fixing the IAC the end of this problem, or should I still suspect something else? Never can tell, but it's worth a try. It's been discussed quite a bit. Try a search, here are a couple of links: http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=40494&highlight=iacv http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=33198&highlight=idle+air+control+valve Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unobtainium Posted June 13, 2006 Author Share Posted June 13, 2006 {...} It's been discussed quite a bit. Try a search, here are a couple of links: http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=40494&highlight=iacv http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=33198&highlight=idle+air+control+valve Good luck. Mahalo nui lo'a fo' da links. The valve doesn't stick at the end of its rotation any longer and that is a good thing but it's too late tonight to take the Harrowing Test Ride. I'll update when whatever's ailing this car is definitely fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumby Boy Posted June 13, 2006 Share Posted June 13, 2006 check you cam sensor we had one at work do a simmilar thing turned out to be the cam sensor just my 0.02c Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unobtainium Posted June 18, 2006 Author Share Posted June 18, 2006 Cleaning the IAC seems to have helped quite a bit. Even on a fairly savage descent, with lots of braking and closed-throttle engine braking, the symptom has not returned. There have been some little changes in the way my car runs that might help others. A/C stumbling is much less severe. In this thread: http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=59879, <b>chicobiker</b> says the idle on his car drops fast. Mine used to drop that way, hot or cold if I put the car in neutral and let go of the pedal it would go right down to 700 rpm. After the IAC cleaning, it drops to about 1250 then descends much more gradually to 700. Many thanks to the members for helping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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