Joseph Davis Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Sorry to have fallen off the face of the planet, thought it was time for an update. Dave kept having trouble with high mileage used junk engines, he got sick of everything and used parts from the four engines laying around to build one fresh engine, then sold the car. It belongs to a friend, so it's still "in the family," and it is running well. Fresh glaze break hone, new rings, new bearings and seals. Block decked just the tiniest bit and everything measured to perfection by paul at Sronce Carquest in downtown Asheville. Dave ported the head/manifold, polished combustion chambers and piston faces. head was milled minimally to ensure it was true. Worked out well, at 7 psi the Justy feels noticeably stronger than before. While some of that is due to the P&P I think our compression numbers may be better than with the other engines, too. After breaking in the engine a few months back, the Turbo Justy's new owner TJ, Dave, and our friend Chris went out for a nice Sunday cruise. A nice young riceboy in a brand new Sentra Spec-V heard the BOV and flagged TJ down... wanted to race... nobody was around so TJ agreed. Loaded down with three guys, the Turbo Justy pulled the Spec-V a car length 0-60, then did the exact same on the rematch. With just TJ driving, I've seen it hang dead even with a stock Turbo II RX7; with how old those cars are that may not be a good yardstick to measure by, but I am confident the Turbo Justy would turn a high 14 second 1/4 at the strip. Since I'm on the subject, here's a Justy rod next to a Honda D16 rod, as I mentioned earlier. Four of the Honda D16 rods support 200 whp reliably, more if you aren't worried too much about longevity. An Acura Integra LS rod is about halfway between the D16 and the Justy rod in size and are good for 260-300 whp depending on your nerve. Suffice it to say that, clutch problems aside, the EJ12 in the Justy is a stout little bad boy: Anyway, Dave's kind of sad about parting ways with the Justy, but it was all for the best - the first week of July sees Dave, our friend Jeff, and myself opening Swagger Motorsports in Hendersonville, NC, 20 minutes outside Asheville. We have a fairly large shop, around 6000 sq ft, just finishing up painting/building office space + waiting room/organizing now. We're planning on having a grand opening cookout sometime in the month of July, and anyone who wants to come is more than welcome. I'll post up details when we have the date finalized. BTW, since Dave's already turbocharged a Justy, he's decided to pursue his other dream: taking the low mileage XT6 crate engine he has laying around, a $200 XT6 donor with engine problems, and an old hatch and making a 2.7 liter AWD hatchie, complete with XT6 brakes and slick paint scheme. If anybody knows of a clean hatch - it doesn't have to run or have good paint, just mostly rust free - please let me know. It's the one thing we still lack! BTW, here's some (sadly non-Subaru) examples of our latest fab and paint work: Dave's current ride, and his girlfriend Rachel's Individual Throttle Bodies and freshly painted Civic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myxalplyx Posted June 28, 2004 Author Share Posted June 28, 2004 After breaking in the engine a few months back, the Turbo Justy's new owner TJ, Dave, and our friend Chris went out for a nice Sunday cruise. Thanks for all of the info Joseph. Really informative! Now I'm going to cry. You sold the car to a TJ? That was months ago right? What does he think now? Is he willing to sell the car to me? PM me if you can. I've always wanted a turbocharged Justy. I got to have one. Gotta, gotta, gotta. And a turbocharged XT6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 What would be the advantage of the ecvt trannys? Why not put a 5spd in there instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 A chain could DEFINATELY not be substituted for a belt in the ECVT "slippage" is one of the operating principals of the tranny. Some newer hondas/toyotas and such have them, but I don't like the ECVT platform because it puts a LOT of stress on one little belt, and expects it to last. Fabricating something better would be EXTREMELY expensive because it would have to match the EXACT dimensions of the old belt, which is steel to begin with. Not only that but the new belt would have to have a rubber-band like characteristic to it to accomidate the changing pully sizes (that is one characteristic that is exclusive to ECVT belts.) You really are best off with the 5-speed, besides manuals generally take abuse better than automatics, just get a good clutch and try to find someone who could re-gear it if necessary (that would be REALLY expensive too). Realize with that light a car, if you strip it a bit, that getting off the base line with a turbo won't be a prob. You will have ample power to move the car. Great job guys - now for the ultimate go-kart, he, he, he, ... If the engine was mounted in the rear of a go-kart, could the diff in the tranny be swapped with a lsd? Just thinking ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myxalplyx Posted January 25, 2005 Author Share Posted January 25, 2005 I know this is an old thread and all but I 'think' I noticed something about this engine but I must ask. Is the Justy's engine closed deck from the factory? This looks to be a closed deck design but perhaps I've read what a closed deck design is the wrong way. :-\ I don't see any coolant passages directly around the outside of the pistons. I thought this would make for an open deck engine in which most N/A cars are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Do It Sidewayz Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 yep.....that's a closed deck..or as close as your gonna come to one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Davis Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 I don't like the ECVT platform