stock90 Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 I bought my Loyale a few months back (right before spring break). the week after I bought it I took a trip to the Oregon Coast to break it in (about 7 hours one way). The entire trip I had to blast the heat to keep the temp guage out of the red . I attributed this to the fact that I was with three other college guys plus camping gear and we averaged about 80 MPH. But the car still runs that hot, even around town it still is in the upper register (riding the red). I did alot of driving this summer and whenever I hit the highway after prolonged driving I have to turn the heat on (this sucks when it's already 100 degrees outside:eek: .) -I replaced the water pump at the beginning of the summer, blew two hoses on trips during the summer, got smart and replaced the third hose before it blew too plus the thermostat and the radiator cap (a trick that someone told me works sometimes- it didn't). I'm starting to think that either my radiator is getting too old or my guage isn't registering the correct temp. I never let the temp go red but I'm still afraid I might be slow cooking my engine. Any ideas? Did I miss something obvious? Thanks for any help. Sorry about the length. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLCraig Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 My guess would be a clogged radiator. But you should try rulling out a bad reading from your gage. One way to see if the gage is in the ballpark is to let engine run while you're parked in the driveway. When the cooling fan for the radiator turns on the gage should be at or just above 1/2 way on the gage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegablade Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 check what your radiator fluid looks like i ran water in mine and it wanted to over heat alot put in fresh fluid and it doesn't overheat. just a thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thealleyboy Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Stocker: I'm assuming that you are not losing coolant. That is a whole different issue than just running hot. The rad is a good guess, but don't jump to conclusions just yet. You've already begun to overhaul your cooling system, so you may as well keep going. If it's like most 14 year old Subes, it was probably due for a partial, if not, complete do-over when you bought it. I would cut in a couple flushing tees at the heater hoses next (replace HH hoses too if you havent done so already), and attempt to clean out both the rad, and heater core. Make sure you flush in both directions. You may be able to reach a conclusion on the rad based on this procedure. If the rad checks out, I would move on to the electric fan circuit. You want to establish that the fan does come on when the car begins to heat up. If it does, I would conclude that it is a bad radiator. You may take it to a shop to check it before replacing it. But a replacement rad is always a good investment for any car you intend to keep. Also, I would be suspect of prior damage due to overheating. Even though you did the right thing by keeping the temp out of the red zone, you cannot assume the prior owner did the same. good luck, John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spideyz Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Make sure you have a enough motor oil in the engine. It may sound obious, but I was on a road trip once where the temp kept shooting up. Turned out I was low on oil. Added about a quart and a half and the temp went right back to were it should be. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stock90 Posted August 19, 2004 Author Share Posted August 19, 2004 Thanks, I just finished checking the guage, it's fine :-\ , fan comes on exactly at the mid point. I am low on oil but I've always had problems, even right after i changed the oil. When I got my car I noticed there seem to be two radiators. the one for the water system is back by the engine, it looks like it is fairly new, but the second radiator in front of it is in rough shape, has alot of gouges and stuff, is the front radiator for the hydraulic systems for the steering and brakes or something else, could it be part of the problem? Just curious. Thanks for all the advice. I think I may try flushing the whole system next. Does anyone know of a good trick for emptying the radiator, when I drained it to replace the thermostat I used what I thought was the lowest plug, it's just at the level of the lower hose connection, the coolant just trickled down the body and dripped off the skid plate, is there a more efficient way I can drain it, without getting a bunch of junk in my coolant (like the last time)? Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spideyz Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Could be an oil cooler? Trace any lines coming off it and see where they go. Does the car have AC? Any relation to AC use and the overheating problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxtar Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 good thought, that "second radiator" could be the condenser for the AC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stock90 Posted August 19, 2004 Author Share Posted August 19, 2004 Yeah it's got AC. I tink your right, it may be the condenser. just seems to be placed badly, it seems to block alot of the airflow to the radiator. BAD NEWS!!! After letting my car idle for about 20 minutes in the garage( to check the fan) and looking it over I noticed coolant dripping from the skid plate, at first I thought it was just because I had pulled the radiator cap and spilled alittle but when I stated it up and backed out there was a puddle where the car had been and a trail following my car . Upon closer examination there is a pool of coolant in the lower engine compartment and a trail leading down to it from behind where the thermostat is. nothing in front is leaking(non of the hoses, the thermo and the pump are all dry) there is a trough of coolant back underneath where the air intake connects to the engine. WTF. I try to solve one problem and another one decides to show up, FRICK . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxtar Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 i also have coolant dripping from my skid-plate. mine is the result of a bad water pump/gasket/o-ring/other. coolant leaks from there into the timing belt cover and then out the bottom of the belt housing. i'm changing the pump tonight when i get home from work. a bad pump could also be the cause of your over-heat if maybe you didn't get the seal quite right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stock90 Posted August 19, 2004 Author Share Posted August 19, 2004 a bad pump could also be the cause of your over-heat if maybe you didn't get the seal quite right.The leak is above the pump. the coolant is pooling right under the intake manifold on the right(from the drivers seat) of the engine. I started the car and didn't notice any more coming out nor did it start back up when I took th radiator cap off and squeezed the hoses. I'm hoping it will just go away but not holding my breath. I had a hose blow violently about a month ago and I took my spare out of the engine compartment for the first time ever today. maybe coolant had pooled some where and I spilled it into the areas I see it now. I don't see how coolant could be coming from that high in the engine. the thermostat is the only thing I can see in the coolant system that is higher and it is totally