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ea81 to ea82 swap *sticky?*


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51 replies to this topic

#1 archemitis

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Posted 17 November 2003 - 12:06 PM

i was just wondering if there was a list of things there is to do for this swap. i read up on it and thought i had everything figured out, as far as flywheels and clutched and all that. but my motor mounts didnt exactly line up, and i had to screw around.

why dont we have everyone contribute to this post, and make a definate list? and then archive it, or put on the repair manual.

gen 2 brats/ hatches. the ones where you dont have to hammer the frame rails to make it fit.

i know its an easy swap, cuz i just got mine bolted in, but it would help other people, so they dont have ANY surprises.

#2 JWX

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Posted 17 November 2003 - 03:55 PM

so it just droped right in? I got to thinking about this today at work and was going to make a thread about it then I saw this one.

#3 MilesFox

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Posted 17 November 2003 - 04:41 PM

the hill holder will have to be unbolted and relocated back an inch or two. you will also have to bend the brtake lines a little.

you can swap out the master cylinder for one from an automatic-it will give more distributor clearance.

you can also remove the distributor when pulling/dropping the engine, it will help get around the master cylinder.

you can loosen the motor mounts from the motor so they wiggle, and that gives enough play to fit the studs thru the crossmember.

#4 archemitis

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Posted 17 November 2003 - 05:41 PM

i got an ea81 4x4 8 7/8s flywheel, bolt holes had to be oversized one size. i moved the timing marks(cam and ignition), so it works with the ea82 engine.

8 7/8 4x ea81 clutch, and an ea81 pressure plate.

moved the hill holder back three inches(pushed on it after unbolted)

disty is no issue with my setup.

the motor mount holes on my crossmember had to be redrilled, 1/4 inch further towards the wheels.

put the hooK from the front of the ea81 onto the ea82 for the hoist

paint everything (this one is a must)

#5 MilesFox

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Posted 17 November 2003 - 06:45 PM

the drilling of the crossmember is not necessary. let it be noted that also, the motor mounts between ea81 and ea82 will swap out with eachother.

on our glf, and Tom's Brat, the flyeheel holes have been drilled out to accept the ea82 fltwheel bolts

you can also use an ea82 flywheel and pressure plate, with the ea81 disc, as long as the throwout bearing isnt the small one(2wd 5 spd)

the bottom radiator hose will have to be fanagled to fit an ea81 radiator, but on tom's brat for example, has an ea82 radiator, the holes for the top mounts will have to be drilled into the ea81 core support.

an ea81 manifold woll fit, but on carter/wever models, you will have to make a dent in the power steering reservoir for the solenoud on the fromt of hte carb. throttle cable swii swap between ea81 and ea82, its best to use the throttle cable for the intake setup that you use

when swapping an ea82 into an ea81 body, any 85 and 86 distributor will be compatible with any 83 and up ea81 ignition systems.
for those models with voltage regulators, the VR can be eliminated with the ea82 distributor.

when using a hitachi carb from an ea82, you must use the ea82 airbox(black) because the top af the carb is larger. but other than that, they are the same as ea81(blue) and all the connections fit the same, and the same air filters and tops will fit either one.

on my particular setup. i use the ea82 battery cavles, and installed the battery opposite, which would be tha same as ea82 setup. i also relocated the coil to be on the distributor side, and spliced the coil's original connectors to wire that runs along the firewallto meet the coil's new location

#6 AKIRA

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Posted 17 November 2003 - 09:41 PM

If you are not going to swap in a turbo, a 87+ MPFI looks like the best, from my manual it says that after 86, the mpfi's are 9.5:1, they are 97 hp.

#7 MilesFox

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Posted 17 November 2003 - 09:48 PM

on an 87 TURBO, the ecu uses a crank angle sensor. on the 85 and 86, it uses a seperate knock control unit.

was there an mpfi non turbo for 85, and 86? and how similar or dissimilar would the ignition system be to turbos of the same year, or the 87 up mpfi system?

#8 AKIRA

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Posted 17 November 2003 - 10:05 PM

thats what the manual says, I can't recheck because it's at my dads.

it was a table with engine facts, here's what I remember.
spfi, 9.5:1= 90hp
mpfi, 9.0:1=94hp
mpfi, 9.5:1=97hp

#9 MilesFox

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Posted 17 November 2003 - 11:03 PM

what about the wiring harnesses between any of them?

