PAJ Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 (edited) So I'm half way through the Ej25 to EJ22 conversion on my 98 Legacy OB SW. So far so good and everything is going smooth even though I had to steal some small pieces off the EJ25. One of the engine-tranny guide pins was missing as well as one of the bottom studs and other small crap like exhaust manifold studs that were missing. Found a single port exhaust manifold just sitting on the ground at the U-pull it yard so Karma is with me and life is good so far. I intended to renege on the timing belt replacement until summer cauz it's still bloody freezing up here in PA, but someone up stairs had other plans. When I lifted the 2.2 off of the pallet that it was sitting on I discovered a nasty gash right through the center timing belt cover. No way I can let that fly so now it's off with the flywheel pulley, change the belt (at least) and a swap with the 2.5 cover. The question I have is how can I remove the bolt on the 2.2 without a buying a chain wrench or special tool? I might be able to insert a flat piece of stock through the drive plate, but the thought of messing with it makes me nervous. Any ideas? It's only 80Ft lbs so it can't be that bad.... I'll practice on the 2.5 and will likely have to tie something down and beat the snot out of it before I break that bolt loose. Also, I just saw in the manual to ALWAYS turn the crank in the clockwise direction. uh oh.... A few revolutions in the wrong direction won't open a worm hole and send me back in a time warp. Will it? BTW, I pulled the Autolite plugs from the 2.5 that have been going for at least 130k. I remember cauz that's when I got divorced and the ex left me the car. Anyway, I discovered that they had at most only a few pounds of torque keeping em in there! The electrodes are worn almost to zilch and the gap has got to be over .06, but somehow they kept going. New NGK's for the 2.2 should keep it humming. New valve cover gaskets as well. The rear baffle plate is crap plastic but no leaks. I'll have to keep it since I don't want to risk resealing it in freezing temps. Keep smilin. Edited February 9, 2011 by PAJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
93Newbaru Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 The question I have is how can I remove the bolt on the 2.2 without a buying a chain wrench or special tool? I might be able to insert a flat piece of stock through the drive plate, but the thought of messing with it makes me nervous. Any ideas? It's only 80Ft lbs so it can't be that bad.... I'll practice on the 2.5 and will likely have to tie something down and beat the snot out of it before I break that bolt loose. If you aren't in a hurry and have 9 dollars harbor freight sells a vice grip chain plier type tool. Of course there is shipping, so spend another $50-100 for other junk you may need to make it worth while. I just used the exact same tool to remove my 2.2 pulley. The chain tool jammed itself against the alternator bracket or something and I had a long 1/2 drive craftsman flex ratchet on the bolt. It's more like 130 foot pounds, and it definitely took some force to break it loose. Beating isn't a good idea, bloody knuckles, broken tool, stripped bolt head....etc. Tool: http://www.harborfreight.com/locking-chain-clamp-36813.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 1/2" ratchet. 22mm socket. BFH. I do this all the time. Or a 1/2" impact wrench if you have air. I do that if the engine is out. I also have a IR 2025MAX now - which is just AWESOME. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afterbang Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 big ************ing hammer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 big ************ing hammer? Yep - and you have seen me do it . GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 "No way I can let that fly so now it's off with the flywheel pulley, change the belt (at least) and a swap with the 2.5 cover" Just so you know, the 2.5 center cover won't work on your 2.2 if that was the plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lesstutrey Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 my electric impact wrench does 1280lbs of torque.. though i've never even come close to using that, sound like a good way to break ones wrist. I found it in the ceiling at a jobsite, can't beat free (all the sheet metal fabrication guys for HVAC use torque drivers now instead of drills, for good reason) Also it was the same brand (makita) and battery type (18v 3ah li-ion) i use for my drill (if milwaukee or dewalt still made metal tools they might still have my business, makita won me over long ago). But yeah, without a impact driver a BFH (i use a 3lb) the longest 1/2" ratchet you have and a 22mm socket.. maybe even get one for an impact driver cause you can break cheap sockets pretty easy with a hammer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAJ Posted February 9, 2011 Author Share Posted February 9, 2011 Great ideas! I'll saunter down to harbor Freight for my Chinese chain wrench and a 6 point socket. Sure the 2.5 center cover won't fit? I didn't scrutinize it but it seemed to be similar. If it doesn't fit then it'll be another one of my ugly pig putty projects... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Positive, It'll bolt right on the block, but it's way different because of the large side covers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAJ Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 (edited) I went to Harbor Freight and the guy said that they got rid of chain wrenches a few years back, so it was mother of invention time. I finally mickeyd a flat tire iron through the 2.2 driveplate to brace the crank and got both the pulleys off. Turns out that both center covers are for identical down to the part #. They're also both labeled EJ22. Too bad for my EJ25. That old belt looks as good as new while the 2.2 belt looks like trash. Whoever did the last job on the 2.2 didn't replace the center cover properly, letting all kinds of schmutz into the space. Ahhhh more work... I wish I could post the pics. They're pretty entertaining. Edited February 10, 2011 by PAJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Where in PA are you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAJ Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 I'm on the right side of course! Near Reading. Farrrr away from youins. This damn thing is pissing me off at every turn now. Either the belt skipped, or whoever did the last belt job missed the left cam mark by 2 teeth. the belt didn't have much slack and the tensioner looks good so I vote for a knucklehead job. The thing really must have run like poop. How do you know if the idlers are shot? Everyone here swaps em out religiously, but I've seen a couple articles that say they rarely go. They sound like skateboard wheels and the ones on my 2.5 that have 265K on em look and sound better. I'm tempted to swap em out, but know that I'll probably spend the 100 bucks it'll take to get new ones. Ahhhh more $$$. The last person who changed the water pump didn't reinstall a gasket seal between the unit and the engine so dirt flew in there as well as through the gasket missing from the center cover. Ponderous man, ponderous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 If you are near reading, then you are probably pretty close to me. I'm about 5 minutes away from Pottsville. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 (edited) How do you know if the idlers are shot? Everyone here swaps em out religiously, but I've seen a couple articles that say they rarely go. for me it would depend on the year of the 2.2L engine and what my time is worth. if it is a 95 - 96 non-interference engine you can take a chance. especialy if you don't mind opening it up again in 20k miles. (i don't want to do that so i replace all.) but on an interference engine the risk is just too great, in my opinion. but if you have more time than money , now, maybe put it together and drive it for a few months until you have more bucks. everyone always says replace all, it's just a few more $$, do the seals, it's just a few more $$, but those few more $$ add up and can double the price of the replacement engine. but still, i replace all. that way if it i sell it i don't worry about the next guy. better karma that way. i have removed 2 2.5L engine and installed 2 2.2L engines with all new timing components. and in all four i have not found a complete set of used idlers i would reuse. one or two, but not a set. and it is almost cheaper to buy the kit off ebay than to buy one idler from a local parts store. Edited February 11, 2011 by johnceggleston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAJ Posted February 12, 2011 Author Share Posted February 12, 2011 Unfortunately I'm on the PottsTOWN side not the PottsVILLE side. Big difference. More fun up North side since you've got the Yuengling brewery and the neat Carboniferous Fern fossils. Thanks John C. I came to the same conclusion. I've been nickled and dimed to death so far. My 450.00 engine is up to 650.00 right now. For some reason the import expert e-bay site doesn't have timing parts for 97. I'll have to go to their website. Next time I'l take my chances on the 100 buck u-pull no return/no warranty EJ25. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 importexperts don't have every kit on Ebay all the time. But whne they do have stuff on Ebay sometimes its an even better price. Had that experience with a VW clutch kit recently. I think they are open this monring on the left coast. I just ordered another set friday for an 02. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAJ Posted February 17, 2011 Author Share Posted February 17, 2011 So I finally got my idlers and belt in the mail from Import Experts and I'm all set! The marks on the belt are there in the correct position to make the job easy as cake. I lined everything up perfectly and followed the instructions. After letting the tensioner do it's thing I rotated the crank (to the right of course!) for 4 cycles and saw that the marks didn't line up with the tic marks. I was off each mark by 1 tooth. WTF? I removed everything, read the instructions again, and took another crack at it. The damn thing did it again! All the cam and crank reluctor tic marks are in the proper position and the belt marks are all off by 1 tooth, probably due to some cosmic law, so I'm not overly perturbed since I have the right # of teeth on each side. I just wanted to know if this is a regular occurrence or if I'm retarded somehow (like all my friends say). : ) Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Re-align your belt then turn the engine over 422 times. It should line up again! You might enjoy this for a little light reading: http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=74629&highlight=timing+belt+line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 if the cam and crank hash marks are correct, then the timing is correct. the belt marks are not important after you put it on. just he hash marks. drive on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAJ Posted February 17, 2011 Author Share Posted February 17, 2011 HAHAHA!!! Mucho thanx dudes! Now I can feel a bit better at the start of my reconstruction. I've already come up with what looks like an extra piece of the center timing belt cover gasket, but for the life of me can't figure out where the hell it goes. It's just a screw hole and ~ 3" piece. The center cover is pretty much covered by what I've got so I'll be damned if I can figure out where it goes. Maybe it's off the 2.5 and got mixed in with the 2.2 pile..... Ahhhhhhhh.......... : ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAJ Posted February 22, 2011 Author Share Posted February 22, 2011 (edited) HA HA! It's alive!!! After spending most of Sunday getting the dog together only to find that the bastard overheats unless the heater is blasting, I perused some threads that advised checking the thermostat to see that it was OE. I was skeptical to say the least, and didn't want to drain the coolant again, but after seeing what the last chimp that worked on the 2.2 did to mess up the timing belt installation I thought I'd better give it the hairy eyeball. Of course it had a dinky aftermarket unit in there so I slunked with my tail between my legs to the dealership to get some MORE stuff. Since I'm cheap and I didn't want to pay $$$ for a new one I just got a thermo gasket and coolant conditioner. Back at the hooch I "borrowed" the 98' OE one off of my 2.5 and slapped her home. I used Nippers method to burp her and I'll be damned, the thing worked perfectly. I just used the outback to return the 2.5 core to the bone yard so I'm now an official EJ22 club member. Who'd a thunk it? Now on to that increasingly persistent coffee grinder sound in the rear. It's gonna be ugly cauz it's a mass of rust that ain't been touched in many moons.... Edited February 22, 2011 by PAJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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