nipper Posted June 21, 2006 Share Posted June 21, 2006 can't you check the timing with a light before you go to the expense and labor of replacing the belt??? if the crank and cam sensors are gorssly out or synch, the ECU wont send a spark signal (from what ive seen). nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 21, 2006 Share Posted June 21, 2006 The thing that seems to have gotten this discussion started was the mechanic's claim that there was almost no compression on all but one cylinder. As has already been stated, you can't do a compression test when the valve timing doesn't relate to crank/piston position. like i said, the mechanic deosnt want your business, he doesnt want to work on the car. i'm glad somone remebered that part nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMattyD Posted June 21, 2006 Share Posted June 21, 2006 Here is my opinion: If you are concerned that there is some other type of damage to your engine and don't want to spend a lot of money, do this: Take the car home, remove the old timing belt, and install a new one yourself. Cost: Timing belt (60-70 bucks?) Do not replace any seals, oil pump, h20 pump, idlers, tensioner, etc. Make sure the timing belt is installed correctly. Now you can do a compression test. If the results are ok, you may elect to remove the timing belt and replace any of the above maintenance items. If the compression test is horrible, you are at the point at which you can decide whether or not you want to keep the car. If you have never dont a timing belt, search for posts on this board. They are very informative and give you all the info you need to be able to do the job without any special tools. If you want to do the compression test, you will need to buy a compression gauge at your local auto parts store. I do not believe they are all that pricey. I have a strong feeling that your car will be ok with the new timing belt installed. Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 21, 2006 Share Posted June 21, 2006 Here is my opinion: If you are concerned that there is some other type of damage to your engine and don't want to spend a lot of money, do this: Take the car home, remove the old timing belt, and install a new one yourself. Cost: Timing belt (60-70 bucks?) Do not replace any seals, oil pump, h20 pump, idlers, tensioner, etc. Make sure the timing belt is installed correctly. Now you can do a compression test. If the results are ok, you may elect to remove the timing belt and replace any of the above maintenance items. If the compression test is horrible, you are at the point at which you can decide whether or not you want to keep the car. If you have never dont a timing belt, search for posts on this board. They are very informative and give you all the info you need to be able to do the job without any special tools. If you want to do the compression test, you will need to buy a compression gauge at your local auto parts store. I do not believe they are all that pricey. I have a strong feeling that your car will be ok with the new timing belt installed. Matt this is the best time to learn how to do one, as it goes under the heading, that you cant make things any worse, and have everything to gain. Just putting the timing belt on and cranking the engine you should be able to hear the starter working against engine compression to start. I'm going to modify my position a bit, go ahead and see if it starts, then you can replace everything, just dont drive it nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyJam Posted June 22, 2006 Author Share Posted June 22, 2006 You guys are amazing! Thank You for all your help and advice. I really appreciate it. Well, today I went to the shop and towed that sucker out of there. It is now in my driveway ready to be torn apart. Gonna start by getting down to the belt and see what kind of shape its in. Missing teeth, major cracks, no tension, etc., and I will probably assume it was that and do the entire job. If it kinda looks okay, I will just do the belt and proceed from there. Question, can I still find TDC with compression on cylinder 1 in my situation? Guess I will do my homework. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 there were recent posts here that went into detail use the search, nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjez Posted June 22, 2006 Share Posted June 22, 2006 1996 Legacy 2.2L 366kI got onto the highway yesterday and I had a sudden drop in power, moved over to the shoulder and it stalled. When I tried to start it back up, it cranks well but does not start. I figured timing belt since I have not replaced it since I bought it (172K+ miles). I pulled off the cover to take a look at the belt and it was not broke but looked Horrible (holes and cracking). So I had it towed to a random shop to have it looked at. The mechanic called me back and said my engine was done. He did a compression test and said it was VERY low in all but one cylinder. Thats the only thing he did though. He said it would cost $175 to check out the timing belt and that I would be wasting my money because he believed it was done. So what do I do???? Trash the car? Rebuild? Get a second opinion? [Main Question]Could it be the Timing belt?? Would a slipped belt cause low compression and a no start situation??? Is it a head gasket? The engine has been getting warm (3/4temp) off and on because of a dead radiator fan. I have been keeping the heat on to keep the temps low. Any other ideas? I need to decide in the next day so any advice would be greatly appreciated. Jim I just replaced timing belt on my `95 Legacy and two weeks later it would not start. timing belt slipped couple of teeth on crankshaft due to fauly tenssioner roller as well as piece of debrie got between belt and sprockets. as I could only imagine this would greatly affect the compression readings. if I was you I would take the middle timing belt cover off of the car and make sure all the timing marks are allign. if they're not then you have your answer as to why it does not run. do the timing belt, do it right though, and you'll have a runnign car again. Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyJam Posted June 23, 2006 Author Share Posted June 23, 2006 Update...Took everything off today and got a good look at the belt. For a about 10inches it is missing a lot of teeth and in general is just beat up. The timing marks are off by about 45 degrees also. I'm gonna buy all the parts and finish it up by tomorrow. I will let you all know how it turns out. Again, thanks for all the help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 Update...Took everything off today and got a good look at the belt. For a about 10inches it is missing a lot of teeth and in general is just beat up. The timing marks are off by about 45 degrees also. I'm gonna buy all the parts and finish it up by tomorrow. I will let you all know how it turns out. Again, thanks for all the help. SEE i told you a new belt and it will fire up nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPX Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 SEE i told you a new belt and it will fire up nipper Make sure to do any idler pulleys and or oil seals while you are all the way in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyJam Posted June 23, 2006 Author Share Posted June 23, 2006 Yeah nipper you were right...well lets see tomorrow. JPX...One of my idler pulleys had a VERY minute side to side movement, do you vote to change them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 Yeah nipper you were right...well lets see tomorrow. JPX...One of my idler pulleys had a VERY minute side to side movement, do you vote to change them? when in doubt change it, yes change it, as they have lots of miles on them nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2X2KOB Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 The mechanic called me back and said my engine was done. He did a compression test and said it was VERY low in all but one cylinder. Thats the only thing he did though. He said it would cost $175 to check out the timing belt and that I would be wasting my money because he believed it was done. That idiot mechanic needs to be slapped around, or at least spoken to in a derisive and condescending manner. He probably would have sold you a new engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 That idiot mechanic needs to be slapped around, or at least spoken to in a derisive and condescending manner. He probably would have sold you a new engine. i bet he didnt do a damn thing once he realized it was jumped. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPX Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 Yeah nipper you were right...well lets see tomorrow. JPX...One of my idler pulleys had a VERY minute side to side movement, do you vote to change them? Kind of depends....if you are trying to truly make this thing 99-100%, then yes, you should change any suspect pulley. But the other side of things is that you have a high mileage engine and chance are something else will probably break before that pulley dies. These things aren't remarkably cheap - just depends if you are cheap, and there is no dishonor in that with a veteran engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 Kind of depends....if you are trying to truly make this thing 99-100%, then yes, you should change any suspect pulley. But the other side of things is that you have a high mileage engine and chance are something else will probably break before that pulley dies. These things aren't remarkably cheap - just depends if you are cheap, and there is no dishonor in that with a veteran engine. except that these engines do run forever if well maintained. Then there is the other cost benefit value, 150.00 (or whatever it is) versuese 2-3000 for replacement car thats a stranger to you. If this was a GM ford or even toyota i would think twice about it, a soobaru, do it right the first timew and it will keep going. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 change any suspect pulleys or repack the bearings. many subaru bearings can be repacked for a couple cents worth of grease like this: http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=50430 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMattyD Posted June 23, 2006 Share Posted June 23, 2006 Good thing there are smart dudes like us here on the USMB to keep people from listening to bad mechanics.... Matt D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyJam Posted June 26, 2006 Author Share Posted June 26, 2006 UPDATE!!! Started right up today! Had to replace the belt, timing pulley gear, one idler pulley and I actually keep tensioner. The tensioner pulley spun well and the tensioner adjuster was in good shape. New water pump and thermo and new seals. I am very relieved the engine is not dead and that mechanic was incompetent. I couldn't have done it without all of your help. Thank You again. Now, how do I shove it back in that mechanics face? Maybe I will pull up, honk my horn til he comes out and throw the old belt at him. Dude had me looking in the classifieds for a car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 soooooooooooooooooooooooo there is that little matter about a bet nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fnlyfnd Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 good news . Tell everyone you know to never go to that mechanic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 PS. I'ld still feel better with a new tensioner, i dont want you back here in 20,000 miles or less saying your car wont start. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted June 26, 2006 Share Posted June 26, 2006 Way to go, JimmyJam. Your stick-to-it-iveness paid off. Must be a great feeling to turn the key now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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