dry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stock90 Posted August 19, 2004 Author Share Posted August 19, 2004 no signs of coolant on the spare, must be a leak.... crap:banghead: . any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thealleyboy Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 I'd pull the big skid plate, and the two small ones on the side off, and observe for awhile. If the engine is very dirty, and you can't pinpoint the leak, you might want to use engine degreaser. Having a clean engine will help you find oil leaks too. As I said before, overheating as a result of a coolant leak is a whole different thing, and the cause could be very minor - or very major. Again, don't jump to conclusions until you identify the source of the leak. good luck, John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spideyz Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Are the heater hoses in that vacinity? They must go through the firewall somewhere below the spare tire. I dont know why there would be coolant up near the intake. Do you see it actively dripping anywhere? Since this seems to be a major problem for you right now, it might be worth the time to fully drain the system, remove and check/replace all the hoses including the heater hoses, replace radiator, water pump. If you do all that, you're probably looking at about $250 worth of parts and a +/-day work. Or don't. How much is the car worth to you? If you dont fix this problem before you drive it much (if at all), soon the car wont be worth $250. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stock90 Posted August 20, 2004 Author Share Posted August 20, 2004 After cleaning up the coolant, and cleaning up the entire engine compartment a bit, i wiped the oil off of everything (the car only leaks about a quart every 1500 miles), and putting a quart of oil in, I started the car up to see what happened... nothing, no more coolant leaking at the moment, I drove it acouple miles and still no leak, it's not even pooling up in the engine where it was before either. I'll try starting it and turning the heat on later tonight or tomorrow. my guess is that I have a heater hose leaking. I hope not though, I hope it was a fluke. I'm still running hot so I think my next move there will be to flush the radiator. by the way, I really appreciate all the advice, as a subaru newb it's awesome to have people to talk to who know what they're talking about (or at least seem to .) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thealleyboy Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Stocker: I would continue to be methodical in trying to nail this down. The fact that the problem seems intermittant is a good sign. Coolant you can see is much better than coolant dissapearing in your combustion chamber. My wild guess at this point is the bypass hose off the h20 pump. It is hard to reach, and you may have not tightened the clamp enough when you replaced the pump. The car would have to be pretty hot to build up enough pressure to lose coolant here, and when it does, the hot engine would burn off most of what comes out. It would take a good workout before anything is visible. good luck, John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdjdc Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Okay..... you are pushing your luck allowing this car to run as hot as you describe. First, you need to replace the radiator. A fourteen year old radiator isn't going to do the trick, even with a flush. It will cost you about 125.00 for the radiator and they are easy to swap out. When As for the leak, look under the intake and you will see a very thin hose going from the block to the side of the thermostat housing. That is most likely the cause of the leak. This hose need to be replaced. It is a PIA, but if it fails on the road, like it did for me< it means a tow job unless you carry enough tools and hose with you to remove the intake on the side of the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stock90 Posted August 21, 2004 Author Share Posted August 21, 2004 exactly what I was planning on doing( with the radiator ), and thanks for the info n the hose (that's exactly where the coolant came from so i'm sure thats prolly what caused it (I'll get started tomorrow). thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spideyz Posted August 23, 2004 Share Posted August 23, 2004 So how did this play out? Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stock90 Posted August 23, 2004 Author Share Posted August 23, 2004 Just updating those who helped me out on this, I ordered the radiator today ($85- brand new) It should come in on wednesday, when I'll put it in. The leak is proving difficult to pin point, It disappeared for a couple days, but yesterday I checked again and there are splash puddles in the lower engine compartment again, ther are no puddles up high this time and I can't see where the coolant is coming from, until I figure it out I'm not driving my car without the heater on, usually if I just keep the defog on low the temp barely even goes above midway. As a result of cleaning my lower engine compartment I also discovered where my oil leaks ( I lose about a quart every 1500) it's coming out of the timing belt cover ( oil pump gasket?) is this worth fixing, should I do it while i've got the radiator out or will it just start leaking again in a couple months? Thanks again for the advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdjdc Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 That seems like a minor leak and the most common place for it is the oil pump. However, if you are going to be in there you should change the cam seals, front main and the timing belts. Once its all done you are good for another 80,000. Make sure to get subaru OEM seals at the dealer. You will need the cam seals (2) and O rings for the back of the seal carrier, the front main, the Mickey mouse gasket for the oil ump and the pump O ring. Plus the belts of course. It is worth doing as routine maintanence and it shouldn't start leaking again in a few months. Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmmCeeBee Posted August 24, 2004 Share Posted August 24, 2004 Just a possibility for your coolant leak: I chased a similar leak for a few months, I could never find a hose or gasket that was the culprit. It would drip for hours after I drove it -- always from the left side (driver's side). I'd find a small puddle under the engine, in the parking lot and in the garage. Finally determined it was a faulty radiator cap. It wouldn't hold 13psi, so when the engine was hot it let coolant escape to the expansion (overflow) tank. I never saw the tank full -- the physics involved means as soon as the engine cools a few degrees, the radiator sucks back a cup or two of coolant. But when driving the car, the expansion tank would overflow, leaving little puddles of coolant around the battery shelf and inside fender. These puddles would drip in the garage.... A new cap (plus a new radiator), and she's as good as new. -- Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stock90 Posted August 26, 2004 Author Share Posted August 26, 2004 Just another update, I picked up the radiator yesterday and put it in today, drove it around a little, seems to be doing awesome, it almost takes too long to warm up now:) . The subie is ready to go now, no more frying myself on hot days, now I can use the AC instead of the heater:banana: ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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