Devil240Z Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Ok in the older gen subi section I posted about my 86 GL and the possibilities of converting it from 2wd to 4wd. and I learned that it was too difficult to attempt. so today I got my 91 Legacy sedan 4wd 5 speed. really good condition. and I might have a line on a 2.5rs motor. what are the legistics of that swap? custom mounts, axles, ect. what would i need to get that motor to work in this car? or is it even possible? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Wireing mostly. But for the extra ~25 HP - why bother? The 2.5RS engines from the 90's were not great engines - if you want a fast car with possibilities then get something with a Turbo. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheinen74 Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 any 2.5 engine is a downgrade to your superior ej22. now, heads, etc from the RS are superior heads, but not the block pistons, bearings, etc. The ej22 block was pressure die cast formed. the ej25 block was not, it was sandcast. not the better way.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 The ej22 block was pressure die cast formed.the ej25 block was not, it was sandcast. not the better way.. I beleive it's the other way around. And I don't beleive that the N/A EJ22 was sandcast either. IIRC, the EJ22 and the EJ25 are both die cast. The sand cast blocks are the pre-96 EJ20T's and the EJ22T's. All the NA motors in the EJ line are die-cast as far as I know (open deck). And sand casting is the stronger, better process. It's also twice as expensive due to the problems with removing the sand and the finishing that is required afterwards. The die-cast process requires much less post-cast machine work. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil240Z Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 (edited) ok noted. but i mostly just want an engine that doesnt have 200,000 miles on it. how does that change things? the 2.5rs has like 70k my legacy has like 220k, but it was well maintained(or so I am led to believe.) edit: I believe the guy about sand casting. Its a pain, ive done it before. if only they could find a way to wax cast an engine block... Edited September 1, 2009 by Devil240Z Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheinen74 Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 well most early ej22 are on the road for 350k without much issues the ej25 start showing problems at 100k... I would rather take a ej22 with 220 on it than a ej25 with 90k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Agreed - with all the head gasket/piston slap/rod issues of the EJ25, I would MUCH rather have an EJ22 with 200k (they are good to 300k+ easily) than any of the EJ25's with the exception of the very new models. Most of the early one's had head gasket failure around 100k or shortly after. Some as early as 50k. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil240Z Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 ok cool. this has been very informative! thank you guys for your help. I will stick with the factory motor for a while until I either get a turbo swap or get a new car. so far I have had just about car that is cool: 240SX S13: Good car. RWD is a plus, BUT SR20DET is a fragile motor. RX7 FC Turbo II: Cool car. Real coupe no back seat nonsense. Rotary motors are fickle and fragile. also not good for a 6 foot 5 guy. Civic EK Hatch, great car, FWD is a huge minus though, easy and cheap to make alot of power but no where to put that power. but very comfy for a tall guy like me. also other cars ive had: 1988 Audi 90 Quattro, my first AWD car! (still have)1986 Subaru GL Sedan 2WD, Workhorse that car takes abuse and loves it! 1978 Datsun 280Z, BEAUTIFUL car, but the one I had had gremlins. 1975 Celica GT, pretty car but gutless. Anyway I hope to become a respectable Subaru owner now. Ive always liked Subis but never had one til now mostly cause they are expensive compared to other cars like S13s and such. Also Ive been told that the Legacy I got is pretty hard to find a 5 Speed version. I really want a '92 Legacy Turbo! hey is that a good swap? same car so just need turbo ECU right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 I really want a '92 Legacy Turbo! hey is that a good swap? same car so just need turbo ECU right? Not exactly. The gen 1 legacy turbo's, while looking similar on the outside to their NA siblings, are almost completely different cars. The engine is an entirely different beast, they use a pusher-style clutch and different transmission, the engine cross-member is different to allow for the up-pipe to the turbo.... even the whole front core support is different to accomidate the turbo's radiator. The swap can and has been done, but it's almost always done using a wrecked donor. I have a 91 Legacy turbo (the best year - oil cooler, rear VLSD, etc), and I love it. It's real easy to make 250 HP with them just by adding an IC, bigger turbo, and opening up the exhaust a bit. And your's isn't particularly rare - lots of L models came with 5 speed's. I had a 94 GT wagon not long ago with a 5 speed as well. I can find them on craigslist weekly. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil240Z Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 (edited) ok cool. I almost bought a legacy turbo but it didnt quite work out. Id much rather have a Galant VR4 anyway. but this is a subi forum so... anyway so from what I understand my best option is to do nothing? sounds good to me. maybe Ill make an exhaust and get an intake. let the car breathe a little better. EDIT Maybe pick up a set of these. Edited September 1, 2009 by Devil240Z add a link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Id much rather have a Galant VR4 anyway. Man - you a sucker for crap car's or something? Older Mitsubishi's are the worst damn cars. DSM's were almost unbelievably bad... ever wonder why you don't see old mitsu's? When was the last time you saw a might max? Bad juju friend. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil240Z Posted September 2, 2009 Author Share Posted September 2, 2009 Uh Oh. Do I sense some Subaru/Mitsubishi rivalry going on? DSMs are way more popular tuner cars than Subarus. Anyway I like STis more than Evos so don't crucify me. I honestly am a sucker for anything AWD Turbo.(and I hope you aint sayin nothin bad about any of my past rides!) A Mazda 323 GTX is one of my dream cars. So im thinking about having a friend of mine fab up a catback for me. Anything I should know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twitch de la Brat Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Uh Oh. Do I sense some Subaru/Mitsubishi rivalry going on? DSMs are way more popular tuner cars than Subarus. Anyway I like STis more than Evos so don't crucify me. I honestly am a sucker for anything AWD Turbo.