chilly b Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 Hello again all - Thanks to all of those who gave me valuable input as I was deciding to buy my '97 Outback. Well, I bought the car last week for $4000 (which seems like a good deal, considering that it's in reasonably good shape, has only 129,000 miles and had the head gaskets replaced last year.) One of the reasons I talked the previous owner down so low is that, according to him, the timing belt was long overdue for a change and that's a pricey job. Based on input from folks here on the Board, I was planning on ordering the parts online and doing the job myself (replacing the timing belt, plus the related jobs of replacing the water pump, thermostat, gaskets, seals, pulley, tensioner, hoses, etc.) But here's the weird thing... This morning I visited the shop that did te head gasket work last year, simply to get their help in listing all the parts I would need to order to do the work on the car. I got the parts list, then went over to the service department to see if i could look at the service record from the head gasket job last year (the previous owner had lost the receipt and had no record of exactly what had been done last year). To my astonishment, the service manager showed me that, last year, not only had the head gaskets been replaced, but the shop had also replaced the water pump, gaskets, seals, pulley, idlers, tensioner, idler belt). Who-hoo! All that work I had planned on doing myself (and had deducted from the price of the car) has already been done! Previous owner spent over $3000 fixing up the car last year and, for some reason, only remembered the head gaskets being replaced. His bad memory is my financial gain! But here's the part that makes no sense. On the repair sheet from last year, there was a long long list of replaced parts but no mention of the timing belt being replaced. That makes no sense. Even the service manager is perplexed. Why would the shop (a reputable, well-respected local Subaru shop) do a $3000 repair job, replace all that stuff, and then NOT replace a $70 timing belt. Service manager wasn't around back then and has no explanation other than that the timing belt may have seemed fine and so they decided not to bother replacing it. Does that make sense? The more imporant question is this: Assuming that for some reason the timing belt wasn't replaced last year (i.e., the shop didn't just forget to include it on the replaced part list), should I go with the service manager's recommendation and just leave it alone? Or should I buy a new one and replace it anyway? I apologize for the length of this post but I really would like some knowledgable input and thought that the full context was important. Any input from the tech mavens on the board would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subiefan Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 It may have been replaced and was not recorded, but to be safe, I would change it anyway. '96 was the last year for non-interference engines, so your '97 has the interference engine. If you don't replace it, and it breaks, your going to have some serious damage on your hands. (It's called an interference engine because the pistons will "interfere" with the valves if a timimg belt breaks. The valves could be in the wrong position at the wrong time and get struck by a piston. Bye-bye valves.) Better safe than sorry. I would replace it. Just my 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 Is it possible to inspect it? Perhaps the shop used a non-Subaru part that is marked differently? (any indication of that on the repair history for the other parts?) Is there any mention in the labor side of the ticket of TB replacement? Is there a numerical amount recorded that is approx. the right price for a TB with a blank or duplicate part description next to it? too bad, but yeah, you may need to change it to be safe. Think of it as karma for the mistaken price reduction! lol! Carl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilly b Posted September 22, 2005 Author Share Posted September 22, 2005 Is it possible to inspect it? Perhaps the shop used a non-Subaru part that is marked differently? (any indication of that on the repair history for the other parts?) Is there any mention in the labor side of the ticket of TB replacement? Is there a numerical amount recorded that is approx. the right price for a TB with a blank or duplicate part description next to it? The service manager wouldn't give me a copy of the service record (citing privacy issues of the previous owner) but he let have a quick look. There was too much there for me to remember but one odd thing was an notation for an "idler belt" for $135. The service mgr called someone about it and he told me that they claimed it was a reference to the tensioner (which seemed odd and wrong to me). Any possibility that this "idler belt" is actually the timing belt? Or is there really an idler belt separate from the timing belt? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 You should pull off one of the pieces of the timing belt cover and have a look. If the belt was replaced that recently, it should still look pretty darn new. It would be absolutely stupid of them to not replace the belt, seeing how they had to take it off to do the rest of the work and the extra money for the belt is a pittance compared to the total cost for the repairs, but maybe they didn't replace it. Check the belt so you know what's going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 the "idler belt" is likely just a pulley, not the belt. they wouldn't call a belt that name and timing belts don't cost $135 even at a dealer. pull the covers and have a look. pulling the side covers should only take a couple minutes and you'd be done. if you can't see anything, have a 22mm socket (i think) ready to turn the motor over by hand, that way you can turn the belt until you see the writing on it "SUBARU" for instance to tell how warn or not-so-warn it is. you could just bump the key for a second to turn the motor over to a new position a couple of times if you don't have a socket...just wait for the timing belt to stop in different locations until you see the markings on the belt. this will give you an idea of the age of the belt. post a picture of the belt if you're not sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilly b Posted September 22, 2005 Author Share Posted September 22, 2005 pull the covers and have a look. pulling the side covers should only take a couple minutes and you'd be done... post a picture of the belt if you're not sure. Cool. That I can do. I was worried I'd have to take everything apart just to even see the timing belt. I'll take a look at it this weekend and post pictures. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 the mechanic probably thought it was good to go for another 39,000 miles. I would have changed it on a job this big myself because I think it is false economy. I had a dealer do a clutch job and not chage the $10 pilot bearing on me. Same stupid thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheetah8799 Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 I too was going to suggest that you pull the covers off and look at the belt. I know on my 98 Legacy Outback it is pretty easy to do. I think can even be done without pulling off the radiator fans, but is a little trickier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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