matts87glsedan Posted May 12, 2007 Share Posted May 12, 2007 i now have all the necessary bits from a 91 loyale pb4wd to swap into my gl. I am wondering if i could swap the entire 91 harness into my car, as opposed to peeling it apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 14, 2007 Author Share Posted May 14, 2007 hmmm - could this be such a patently stupid question that no one wants to touch it? i hate it when i say that kind of sheeit. i just ask because after reading thru my trusty swap doc., i think it may be less brain hurting for me... i havent yet compared it plug for plug, I guess that would be a good place to start. anyway, the fuel pump's in:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatchsub Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 You will still have to go through the SPFI harness and figure out what you will be hooking up and labeling wires so why not stripe off what you dont need while your at it? I suppose if you really dont want to it wont make a difference but it will look cleaner if you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeshoup Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 It would probably be easier to strip it down... Less wire clutter to have to deal with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 16, 2007 Author Share Posted May 16, 2007 ok thanks guys. i have another Q now. all the hardware is on, and i have two mystery hoses. 1) is the steel line that runs along the frame rail below the hill holder/ brake resevoir on the driver side. looks like a fuel line. what to do with that? 2) is the vac hose on the manifold, driver side. the small steel line that angles up from the back side of the manifold. does it plumb into the brake booster line? once these two are connected, its just wires left i'll post pics in a half hour, but if anyone gets that description, could you help me out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 16, 2007 Author Share Posted May 16, 2007 heres the pics pic 2 is looking at the back side of the driver side of the manifold Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted May 16, 2007 Share Posted May 16, 2007 the line off the frame is the fuel tank vent line, the other line on the intake is the vac manifold for the purge control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 20, 2007 Author Share Posted May 20, 2007 well, heres where im at. I went ahead and pulled the whole dash forward harness from the 91 as suggested in the writeup by GD. now, like i was askin before, i just went ahead and peeled out the old harness, and hooked up the entire new harness in my car, thinking that i wouldnt have to run any power to anything after if i went this way, except probably the fuel pump. (i call this "intuitive mechanics" - meaning i dont know what the flock i'm doing.) Anyway, everything lights up, but she wont turn over... i eliminated the clutch switch as a problem, but am somewhat lost. I'd like to just press forward with the new harness in , and was wondering if anyone more pro than me could point me in the right direction. i realise that babysitting a guy thru something that he was too stubborn to just follow the instructions on is lame, so feel free to heap on some scorn with any tips you might have:) ... or, if it is absolutely more work to continue at this point than it would be to just take it all out and strip the old and new harnesses and follow instructions, maybe let me in on that. but goddamit, why didnt that work? it seemed like a good idea at the time.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 20, 2007 Author Share Posted May 20, 2007 ok. ive determined that besides the ignition relay brown plug), there is also a starter relay(blue plug). this was up on the driverside wall of the 91 . i have juice to the ignition relay, but not to the starter relay. now, the starter relay is computer controlled wwith a light green and yellow wire? the power input pins on the ECC show no voltage, although fuse 3 and 11 have juice. these two fuses are shown on my 87 fuse map to be EEC power. i am however using the 91 fuse box. there was also a black relay box beside the starter switch which i grabbed. incidentally, what does it do? it is 4:30 am, and i am going back to the garage:headbang: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted May 20, 2007 Share Posted May 20, 2007 There's no such thing as a "starter relay" (unless you count the solenoid, which is mounted on the starter). The crank circuit is not a relay circuit. Full soleoid power flows through the ignition switch, and optionally the inhibitor switch if you have an automatic. My write up covers the wiring pretty well: http://home.comcast.net/~trilinear/EA81_SPFI.html GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 25, 2007 Author Share Posted May 25, 2007 ok disregard all previous posts i went back to the beginning and FOLLOWED THE INSTRUCTIONS like i should have in the first place. all is connected very carefully. But, I now have no spark at the coil wire. I have replaced coil with one that i know works, i have 12v at coil terminals, i have 12v at the ig. amplifier. I have double checked the wiring instructions in the swap manual, and it seems right. where to now? ok thanks for reading.. checked : coil bracket grounding - shined with sandpaper . still no coil spark. Ig. amp tests 23.8 with ohm meter set to 20k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 25, 2007 Author Share Posted May 25, 2007 went thru ecm plugs pin by pin. things of note: pin 9 - no air flow meter ground pin 28 self shutoff signal shows 11.2v (all other readings were 12 .2 approx) pin 38 ignition switch has 12v pin 47 fuel pump has 12v all grounds (except af meter) check out all power input pins have 12v - also - with key at run, fuel pump wire blue/w gets no power. 2 black/w wires have 12v. relay does not click when i plug/unplug it with key on. bad relay? or no signal from ecm? pin 47 fuel pump in ecm connector shows 12v, so ecm must provide ground? IG relay clicks when i unplug/plug it . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 25, 2007 Author Share Posted May 25, 2007 :banghead: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted May 25, 2007 Share Posted May 25, 2007 The ECU does supply the Maf ground. Possibly an issue with the ECU. but let's address the spark. I think you have a Distributor issue. The Crank angle sensor inside it in particular. If it is not hooked up right or working you'll get no spark. And because this is the SPFI system the Fuel injector will not spray and the pump get's no power until the ECU senses revolution. If there is no signal from the CAS the pump will not pump. This explains why you don't have juice to the fuel pump wire. Check it for power while cranking. (old carbed models had a Revolution sensor signaled by the tach wire for the same thing) How sure are you your distributor is hooked up right. You are using the EA82 disty right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 25, 2007 Author Share Posted May 25, 2007 well i will definitely recheck my disty wires. i had to wire in a 4 pin trailer plug because the plug was missing on the donor. this is the disty from a 93 loyale spfi, the harness and manifold and pump came from a 91. i'will also go and check my pump wire for 12v while cranking right now. thank you so much for the reply.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 25, 2007 Author Share Posted May 25, 2007 ok wire to wire the plug is connected properly. there are metal wires under the disty side sheathing that i took for some type of shielding. this stuff is not connected. there was no 12v to the blue/white fuel pump wire while i was cranking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted May 26, 2007 Share Posted May 26, 2007 ok wire to wire the plug is connected properly. there are metal wires under the disty side sheathing that i took for some type of shielding. this stuff is not connected. there was no 12v to the blue/white fuel pump wire while i was cranking Pointing back to the CAS in disty still perhaps. But first, the sheilding on the disty wires should have continuity to ground. From factory that ground was supplied through a combined plug then to pin 35 of ECU. The black wire in the disty wires should also have continuity to ground through pin 35 of ECU. So the Shield and Black wire should have continuity to each other. Check the Black/white wire on the Disty harness for voltage of at least 4V Check the Green/black wire for at least 10v Check the Green/Yellow wire for voltage at least 4v If that all checks out try this. Disconnect the 2 pole plug on the transistor/ignitor. Hook up a lead so you can test the voltage of Black/white wire with the disty connected and hands free. Test for a pulse of 0 then 5v while turning the crank by hand slowly(22mm socket) Then after removing your wrench from the crank pulley crank it with the starter and watch for voltage. If either way you have no pulse, replace distributor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted May 26, 2007 Share Posted May 26, 2007 went thru ecm plugs pin by pin. things of note: pin 9 - no air flow meter ground pin 28 self shutoff signal shows 11.2v (all other readings were 12 .2 approx) pin 38 ignition switch has 12v pin 47 fuel pump has 12v all grounds (except af meter) check out all power input pins have 12v - also - with key at run, fuel pump wire blue/w gets no power. 2 black/w wires have 12v. relay does not click when i plug/unplug it with key on. bad relay? or no signal from ecm? pin 47 fuel pump in ecm connector shows 12v, so ecm must provide ground? IG relay clicks when i unplug/plug it . Pin 47 grounds the fuel pump relay! it should not have 12v. If you supplied that pin with 12v you may have damaged the ECU. Hopefully not. Power for and through the fuel pump relay should come from fuse 11 through the Black/white wires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 26, 2007 Author Share Posted May 26, 2007 ok i'll go and do this right now. i'll report back in 30 mins. what i did do so far was go and spin the disty by hand with everything connected and a plug hooked up to the coil wire. this gave no spark, but maybe my shielding not being grounded screwed up that test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted May 26, 2007 Share Posted May 26, 2007 ok i'll go and do this right now. i'll report back in 30 mins. what i did do so far was go and spin the disty by hand with everything connected and a plug hooked up to the coil wire. this gave no spark, but maybe my shielding not being grounded screwed up that test. Check pin 47 first Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 26, 2007 Author Share Posted May 26, 2007 hmm pin 47 no no.. i'll double check that as well.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 26, 2007 Author Share Posted May 26, 2007 check for what? I can confirm that i had 12v to pin 47 this morning. that is a fact.. unfortunately.. i will look to see why though.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 26, 2007 Author Share Posted May 26, 2007 ok black and white wires to fuel pump relay are confirmed to have power from a fused tap on the ignition pos wire. a blue/black wire runs from relay to pin 47 on ecm . this wire has 12v with ig. on. not good? could a bad relay do that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted May 26, 2007 Share Posted May 26, 2007 ok black and white wires to fuel pump relay are confirmed to have power from a fused tap on the ignition pos wire. a blue/black wire runs from relay to pin 47 on ecm . this wire has 12v with ig. on. not good? could a bad relay do that? Yeah it could. test the relay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matts87glsedan Posted May 26, 2007 Author Share Posted May 26, 2007 relay plug pic [] [1][2] [3][4] this is looking into the relay plug 1and 2 are black/w and have 12v when relay is unplugged, 3 and 4 have 0v. when i plug in relay and backprobe, 3 now has 12v (blue/black to pin 47). relay does not click when i unplug/plug it with key on. replaced relay with a different one from donor harness, and got the same result. is this enough info? the [] on top represents the little catch on the plug. I also did your disty tests. I have black,green,red,and white wires. black - ground green - 1v red - .5v white - 1v Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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