#10 archemitis

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 01:26 PM

thats wierd miles, i had to drill my crossmember

im using a motor out of an 85 xt na mpfi. my wiring diagram shows the same turbo wire as the 87 and later ones.

#11 MilesFox

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 03:07 PM

maybe the fact its from an xt didnt let the mounts line up.

bu ti do know the trans mounts are the same, as we put a 2wd auto in place of a bas 4wd auto in a turbo xt

#12 archemitis

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 05:28 PM

ok im retarded. i had the mounts on backwards. they are in the stock holes in the crossmember now.

#13 archemitis

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 01:39 PM

come on guys, this is inportant. if we had stuff like this archived, we would see alot less of the same posts, day after day.

#14 AKIRA

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Posted 20 November 2003 - 11:28 AM

Bump, come on, this is a good Idea.

#15 archemitis

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Posted 21 November 2003 - 01:08 PM

is there even an archive anymore?

#16 TomRhere

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Posted 21 November 2003 - 06:01 PM

Miles posted some of this already, but I'll contribute what I found out, and know. I did not do the engine swap, but I did pull the engine, and do a re-seal on it. Same, or close to doing the swap.

This is on/in an '82 BRAT, which still has the D/R 4 Spd tranny.

Upon re-installing the engine, I found that the disty should be left out, and re-installed afterwards.

The Hill-Holder, (ifin you have one), should be moved rearwards the distance of the mounting holes for it. And you need to tweak the front most lines on it. Being very carefull, not to kink them.

The wires to the disty need to be lengthened, or you will need to move the disty to the Driver's side of the engine. That involves more wiring mods, than just lenghtening the disty wires.

Upon installing the engine, you'll want to leave the motor mounts loose at the engine block. This will help to get the studs into the slots in the crosmember. You can then tighten the mounts to the engine. Before you tighten the mounts to the crossmember, be sure to check that the engine is centered between the frame-rails. It will be close, not much more than a 1/4" per side.

The Vacuum Advance unit on the Disty will hit the Master Cylinder, if you try to go past halfway of the slot for the lock-down bolt. This really doesn't seem to be of any concern, as mine is still in the forward half of the slot. I'm setting Ignition timing by ear, due to the next paragraph.

Please, save yourself, and/or the next owner some headaches. Use the EA-82's flywheel!!!! It has the T-belt timing marks, and the Ignition timing marks are not in the same position, either. You can transfer the marks over to the EA-81 flywheel, But Why??!?!?? Just use the EA-81's clutch disc, pilot and throw-out bearing, ifin you're using the 4 Spd, while using the EA-82's flywheel and pressure plate.

There may be a difference on the bottom mounts for the EA-82/81 radiators, I do know that the top mounting points are different. My radiator support has been re-drilled to fit the EA-82's radiator. Other than that, the hoses, and thermo-switch for the fan(s) are the same. The radiator cap, appears to be in a different locale, but it ain't no biggy. The radiator hoses are trimmed to fit their respective runs.

Ifin you have the waterpump mounted fan on your EA-82, you may want to leave it off. There is only 1/4" to 3/8" between it and the radiator. Makes me nervous!!!!!!

The originator of this swap in my BRAT, shortened the housing for the accelerator cable, then lengthened the cable itself. Why, I don't know. Made the Weber swap that much more fun. NOT!!!

About all can think of right now..............

#17 archemitis

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Posted 22 November 2003 - 12:10 PM

the ea82 rad wont fit *right* in without pulling the lower studs off, and drilling new holes for the top bolts.

and i used an ea81 flywheel, because it has alot less metal hanging off the sides. less weight, noticeably.

and making mpfi work is a whole writeup by itself, i'll do that after i get it runing.

#18 TomRhere

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Posted 22 November 2003 - 03:03 PM

I hear you , Arch.

I didn't pay that much attention to the lower radiator mounts, when I had it out. Therfore, I didn't want to say it was a "bolt-in swap".

I'm kinda stuck with the P.O.'s do it my way stuff, but I was stating what I obsereved while doing the re-seal, re-install, of the engine. Would've appreciated it, ifin he'd used the EA-82 flywheel, instead of the EA-81.

Apperently, even though this subject comes up more often than not, it ain't worth sticky-ing, or archiveing, ( do we still have an archive?).

I will do my best to document the swap over in my '82 from the current engine, (EA-82), to the EA-27 MPFI engine. Shouldn't be any differance in doing it ifin you have the EA-81 engine to start with.