because it puts a LOT of stress on one little belt It's the pulleys that normally crack on them, IME. I figure the things die a couple of other ways, I don't have huge experience with them, but if the car makes it five minutes down the road before it warms up + the transmission *locks* down, that's the problem. So, yeah. Justy's down again to have one piston replaced due to cracked ringlands. The black box is basically an AFC hack, it advances ignition timing in the WOT NA and low boost range, and needs to be tossed. Dave/TJ are cheapasses and won't spend the money for something better. I've offered free tuning/wiring of one of the megasquirt variants that control ignition timing, cost should be around $300, but they have zero interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Do It Sidewayz Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 that's why i'm running the greddy emanage on my car... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Davis Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 that's why i'm running the greddy emanage on my car... e-manage also has undesirable effects on ignition timing because it also manipulates MAP signal. If you are using it to control ignition timing as well, the e-manage hack manages to mostly overcome it's problems, and in that hands of a knowledgable user would work well. The OEM mappings in the Justy ECU are wierd, IMO. Car has been rock solid + dependable at 5 psi, but when the boost is upped to the MAP sensor's limit ~7 psi a ring land goes within a hundred miles. Referring to "AFC hack theory," ignition timing should be drastically advanced at NA to boost transition, and in the lower boost numbers, making the lower psi boost event more dangerous. Standalones for life, yo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 What would be the advantage of the ecvt trannys? Why not put a 5spd in there instead? The ECVT or non-electronically controlled versions are very good for some applications. In my opinion, cars are not one of them. This is the type of transmission used exclusively on snowmobiles and now on lots of four-wheelers. It's very light, has almost unlimited tunability for shifting characteristics, and outperforms automotive-style automatics because there is no real power loss through the transmission. The biggest issue with CVT's is that under extreme conditions, they eat belts. I usually get one season out of a belt on my snowmachine. Guys with more powerful sleds burn them up every other weekend. The new ECVT trannies are pretty good from what I hear. Performance and economy are similar to a manaul trannied car, without having to shift. However, there are still some issues inherent to their design that can never be overcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
85Sub4WD Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 I guess under snowy conditions there is enough slippage to prevent them from eating belts as fast as otherwise, and Snowman is right, they do have their uses. The main problem in a car is that they have to deal with much more jarring than they would on other surfaces, hence why they break easier. ECVT's are good for efficentcy, but not power or reliability. Manual gears are best for that 99% of the time (though with a very good oil cooler normal automatics are pretty rugged). I do not doubt that they will be beneficial in the future, but I would like to see their reliability improve first. Does anyone know if the Justy was the first ECVT in the US? I think it may be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Do It Sidewayz Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 e-manage also has undesirable effects on ignition timing because it also manipulates MAP signal. If you are using it to control ignition timing as well, the e-manage hack manages to mostly overcome it's problems, and in that hands of a knowledgable user would work well. The OEM mappings in the Justy ECU are wierd, IMO. Car has been rock solid + dependable at 5 psi, but when the boost is upped to the MAP sensor's limit ~7 psi a ring land goes within a hundred miles. Referring to "AFC hack theory," ignition timing should be drastically advanced at NA to boost transition, and in the lower boost numbers, making the lower psi boost event more dangerous. Standalones for life, yo I'm not using the emange to hack the Map Signal...my Map sensor changes are 0's across the board. i am using it to control timing, and additional injector duty cycle, which uses the Greddy Map sensor i got with the system. seems to work fairly well..... I run 7 PSI or more....usually 8 and it hasn't blown yet "knock on wood". But i have the emanage injecting a HUGE amount of fuel after 7 PSI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myxalplyx Posted January 25, 2005 Author Share Posted January 25, 2005 Does anyone know if the Justy was the first ECVT in the US? I think it may be. I believe so. http://www.subaru-global.com/about/history/1984-001.html "The Subaru Justy was launched in February 1984. In 1987, the Justy was fitted with an advanced automatic transmission system: the world's first electro-continuously variable transmission called the Subaru ECVT." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Davis Posted March 10, 2005 Share Posted March 10, 2005 $550 takes it. Includes: - IHI turbo, fresh rebuild - tubular manifold - downpipe - oil lines - Ford 350cc injectors - charge piping - DSM SMIC intercooler - Greddy Type-S blow off valve - "black box" that rescales the injectors, which I recommend you throw away and buy a Megasquirt (~$250) Pretty much everything as shown in the pictures posted at the beginning of this thread from last year are included. Only things you don't get is the plenum riser block, and you have to modify your own oilpan for the oil return. Contact Dave at (828) 693-3050, after noon on weekdays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myxalplyx Posted March 14, 2005 Author Share Posted March 14, 2005 Only things you don't get is the plenum riser block, and you have to modify your own oilpan for the oil return. Contact Dave at (828) 693-3050, after noon on weekdays. Dave, How does one go about getting these things? I do not know what a 'plenum riser block' is. Also, can you send a modified oil pan so the whole installation can be a breeze? Is there ANYTHING else a Justy owner may have to be aware of before installing this kit? Like it only fits a manual tranny or automatic, it will not work unless you do this and/or that, etc. Is there anyone on this board selling a Justy at the moment (this isn't directed at you Dave)? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Do It Sidewayz Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 if it's a 5 spd....you need a custom clutch made. I finally ended up at a clutch with double diaphram springs on the pressure plate. I really don't think you need the plenum riser..i don't have one and it's fine. the oil pan is fairly easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Davis Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Dave, I am not Dave. Dave is not an internet personality. Contact him via the information above. How does one go about getting these things? I do not know what a 'plenum riser block' is. Also, can you send a modified oil pan so the whole installation can be a breeze? The plenum riser block is shown in the pictures. It's not coming with the kit because it's a PITA to remove. You can make your own, or modify the charge pipe going into the throttlebody to clear easily. I don't know if David has any spare oil pans, you'd have to ask him. Is there ANYTHING else a Justy owner may have to be aware of before installing this kit? Installation is fairly straightforward. I do recommend you netsearch Megasquirt, though. FYI, the turbo Justy was running a stock clutch. It's been turbo for (?) 2000+ miles, probably borderline situation with short life expectancy, but you can get by with a stock clutch in good consition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Do It Sidewayz Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 not a chance with the stock clutch....here's my clutch saga. Complete the turbo project....run about 4 blocks...find out that anything over 3 PSI of boost slips the clutch. Alright fine...it was a half worn out stock clutch....i figure a brand new disc and pressure plate will be enough. Get it all in, and broken in.....On the highway..be cruising in 5th gear.. 2-3 PSI and rpms increase....speed does not...Well time for something custom. Get a custom kevlar disc, with upgraded pressure plate, and lightened flywheel....was upgraded 30% on the pressure plate springs.....something happened to the springs, and they weakened really quickly.....slipped like a bastard. Took it back...it's not double springed, and the thing grips to no end. A FRESH stock clutch...will hold no more than 4-5 PSI of boost without slipping...This is from my experience.... And the plenum riser...it's not a big deal...i'm running 1.75 intake piping, and it sits on the top of the engine, and doesn't hit the hood at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Davis Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 not a chance with the stock clutch.... The flip side of the coin says a stock clutch at 7 psi, while loaded down with three 150-200 lb guys, pulls handily away from new SE-R's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoahDL88 Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Now the question is. How much hp does it make and is it even fast? With even 100 hp it would be a rocket, i'm sure its fast, its all about power to weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeEyedBandit Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Mine had over 2000 miles on a used clutch and only had a problem when I would shift gears real hard, or while changing gears with the tires spinnin'. I was runing 2" PVC for the intake charge and it would rub on the hood every now and then. Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bgale04 Posted April 8, 2005 Share Posted April 8, 2005 $550 takes it. Includes: - IHI turbo, fresh rebuild - tubular manifold - downpipe - oil lines - Ford 350cc injectors - charge piping - DSM SMIC intercooler - Greddy Type-S blow off valve - "black box" that rescales the injectors, which I recommend you throw away and buy a Megasquirt (~$250) do you still have this for sale... im sure its probally gone but would someone be willing to semi product this?? I was looking on ebay and some some garrett gt-15 turbos for an r1 steet bike but of course you would need the manifold piping and all the goods in your set.... i have a 93 gl justy that would be my test dummy and a 89 gl that would most likely reep all the benefits. Let me know of anything that i can do or just need to do or whatever. Im really interested in this have been researching it all day today thanks alot brannon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myxalplyx Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 With even 100 hp it would be a rocket, i'm sure its fast, its all about power to weight. This is precisely the reason why I wanted the kit. I know it's home grown and such but if I were to get it, I wanted to get everything could to make a full installation of parts (by a shop). Time seems to be getting shorter and shorter on my end and since I'm going to be going back to school next month, car time will be next to nothing. I was hoping badly to be able to purchase this from someone directly with it already installed and running and go from there. I don't even own a Justy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Davis Posted April 12, 2005 Share Posted April 12, 2005 do you still have this for sale... Yup, call Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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