Broken flexplate?  Guess it wouldn't start then.

 

Missing flexplate bolts?

I dont see this happening without being pretty noisey.

 

He says he has clean fluid and nothing when revved which kinda rules out the TC. Aside from the splines of the TC. stripping the at the pump shaft or one of the shafts. Maybe the shaft failed but y?

Im getting the impression from looking at his website he has access to another tranny, which is why I was pushing him to drop the pan and rule out the easy and obvious. If that pump seized it took the shaft and possibly TC with it. If it grenaded the tranny may be full of pieces and where the heck will you find those replacement pump innards? Then you have to wonder how many variations of 3ats are there? Safer to have one whole tranny.

 

But he is an engineer and for him to accept "all the kings horses" it will require thorough diagnostics and testing. I give him props for that. For me... 5 neutrals and a park with clean juice and no easy to spot external issues would have me at the bone yard.

All joking aside DaveT, if you do tear this critter down Ide like to see pics and documentation (I know its a pain). Not just for my personal interests in these but for the forum's. I bet its in great shape aside from what killed it. These have a bad wrap on here for several reason but in my experience with the EA81s this tranny is superior to the 4 speed manuals in reliability. 

Yeah, if the flex plate was broken or detached, it would not start. Probably would idie rough, since the torque converter has the flywheel mass and the starting gear.

Yes, next step drop pan. I get zero pressure on the test port. I do notice a barely perceptible bump in the car when engaging d or r. Nothing close to moving it though. Time is extremely valuable right now, so if it still makes sense, I'll drop the pan now. I had to swap all the tires between the dead car and the good one, in case of driving in snow. I have to go plow the driveway now. Also have to decide between pushing my parts car into the garage so I can pull the trans, or mess around looking for a loose one. I have a line on a loose one, which I plan on getting as a spare, either way. I am going to disassemble the dead one, because I want to see what broke. And the condition of the other stuf. I put all of the over 200,000 miles on this trans except the first 15,000. I don't drive like a little old lady. I'll take pics, as the car will be running before I start on the innards.

Pan dropped.  Nothing but clean ATF in there.  Ran my finger across the bottom of the pan, no gunk.

 

 

 

Might as well pull the filter too make sure theres no obstruction behind it. Im guessing u checked everything made sure it was tight, how bout those tubes? Had my fingers crossed but i guess this is the real world and nothing is that easy.

I'm betting on broken or striped pump drive.

I'm betting on broken or striped pump drive.

That pump shaft isnt much thicker than a sharpie pen. Its long too.

 

Edited January 25, 201511 yr by ihscout54

Nothing under the filter. Tubes look ok. One bolt won't screw back in. Like it had a nut, and the nut is gone now. Setting up to get the doner car in the garage.

Edited January 27, 201511 yr by DaveT

Any and all pictures appreciated on behalf of those of us who have a 3at in the stable. Best of luck getting the car back on the road.

Yes to pictures. Looks like I made the right decision today .. winched my rusty wagon with a good transmission into the garage. And it's going to snow like insane tomorrow. Only bad thing is the good car with the dead transmission has to be outside until I get the trans out of the rusty one.

That pump shaft isnt much thicker than a sharpie pen. Its long too.

 

 

I'll check that.  Anyone know if that shaft can be pulled out & re inserted without parts dropping out of place?

 

 

When I removed the one in thats my garage I tilted it and one or both shafts slid out partially. I remember fiddling to get it/them back in. Its been a couple years, and I cannot remember if it was just the turbine shaft or just pump or both. When I took the photo i wasnt able to easily slide them out. Its possible something caused play in this shaft and the splines failed. Could it just need a shaft... I hope so. But ide still be afraid to put a new one in until I know why it failed.

I'll check that.  Anyone know if that shaft can be pulled out & re inserted without parts dropping out of place?

 

 

Yes it can be pulled and replaced without any problem once the engine or trans is removed and the converter is taken out. Just be sure and reset the converter correctly when it goes back. A stripped pump shaft would cause your problem but it also could be the splines in the converter or the pump. I've seen them fail for no known reason but a seized pump would cause it.

Seems like a risky idea to just put in a new one without checking the pump is all good and no broken bit floating around in it...

I manged to get the good transmission out of the rusty car. Got the good car with the dead transmission into the garage.

Great. Now my 2nd car lost reverse and 3rd.

Wow. Well perhapse youll get lucky with this one. It might just be a band adjustment issue. If not you have a 2 for one special, two 3ats to make one good rebuilt unit.

Im very sorry to hear about this.

The show so far...

the completely dead one from the 87 is out. I turned the pump drive shaft with my fingers, and it feels draggy like oil viscosity. A known good 3AT is getting placed on the dolly to roll under the car.

Did you try to slip the shafts out? Are you still also contending with epic snow? Is the forecast calling for cloudy with a chance of total devastation?

I'll pull the shafts later tonight or tomorrow. I have to get a car running first. I have an insane situation here... I am in the cast of an amateur theater production, opening night is the 13th. I am a also building special effects for the show. I have a paying job where I run sound for another production starting Tuesday. And all the crazy snow. ... and 2 dead cars. And then I could start on the non critical jobs.... yes, more snow coming.

Ok, my 87 is drivable, the transmission from my rusted to death 92 still works.

Well, there's my problem... 

 

 

 

Pump drive shafts.  Top one is from my 86.

Bottom one is from my 90, which is the one that was in my 87 when it broke.

The 87 now has the transmission from my 92 installed, and it's working.

 

Now for the $64,000.00  question - why did the pump get stalled so bad the splines stripped clean off?

I've been following this thread silently, in "Learning Mode" as I do with many threads where I am not Sure what could be going on, I've dealt with Automatic Transmissions in the Past, even with broken differential's Spider gears, etc... but about this:

 

... why did the pump get stalled so bad the splines stripped clean off?

 

This is the very first time for me to see something like that Happening.

 

Could it be a worn bearing or gears that broke off, blocking the Pump from spinning?

 

You might need to disassemble further, to reach the mere pump's area to know the truth...

 

I hope that your transmission could be Fixable after that... Good Luck! ...Kind Regards.

Edited February 1, 201511 yr by Loyale 2.7 Turbo

Well they are just big oil pumps. The innards are tight, and it wouldnt take much the stop them up. That shaft looks professionally lathed and polished. I dont beilive that happened instantly, i was expecting a shearing or splitting. Could it just be a clearance issue with the shaft itself? The shaft is nearing 2' long right? Perhaps that thing has been wallering around back there for the last 10k, and the final 1/16th of an inch of spline failed.

 

I am glad your back on the road. This has been alot of work.

Edited February 1, 201511 yr by ihscout54

Yes, the pump shaft is very long. 

 

One of 2 cars is back in use.  I am setting up to work on transmissions now.  Since this is not going to be a quick project, in the meanwhile, I'd like to find a working 3AT that I can swap into the 2nd inoperable car.   I am in central CT, if anyone knows of a 3AT laying around, or a scrapyard likely to have such old cars, let me know...