Awddrift4 Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 I'm pretty new here, and to modifying cars. i own a 1993 Subaru Loyale 5speed. i need some help making it a better than it is lol. i have a little budget at the moment, but i'm gonna be owning this car for a long time. If you guys have any suggestions for parts to add performance, please say. and by the way, is there anyway to mount a bodykit from another Subaru onto it? Modify it in any way? and is there anywhere online where i can get the necessary XT6 parts to mount 5 lug wheels? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awddrift4 Posted June 13, 2008 Author Share Posted June 13, 2008 Thanks in advance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pooparu Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 You can do an ej22 swap. or Head job and cams from delta cams. or K&N air filter and bigger free flow exhaust. or Rear turbo disk brakes. or if it's carbed you can put a weber carburetor on it. I don't think you're going to see any huge power gains unless you do a motor swap of some kind (at least not that I know of). The EA82 wasn't much of a power house, but it was a nice reliable motor. Good luck and welcome to the board. If you poke around a little and use the search engine you might stumble upon something else related to your topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 this is not carb'ed, it's FI. this may sound negative but i'm not telling you what to do - just some information. the EA82 is slow as balls, i wouldn't bother doing any performance mod's to it. the more you do and the less you get out of it, the more frustrating it will be. you'll never be satisfied if your goal is to make it fast. even the 6 cylinder XT6 which actually has some grunt is a waste of time for performance upgrades. now if you just want it to "look" or "seem" fast, then by all means tear it up. just make it whatever you want, loud exhaust, wing, whatever you like. the only kit that "might" fit is an RX body kit. they aren't easy to find. you have a great, reliable vehicle that is good for some excellent gas mileage. it is best to enjoy a vehicle for it's attributes rather than make it something it is not (apply this logic to lots of areas of life...like women and dating too). i have XT6 bits 5 lug bits but they won't sell cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 as mentioned before, your car is a long way from being much....but not without potential. a little work on the stock motor (as mentioned, head job and delta cams) would give it a bit more grunt, and some rear disc brakes would make it hella fun to drive. But to make it anything other than a slow car that's extremely fun to take to the limit on a regular basis, you'll be in for some major investment. and not just money, hundreds and hundreds of hours. Here's my '92 Loyale, essentially as it sits now (different suspension = taller stance.....but you get the idea): (click the pic for write-up, more pictures, and a video) able to hang with a stock '05 Mustang GT in a straight line 0-70. turn circles around that 'stang in the twisties. put down competitive ice racing times. haul 8' lumber. And get close to 30mpg doing it. But I've been researching, modifying, tinkering, and upgrading old subarus for the better part of 5 years (and I'm a rank amateur by comparison to many members here). And doing it any other way would be a waste of time and money (which is why you don't see a list of what you "should" do here....). As for an online source.....this is it. find fellow USMB members with the parts, and who are willing to part with them (I'm still debating....). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Abides Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 Welcome to the board. Nunb is right, this is the best source to find what your asking about. One of the problems you are going to find is. A. Atleast in the midwest cars like ours arent very abundent or if you find them there rustbuckets B. Most things you can find for simple upgrades are even harder to find. Xt6 stuff is expensive and nay impossible to find in the midwest, and to ship them from our fellow bretheran in the pacific northwest is expensive. C. Some people might say that the car you have isnt the best. Not that it doesnt look good or probally run good but that it isnt 4wd. From what ive read alot of modification needs to be done if you were going to convert one from 2wd to 4wd. Well why would you want 4wd you ask. Because the impreza stuff with alittle finess go into these vehicles. Im under the impression though that its harder if your starting off with a 2wd vehicle. First thing i would do if i were you is get it running tip top. HOw many miles are on your car. Then go from there. Wheels will be hard to find but there out there. Look up pugs. Any other help needed just ask. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingbobdole Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 C. Some people might say that the car you have isnt the best. Not that it doesnt look good or probally run good but that it isnt 4wd. From what ive read alot of modification needs to be done if you were going to convert one from 2wd to 4wd. Well why would you want 4wd you ask. Because the impreza stuff with alittle finess go into these vehicles. Im under the impression though that its harder if your starting off with a 2wd vehicle. That's just not true. Firstly swapping in the 4wd isn't that hard, and secondly, they sold 2wd legacies... get a 2wd leg tranny, like-a this: Other then that, One thing you need to decide is how fast do you want to go? If you just want it peppy... tune it up. Change the plugs and wires, and make it run the best it can. Then you might try and advance the ignition timing a touch to grab a bit more power out of it. Not going to get you a lot though. If you want more then that, swap it. EJ or bust, settle for nothing in between. Know this: The ER27, and EA82 Turbo are of no interest. The ER is hard to source parts for, and isn't all that exciting as well as having a hard install. Don't get me started on the turbo:rolleyes: The basic EJ22 will jump you up about 40 HP and is super reliable and pretty cheap. Wiring can be a problem for some (it's only 3 pages or so, but still) and you'll need a tranny, possibly axles if you get the wrong tranny, you'll need turbo EA axles. Custom parts here and there, not a swap for the unexperienced. The Ej25 is out there as well. people don't like them, so you can pick them up cheap. It's a 75 HP jump from stock, but the wiring is a bit more and they can be problematic if not cared for. I have one in my Rx... makes it move pretty good. As far as wheels go, yeah, you're boned. Find another turbo XT cap.:-p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pooparu Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 You'll need a tranny, possibly axles if you get the wrong tranny, you'll need turbo EA axles. Or you can just buy an adaptor plate and use your transmission and axles. There are several write up on here with people that have done the swap so you'll find a lot of support. Also some of the swap experts have put together a handy dandy swap guide that you can download. As far as the wiring goes it was a real struggle for me, but for some it was really easy so I'll leave that one up for debate. For some reason though I don't think you'll get around to doing anything too hard core with your ride anytime soon. It seems like only a small portion of these kinds of posts only goes as far as that, a post. I think maybe 'cause it is a lot of work and you almost have to have Subaru running through your veins in order to have the patience and knowledge necessary to really modify older Subarus. Subaru for life essay! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awddrift4 Posted June 14, 2008 Author Share Posted June 14, 2008 Thanks guys for the replies About how much could i get a EJ22 for, or what cars come with one? I'm thinking about searching a salvage yard nearby for any signs of a Subaru. and are there any other subarus i can switch the whole setup for 5lug? i saw something about imprezas. and there is around 247667 miles on the car, but most of that is towing. the previous owner towed the car alot, so i has about half that on the engine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stumpy Posted June 15, 2008 Share Posted June 15, 2008 About how much could i get a EJ22 for, or what cars come with one? and are there any other subarus i can switch the whole setup for 5lug? i saw something about imprezas. Legacy 90-96 models have non-interference 2.2's. I believe 96 was the transition year to interference motors. I payed $375 for mine but I bought the whole car as there are other parts needed besides the motor. IE: ECU & associated wiring harness, MAF & duct work, ignitor. Probably forgot something in that list but gives you an idea to the advantage of buying a running donor instead of peacing it together. From my reading the Impreza will work for the front only. XT6 for the rear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 15, 2008 Share Posted June 15, 2008 ignoring 1999 and newer models: legacy has EJ22 up to 1995. some after that still have it too. impreza's have EJ18 or EJ22 up to 1998 (except RS and WRX impreza's). the rear is an XT6 only swap for 5 lug. if you want something else you'll need to do some research and/or just try it. there is no definitive way or information for doing a 5 lug without using XT6 stuff. keep in mind.....early impreza's and legacy's are super cheap vehicles. i think i'd rather put the money into one that's already converted or needs some work. they can be had for $0-$500 and will probably have half the mileage that yours has on it. considering you want EJ engines and 5 lug...that's really the easiest and cheapest way to go to get what you want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awddrift4 Posted June 15, 2008 Author Share Posted June 15, 2008 Today I'm going to check out the local junkyard for any signs of a Subaru to see if i could find any of the parts. i know where an XT6 is, but i don't think they're gonna give it up unless i give them a whole new car. i want to keep the loyale cause i already got some memories with it, but if it comes down to costing me way too much, I'm going to find another Subaru, preferably an Impreza or a Legacy. :edit: Todays sunday, and everythings closed, so Junkyard tomorrow. and does anyone have or had a problem with the accelerater on their car? at about half down my car slows its accelerating and the engine gets louder and sounds like its struggling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awddrift4 Posted June 16, 2008 Author Share Posted June 16, 2008 I found 3 EJ22s today at a local parts shop next to the junkyard. and they're selling them at ~$425.00. engine only. I'm planning on getting one next month when i have the money they come without the tranny but i hear that you can use a ea82 tranny with a modified plate and flywheel or something like that which is ~$80. so if anyone knows where i can get a step by step for when the time comes to swap engines, please guide me. and if there is anything i should look out for, warn me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted June 16, 2008 Share Posted June 16, 2008 I found 3 EJ22s today at a local parts shop next to the junkyard. and they're selling them at ~$425.00. engine only. I'm planning on getting one next month when i have the money they come without the tranny but i hear that you can use a ea82 tranny with a modified plate and flywheel or something like that which is ~$80. so if anyone knows where i can get a step by step for when the time comes to swap engines, please guide me. and if there is anything i should look out for, warn me look around. that's a pretty crappy price, even if it were to include everything you needed (which it doesn't). also, look around the forum. stickied at the top of this section, as well as in the repair manual (USRM link at the top of the page), and on my website @ http://www.numbchuxconversions.com there's a very large write-up with everything you need to consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 16, 2008 Share Posted June 16, 2008 agreed, that's a high price around here anyway. $150 for the last EJ engine i bought. 