Don't normally do this, but...........................

'82 BRAT ER-27 MPFI D/R 5spd :headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :headbang: ROCKS!!!!!!!!!

#19 archemitis

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Posted 23 November 2003 - 07:44 PM

hrmm

#20 MilesFox

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Posted 25 November 2003 - 12:05 PM

so are you going to compile this and do a write up? i have a secret web project myself..........................:burnout:

#21 archemitis

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Posted 25 November 2003 - 01:19 PM

well, the big fat harness fit through the large oval hole, behind the strut. poped out the rubber grommet and shoved it through. my computer is in my glove box space now with the led facing outward.

i think i got it working with just the computer harness. i have power everywhere it needs to be. now i just have to get an ignition pulse. and hope the tach works. and stick in some relays, instead of straight power.

where could we stick a writeup like this? how hard would it be to get it onto the ultimate repair manual?

#22 MilesFox

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Posted 25 November 2003 - 02:15 PM

i guess you have to upload it to subaru junkie, and then he puts it up.
once i am done with my website, i am going to upload it as one big zip file. bit i got LOTS of megs!

#23 archemitis

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Posted 29 November 2003 - 12:07 PM

the hill holder will have to be unbolted and relocated back an inch or two. you will also have to bend the brtake lines a little.

you can swap out the master cylinder for one from an automatic-it will give more distributor clearance.

you can also remove the distributor when pulling/dropping the engine, it will help get around the master cylinder.

you can loosen the motor mounts from the motor so they wiggle, and that gives enough play to fit the studs thru the crossmember.

ea81 4x4 8 7/8s flywheel, bolt holes had to be oversized one size. i moved the timing marks(cam and ignition), so it works with the ea82 engine.

8 7/8 4x ea81 clutch, and an ea81 pressure plate.

put the hooK from the front of the ea81 onto the ea82 to hook the chain to, for the hoist(if not using power steering bracket)

you can also use an ea82 flywheel and pressure plate, with the ea81 disc, as long as the throwout bearing isnt the small one(2wd 5 spd)

some(i have found 1) 4x xts and push buttons came with the small flywheel, so make sure you are using the big one.

you can use the ea82 flywheel, but it is heavier, but it retains your stock timing marks.

the bottom radiator hose will have to be fanagled to fit an ea81 radiator, but on tom's brat for example, has an ea82 radiator, the holes for the top mounts will have to be drilled into the ea81 core support.

an ea81 manifold woll fit, but on carter/wever models, you will have to make a dent in the power steering reservoir for the solenoud on the fromt of hte carb. throttle cable swii swap between ea81 and ea82, its best to use the throttle cable for the intake setup that you use

when swapping an ea82 into an ea81 body, any 85 and 86 distributor will be compatible with any 83 and up ea81 ignition systems.
for those models with voltage regulators, the VR can be eliminated with the ea82 distributor. {Is THAT THE DISTY, OR THE ALTERNATOR?}

when using a hitachi carb from an ea82, you must use the ea82 airbox(black) because the top af the carb is larger. but other than that, they are the same as ea81(blue) and all the connections fit the same, and the same air filters and tops will fit either one.

you can use the ea82 battery cables, and installed the battery opposite, which would be tha same as ea82 setup.

also relocated the coil to be on the distributor side, and spliced the coil's original connectors to wire that runs along the firewallto meet the coil's new location


Upon installing the engine, you'll want to leave the motor mounts loose at the engine block. This will help to get the studs into the slots in the crosmember. You can then tighten the mounts to the engine. Before you tighten the mounts to the crossmember, be sure to check that the engine is centered between the frame-rails. It will be close, not much more than a 1/4" per side.(or less)


the ea82 rad will fit, if you pull out the bottom studs, and redrill holes in the frame for the upper mounting bolts. it doesnt realy fit all the way down, so it sticks up, but it fits good.




does this list look complete for the carb setup?

miles, on the voltage regulator part, did you mean disty or alt?

#24 MilesFox

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Posted 29 November 2003 - 03:06 PM

i meant the voltage regulator. it can be eliminated if using the internally regulated alt (83+)

using the 85 and 86 distributor, it has the module internally, so the external ign module(pre-83- can be eliminated)

#25 RXTurbo

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Posted 30 November 2003 - 04:33 AM

No one has covered what has to be done to the chassis rails to make it fit (if anyhting at all)

thanks




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