shortlid Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Where is the "cheapest AWD vehicle" idea any more. Just looking into the SHARP, BIGGER, V6 powered 7 PASS. '06 RAV4 and was FLOORED when I found out it is CHEAPER than the '06 OBW equiped the same way!! Now that Toyota has a stake they should correct this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 I agree, the RAV4 went from being way smaller than a Forester to being way larger. Also, the RAV4 can now be equiped with a V6. Tme will tell, this is the first model year for the new RAV4. I decided NOT to pay for the dubious priviledge of being a beta tester. The new RAV4 can't match the safety or collision rating of the Forester. Also, the third seat is something of a joke. I'm glad to see big improvement in the RAV4. When manufacturers are forced to compete for market share, all consumers usually win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 I agree, the RAV4 went from being way smaller than a Forester to being way larger. Also, the RAV4 can now be equiped with a V6. Tme will tell, this is the first model year for the new RAV4. I decided NOT to pay for the dubious priviledge of being a beta tester. The new RAV4 can't match the safety or collision rating of the Forester. Also, the third seat is something of a joke. I'm glad to see big improvement in the RAV4. When manufacturers are forced to compete for market share, all consumers usually win. We will see on the crash test results the new very $$$$$ Toyota is not likely to put a sub five star car on the market! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
75subie Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 the new rav's look like a dog, for that, you might as well buy a 4 runner or awd sienna. i liked the 2001-2005 body style the best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 Really, you think it looks that bad. My extended family has had Roos since the 70's and one look at the new RAV4 and it's price tag and they are jumping ship! I guess only time will tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAezb Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Another low $20k offering from Toyota that I think will also cut into Subaru's market: http://trucks.about.com/od/2007suvs/ss/07_fjcruiser.htm Only 3 doors/ 5 seating though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otis Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Ain't competition great?? I always wished our forester was a "little" bigger. Something like the new rav4 would have been perfect for us. I even like the "joke" 3rd row seat. you don't know how many times we've had a guest where we needed to take an extra car to get somewhere because the 2 car seats wouldn't allow room for the 5th or 6th passenger. we won't be buying one simply because our next car will probably end up being a minivan. but if this rav4 was available 3 years ago- I probably wouldn't have know this forum existed. I always thought between the forester, crv and rav4, the rav4 was the worst. now honda and subaru have something to think about. But seeing how this is a subaru forum, I'll say this.... BAD Toyota!! Bad toyota!! how dare you show us why you are the leader in the automotive world. go back to having at least 1 bad apple in your stable of cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 Otis Yota even has us beat there! The new AWD Toyota Sennia minivan ROCKS rented one in Montana and went OFF_ROADING in five inches of mud with seven people on board. Pulled right through it. Rental car prep guys were less than amused! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 Another low $20k offering from Toyota that I think will also cut into Subaru's market: http://trucks.about.com/od/2007suvs/ss/07_fjcruiser.htm Only 3 doors/ 5 seating though They are going to kick Jeep Wranglers off there 60 year perch (tech. just as old) with the FJ. Not really a Subaru replacement! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rugbyben Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 They are going to kick Jeep Wranglers off there 60 year perch (tech. just as old) with the FJ. Not really a Subaru replacement! Funny ist that what Honda said when they built the element? and this car is just a slightly better looking cosin. Not a chance they will unseat Jeep. The wrangler will still be far superior from a performance standpoint then the FJ can hope to be. remember the wrangler is not and never will be designed to be economical, and Toyota will never build a car where functionality will eclipse gas mileage and low cost materials. So wrangler has the actual 4-wheel enthusiast market held solid, And youre forgetting one fact. Wrangler comes in a soft top, which corners the rich college kid market too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 I was going to ad "in the North"! You are right in warm climates the jeep still has the soft top. But who wants to ride in a soft top during a New Engalnd winter? NOT I!! The element is CRV based (AKA CUTEUTE!) Not enough articulation, or ground clearance for true off-roading. If Honda said that they are kidding them selves and Element sales prove it. Also guys who TRUELY off road want a reliable rig. That is why the first Fj40's realy put a dent in the Jeep CJ5-CJ7 market. JEEPS are NOT reliabel I have owned no fewer than FIVE, much to my dismay! Including the '55 Willy's I had. My Dad's '66 FJ40 ran without a drive line overhaul for 350,000 miles. In that time it had been drivin up and over a ROCK WALL at 35 mph, "TWO" large oak trees fell on it while camping in a wind storm (only damage was broken windsheild frame, bent roll cage and blown out shocks and tires at all four corners). Now I know the FJ is not the same solid taxle truck the FJ40's were but it is based off the shortened Tacoma platform. And the Tacoma is no off-road slouch! Why are we talking about this on a Subaru board?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rugbyben Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Why are we talking about this on a Subaru board?? Good point. Neither are dirrect competition for Subaru. i personally dont think the rav 4 is really going to do that much dammage. Were only taking about a small a segment of the larger general all wheel drive family car market. Lets face it. no car company can afford to compete in every subset. The way i see it, (from a financial analyst's standpoint) Subaru has a choice to make. Invest the capital to commpete in a subset of modern Atomic family market with a sporty 7 seater, or maintain the global view and offer one broader model (Tribeca) for the large family size market, and the Forrester or legacy outback for the midsized family market. putting yet another model in between to bridge the gap in both size, "sportyness" and price may not give enough value to subaru. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zyewdall Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Also guys who TRUELY off road want a reliable rig. That is why the first Fj40's realy put a dent in the Jeep CJ5-CJ7 market. JEEPS are NOT reliabel I have owned no fewer than FIVE, much to my dismay! Including the '55 Willy's I had. My Dad's '66 FJ40 ran without a drive line overhaul for 350,000 miles. In that time it had been drivin up and over a ROCK WALL at 35 mph, "TWO" large oak trees fell on it while camping in a wind storm (only damage was broken windsheild frame, bent roll cage and blown out shocks and tires at all four corners). Well... it looks a lot like the FJ40 in the grill, but it's got the same ugly boxiness that all of the SUV's are going to for the 2006 models. Big square plastic bumpers and such. Makes me want to hurl. Funny, cause I like the boxy look of EA82 subies, and of old isuzu troopers -- a true box on wheels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger83 Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 I paid $26,000 for my 06 Outback 3.0R (H6) I guess I need to send the dealer some money? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerFahrer Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Subarus - good. Toyotas - boring, but good (Can you believe the V6 in that new RAV4 has 269hp???) Jeeps - garbage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrian Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Another low $20k offering from Toyota that I think will also cut into Subaru's market: http://trucks.about.com/od/2007suvs/ss/07_fjcruiser.htm Only 3 doors/ 5 seating though I was expecting you to say Matrix. 4WD tall station wagon for ~$19k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 The Matrix is squarly where the base Impreza should be!! And with the impreza having a 5-speed and AWD if it was cheaper it would kill the Yota!! maybe now there will be only ONE cheap AWD platform? subyluvr2212 you could not be more right! And if Yota offered the Matrix AWD in XRS (180 hp) or 5-speed we would wipe out boring! Subarus - good. Toyotas - boring, but VERY good (Can you believe the V6 in that new RAV4 has 269hp??? on 87 Octane!) Jeeps - TOTAL garbage. I can't wait to see the fruits of the Yota/FHI pairing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rugbyben Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Lets not knock jeeps too bad. They are different from subarus. not garbage. I got 150K miles out of a 98 wrangler with NO problems and then sold it for $5K. in perfect working order. It was a very reliable and fun vehicle. which is capable off road, even bone stock. Just because you are in love with one kind of 4wd vehicle doesnt mean you cant appreciate another. jump off the subaru is the ONLY good vehicle band wagon for a moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 Lets not knock jeeps too bad. They are different from subarus. not garbage. I got 150K miles out of a 98 wrangler with NO problems and then sold it for $5K. in perfect working order. It was a very reliable and fun vehicle. which is capable off road, even bone stock. Just because you are in love with one kind of 4wd vehicle doesnt mean you cant appreciate another. jump off the subaru is the ONLY good vehicle band wagon for a moment. rugbyben, glad you had a good experince with a YJ (98) Wrangler. I have had TWO $23,000 '90's Grand Wagneers, a CJ7, a Cherokee Sport, and a '55 Wily's Overland (CJ5). All of my Jeeps were JUNK, even the ones I bought from new! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zephyr Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 My buddy rented a Cherokee Sport for a road trip. Came by my house early in the morning to pick me up... I HATED that thing before we even reached the end of the street I live on. The rest of the trip was not much better, I was so glad to return that thing. However, we were able to drive that thing faster than any other UV or mini van we have rented for our roadies, however much that is worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rugbyben Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 You have your opinions .... I have mine. My dream stable would include a 2004 subaru STI, and a lifted 81 hatch. as well as a 2005 Wrangler Rubicon. Oh and a 2005 Carerra 4 (Twin Turbo European addition) he he he... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 You have your opinions .... I have mine. My dream stable would include a 2004 subaru STI, and a lifted 81 hatch. as well as a 2005 Wrangler Rubicon. Oh and a 2005 Carerra 4 (Twin Turbo European addition) he he he... That's what makes the world go round! I will take a 2007 STI LEGACY GT (six speed), the exact Cererra 4 you mentioned, and a MB Uni-Mog, and a KTM Super Duke II (not sole in the US)! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger83 Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 rugbyben, glad you had a good experince with a YJ (98) Wrangler. I have had TWO $23,000 '90's Grand Wagneers, a CJ7, a Cherokee Sport, and a '55 Wily's Overland (CJ5). All of my Jeeps were JUNK, even the ones I bought from new! Slow learner? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 269HP? that's a lot for that "little" RAV4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 Ranger83 you are right why would I keep geting them if they let me down. All comes to $$. One of the Grand Wagoneers was GIVEN to me by my Uncle that collects them for use around our farm to pull hay wagoons. The second he gave me the money to buy casue he wanted it after I fixed it up. The CJ7 was a friend that sold it to me cheap, the Cherokee Sport was out of a junk yard for $200! The '55 Willy's was in a field in KY, where I was working at the time. Old timer sold it to me for $5!! I had to put a new engine in it though. I would have given the whole lot of them for "one" 300,000 mile, beat-up, not running Toyota FJ40!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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