thatswhatshesaid Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Two nights ago, someone else was driving my car (2000 Outback)...water pump went out. They didn't notice the temp rising until the car ceased to run. Now the heads are DESTROYED. The poor can won't even start. Now that I have to go to the expense of pulling the engine, messing with the internals, and replacing expensive parts (on an engine with 200k miles), I'm thinking maybe I should just spend a couple extra bucks and have a boosted motor. And I kinda want a manual transmission, too. What do you guys think the best option is? (I'm not looking for a super fast race car...just a slightly quicker Outback. Maybe 200 WHP?) Should I... - put together a EJ22T? - get a EJ20G with RA tranny? (Same final drive) - rebuild/turbo my SOHC 2.5 Any and all input or suggestions are greatly appreciated. I'm new to this stuff.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericem Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 I would get another 2.5 or a Ej22T and use heads that are compatible with your stock ecu electronically. Then get a td04 and just run 5-10psi. It will be plenty fast. You can even run N/A heads on a Ej22T if you wanted and make plenty of power without running into many issues, but REALISTICALLY the best option is to swap over all the wiring and run a turbo motor with turbo heads. It will be pricey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 At 200K your looking for a lower mileage engine. I wouldnt turbocharge an engine with 200K unless you are replacing the rings and bearings. Go with a 2.2 a turbo. It can handle being blown much better. Go with what Eric said. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatswhatshesaid Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 (edited) That does sound easy.... Maybe I will try to find a low mileage 22T. That would be sweet. Can someone give me a quick rundown of what combination of parts yields a "hybrid" motor? And could I make a turbo hybrid? Edited January 26, 2010 by thatswhatshesaid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WRX2FFU Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 I don't know all the fine fine details but here is some info for you to chew on. My frind matt has an ej22(regular non turbo) stock bottom end around 146k miles. He put wrx heads on it with kelford cams. He had on an ebay 20g turbo and ran an 11.9 1/4 mile. In a GD body. How much power? enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericem Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Also keep in mind N/A ej22 has thicker cylinder walls then a new STi motor haha. So boosting a n/a ej22 block with turbo heads is a awesome idea as stated by the 11.9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatswhatshesaid Posted January 27, 2010 Author Share Posted January 27, 2010 Impressive. Is there any way you could find out some more specific details? I'm curious... I don't know all the fine fine details but here is some info for you to chew on. My frind matt has an ej22(regular non turbo) stock bottom end around 146k miles. He put wrx heads on it with kelford cams. He had on an ebay 20g turbo and ran an 11.9 1/4 mile. In a GD body. How much power? enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatswhatshesaid Posted January 27, 2010 Author Share Posted January 27, 2010 Okay...I've been reading a ton of stuff on here, NASIOC, legacycentral, etc. about hybrid builds. The appeal of keeping the wiring/ECU/parts I already have has made me lean toward that option. So...what hybrid (turbo) options would you guys think would be best - assuming I want to use some of my 2.5 parts? (Feel free to help me learn how the math works - I really don't know... It seems like Subaru engines are like Mr. Potato Head - often, you can just pull a part off one and slap it on another, because physically, they are so similar... What parts should I get from other motors to make a reasonably reliable boosted motor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WRX2FFU Posted January 27, 2010 Share Posted January 27, 2010 Impressive. Is there any way you could find out some more specific details? I'm curious... He did pin the block basically made it a semi closed deck block. He was also running e85 and some water injection. Tuned with a utec. Other than that it was a stock bottom end with some mileage and stock wrx heads with cams. Of course he had to use all the wrx wiring and ecu to go with the heads. Keep in mind that for the most part it all depends on the heads you use as to what wiring and manifold. The ej blocks are all basically the same dimensin wise. If you used a used td04 or small vf series turbo you should be fine. Run a mild amount of boost. just make sure if you use the old wires and stuff that you put in bigger injectors and run some kind of FMU(1:1) to add fuel based on boost reference. The problem with running an older ecu id that you have limited tuning. To be honest if you are not sure about tuning and this is gonna be a daily driver and not be tinkered with alot. I would try to do a complete swap. Yes it's more pricey up front but in the end you'll probably spend more trying to make stuff work. People do it all the time but the amount of time and energy exerted is pretty extreme. You can find, if you look carefully whole wrecked wrx's for less than 3k. There are also "swaps" avaliable on the interent. They come mostly ready to drop in. with a lot less worry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatswhatshesaid Posted January 28, 2010 Author Share Posted January 28, 2010 What kind of hybrid combo could I put together using the Phase II EJ25 heads/intake (so I could keep the wiring)? EJ22T bottom end? It would be closed deck... Any other options? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WRX2FFU Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 Hell, you could just throw some pistons, bearings, maybe rods, maybe cams in your ej25 and use it. Or yes an ej22t would work too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatswhatshesaid Posted January 28, 2010 Author Share Posted January 28, 2010 It looks like my CR with the 2.5 heads on a 2.2T block would run about 7.7:1 (or slightly different depending on which HG I use)...this seems very boost-friendly. Too boost-friendly...ha ha. (I'd probably want to up it a little...) So, has anyone here used the Phase II heads on a 22T block? If so, what supporting modifications did you do? What other parts did the build require? (custom pistons, etc) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericem Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 Check out legacycentral should work just fine. You can even run N/A cams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WRX2FFU Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 It looks like my CR with the 2.5 heads on a 2.2T block would run about 7.7:1 (or slightly different depending on which HG I use)...this seems very boost-friendly. Too boost-friendly...ha ha. (I'd probably want to up it a little...) So, has anyone here used the Phase II heads on a 22T block? If so, what supporting modifications did you do? What other parts did the build require? (custom pistons, etc) You'd definatly want to bump up that comp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatswhatshesaid Posted January 28, 2010 Author Share Posted January 28, 2010 You'd definatly want to bump up that comp. I know. Using the thick DOHC head gasket, the CR would be 7.2, I think. Thin HG would yield 7.7. Custom pistons to alleviate this, perhaps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatswhatshesaid Posted January 28, 2010 Author Share Posted January 28, 2010 (edited) Is my intake manifold compatible with the DOHC heads? And if not, will my wiring work with the DOHC intake? Edited January 28, 2010 by thatswhatshesaid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWDfreak Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 I envy you for having such options... Because I got the EJ25D equipped Outback with that awful non-functional hood scoop!!! If my engine dies, I will NOT have the option of swapping in an EJ22t since I'm in California (where the eco nazis and car crazy people fight), which means passing smog is mandatory. Unfortunately, running an EJ22t won't pass smog since I have a 1999 Outback. So, no TMIC for me. Enough of my stupid rant. Unfortunately, I cannot answer your questions. All I can do is hope for the best for your engine swap When it's all done, show us the awesomeness of a turbocharged, manual Outback! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WRX2FFU Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 (edited) I know. Using the thick DOHC head gasket, the CR would be 7.2, I think. Thin HG would yield 7.7. Custom pistons to alleviate this, perhaps? I would try to stay away from too thin a hg. Might see what sti pistons would get you. Might have to run the rods and crank too though. You could also have the engine and heads decked. A few thousands either way would help. Is my intake manifold compatible with the DOHC heads? And if not, will my wiring work with the DOHC intake? I don't think you can use the sohc intake with the dohc heads You could try it. The wiring will probably not be complete. You might be able to use some of it but have to make a custom harness. Your gonna have a lot of research ahead of you. I am sorry for not giving you any concrete answers. I just don't know for sure becuase I have not done exactly what your doing. There are too many details that I will not have unless I researched/did it. Honestly your best be it just to try things and see what works. See if you can get used/junk parts to help make measurements. A lot of people have junk laying around that they will part with cheap. Edited January 28, 2010 by WRX2FFU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatswhatshesaid Posted January 29, 2010 Author Share Posted January 29, 2010 I know. Using the thick DOHC head gasket, the CR would be 7.2, I think. Thin HG would yield 7.7. Custom pistons to alleviate this, perhaps? Anyone? any more advice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Durania Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 1) Fix the head gasket 2) Sell outback 3) Buy older WRX wagon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatswhatshesaid Posted January 30, 2010 Author Share Posted January 30, 2010 1) Fix the head gasket2) Sell outback 3) Buy older WRX wagon. You're taking all the fun out of this...ha ha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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