100,000 miles with warranty, it runs great. for the kind of money it sounds like you're going to put into this you'd be better off finding a complete car. you got room to keep a complete vehicle? it's not hard to find a rusted out, wrecked, or needing work car that runs and drives fine for cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awddrift4 Posted June 16, 2008 Author Share Posted June 16, 2008 i'll get around $200 and offer, try to lower, because theres 3 engines there. there isn't a lot of subarus around her to get a better one, and i want to mess around with this one to make it my own, something all those other guys don't have. but if everything starts getting out of hand for me, i'll trade in for another ride. i've got another place i can call and see if they have any engines laying around, and its a import place, so i might get some luck i'll keep looking, but if it comes to $400, i might just take the advice and get a new car. i really don't want to give up the loyale yet, but if i find a running legacy or impreza for cheap with a 5 or 6 speed, i'll consider it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awddrift4 Posted June 16, 2008 Author Share Posted June 16, 2008 i called 5th gear to see if they had any motors, and they said they could sell me a ej25t for $3000. would that even fit? [just wondering] but didn't know anything about ej22's, and they suggested http://www.venus-auto.com/ which i found ej20t's and ej22t's but no price and its in California. I called the place with the 3 ej22's and he said try tomorrow, and i can talk out a deal. so there might be luck on the engine there. i'll continously update you guys on what i find, prices, ect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 not a whole car to replace your loyale. but a whole car to donate the motor. please read the write-up. it took me 6 months to compile it, and I'm putting more time into it now to keep it up-to-date. it will answer most of your questions. you need a lot more parts than just the motor. and if you get a complete car you'll know you have everything you need, and you'll be able to hear the engine run before you mess with it. AND, first gen ('90-'94) Legacies in perfect shape for donating a motor typically sell for only a few hundred dollars anyway (look for ones with damage, rust, blown transmission, etc.). And those motors are good for many many hundreds of thousands of miles (mine's got almost 270k on it now, with only very basic maintenence on it). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awddrift4 Posted June 17, 2008 Author Share Posted June 17, 2008 Parts are hard to find here, and i've been calling all over to see if i can find anything, alot of my searching is not so good, but tomorrow, i'm calling the place i saw the motors at, and seeing how much one of the legacys there would cost, and if i could look at the engines to inspect. the legacys there tho, have the motors and trannys removed, so i'd have to by things separate =[ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 read numbchux post - find an entire car for the swap. if you think finding the motor you want is hard....that's like twiddling thumbs compared to sourcing all the parts you need for a complete motor swap. it gets tedious and costly very quick if you piece this together. you do realize this engine will not go in your car easily? the entire wiring harness, computer and sensors are all different and need to be swapped? you will need all of that. and that's not including new parts....you going to leave old timing belts, water pumps, gaskets...that have been sitting for awhile...were they sitting outside, how many miles? if this is done for $400 reliability may suffer. not trying to discourage you but trying to help you avoid getting stuck or ending up with something unreliable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stumpy Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 I believe I have every thing else he needs for an ej swap from a donar car if he just buys an engine. He would still need the ej>ea adapter plate and mod his fly wheel. I also have the rear assembly for a 2wd>4wd conversion. Not complete these days as I sold the hub/drum off one side. Shipping would be costly though. If your serious about this swap, read Numbchux's write-up and compile a list of what you will need. Double check it with him and make me an offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awddrift4 Posted June 17, 2008 Author Share Posted June 17, 2008 i've been thinking about the swap all day today, and i think i'm going to find a donor car and use it before i do anything, so the swap is on hold for a while [make sure nothing is wrong with what i'm swapping] . i'm going to go for a legacy cause i think i can find one for cheap now =] the loyale is just going to be a slow a to b car right now, until i find that legacy. even tho i'm holding the swap off for a while, i'm still going to read the write up that numbchux spent so much time making =] If there is anything i should really pay attention to in the swap car or any information on legacies in general, please tell =] Thanks for all the info given so far Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s'ko Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 i called 5th gear to see if they had any motors, and they said they could sell me a ej25t for $3000. would that even fit? [just wondering] but didn't know anything about ej22's, and they suggested http://www.venus-auto.com/ which i found ej20t's and ej22t's but no price and its in California. I called the place with the 3 ej22's and he said try tomorrow, and i can talk out a deal. so there might be luck on the engine there. i'll continously update you guys on what i find, prices, ect. Just spoke to the owner. Said that he is expecting a shipment on July 18th. He doesn't have any soobie in stock, but he sells the front clip for around $1,800. That's CRAZY CHEAP.... "site bookmarked" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stumpy Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 The one I picked up had a bad trans (reverse & 2nd only) so using it as a driver wasn't an option. Around here $600-1,200 for one driveable is quite common. Good luck with your search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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