(and I hope you aint sayin nothin bad about any of my past rides!) A Mazda 323 GTX is one of my dream cars. So im thinking about having a friend of mine fab up a catback for me. Anything I should know? You're pushin' your luck around here buddy... DSM is total CuhRAP. and it's not a rivalry for me, but a total despisement and utter loathing. And the 323 GTX is ok, but get an EA81 Turbo for some real fun And for the exhaust, don't go much bigger than 2.5 in. Too much bigger and you'll lose your low end. Twitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil240Z Posted September 2, 2009 Author Share Posted September 2, 2009 Yeah I was thinking 2.5inch. And ive never owned a DSM before so yeah. Tis my lack of knowledge to blame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twitch de la Brat Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Yeah I was thinking 2.5inch. And ive never owned a DSM before so yeah. Tis my lack of knowledge to blame. I haven't either, but I know people who have... (shakes head with pity) And a good cleaning with some seafoam will help pep up your engine and get rid of those nasty gunk deposits. Try running a 1/3 can though the brake booster vacuum line and letting it sit for a few minutes. Then another 1/3 in the oil the same time as the vacuum, and the rest in the gas tank. Don't forget to drain the oil and replace it with new after you put seafoam in it, and its best to do while hot and all the particulates are still suspended in the oil. If your engine is dirty, your oil should come out BLACK. I know mine did... But you should yield more power and better gas mileage after you do it. Twitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 (edited) DSM's are popular because.... well most people are morons. Everyone I've known that has had one or still does just pray's they will get to drive it for a month without it breaking. It's not the design of the car's (besides being transverse which is a design flaw in that the engineer should have had his head examined), but rather the HORRIBLE implementation - for a lot of years of the DSM's it was *normal* to have to replace the ECU every 3 to 5 years. The quality of the componets was that bad. Know how many confirmed dead Subaru ECU's I've seen or heard of..... not a single one. Now how is it that Subaru (and virtually every other Japanese brand of the time) could have an ECU produced by Hitachi or Nippon that would last 30 years and Mitsi couldn't make one that would last 5? Because they flat didn't want to is the answer. And that goes for the rest of those car's as well. They are horrible, horrible cars and anyone that owns one would be doing themselves a favor to trade it in on a Kia or just walk. Yes - even the Korean's can make better cars than Mitsubishi.... GD Edited September 2, 2009 by GeneralDisorder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil240Z Posted September 2, 2009 Author Share Posted September 2, 2009 OK OK Im sorry! Anyway I must not be a moron since I own two Subarus. :banana: Anyway ill definitely do that thing with the seafoam. I'm assuming that seafoam is a product that I can buy and I dont have to go to the beach...:-\ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 They are horrible, horrible cars and anyone that owns one would be doing themselves a favor to trade it in on a Kia or just walk. Yes - even the Korean's can make better cars than Mitsubishi.... OUCH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twitch de la Brat Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 DSM's are popular because.... well most people are morons. Everyone I've known that has had one or still does just pray's they will get to drive it for a month without it breaking. It's not the design of the car's (besides being transverse which is a design flaw in that the engineer should have had his head examined), but rather the HORRIBLE implementation - for a lot of years of the DSM's it was *normal* to have to replace the ECU every 3 to 5 years. The quality of the componets was that bad. Know how many confirmed dead Subaru ECU's I've seen or heard of..... not a single one. Now how is it that Subaru (and virtually every other Japanese brand of the time) could have an ECU produced by Hitachi or Nippon that would last 30 years and Mitsi couldn't make one that would last 5? Because they flat didn't want to is the answer. And that goes for the rest of those car's as well. They are horrible, horrible cars and anyone that owns one would be doing themselves a favor to trade it in on a Kia or just walk. Yes - even the Korean's can make better cars than Mitsubishi.... GD GO GD! GO GD! GO GD! (Man this thing really needs pom poms) I know a guy who has an eclipse. He hasn't gotten more than maybe 50 hrs driving time in the last 3 years. And I may not have too much room to speak here, but he's fixed it, then broke it, fixed it, something else broke, and this cycle has repeated to the point that he's torn down the engine at least 8 times. [end rant] Yes, seafoam is a product you can buy at napa, csk/Oreilly's, Advance, Autozone, etc, etc, etc... Its in a white metal can with red writing on it. Says "SEAFOAM" :-p Twitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 I know a guy who has an eclipse.He hasn't gotten more than maybe 50 hrs driving time in the last 3 years. And I may not have too much room to speak here, but he's fixed it, then broke it, fixed it, something else broke, and this cycle has repeated to the point that he's torn down the engine at least 8 times. [end rant] Co-worker of mine put $5000 (yes, that is no typo - $5000) into a 91 Eclipse. The only thing that hasn't been replaced yet is the body and the paint is still shot on that. I can't even ask him about the car without him turning red and loosing a constant stream of foul lanquage. Even after $5000 (that's parts only - he's a very competant mech.) it spins itself up to 3000 RPM on a cold start which he can't figure out, it has an intermittant belt squeel that eats alternator belts about once a month, and the (third) transmission is losing it's syncro's.... I can only imagine how bad the turbo versions of these cars must be. His is not. I could give other examples of Mitsi/DSM foolishness but I digress. They are, without a doubt, some of the worst examples of automotive engineering in the last quarter century. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil240Z Posted September 6, 2009 Author Share Posted September 6, 2009 Here is a pic of my Legacy! And one of my GL! And heres a photo I took for you mitsu haters! ;P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twitch de la Brat Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 Here is a pic of my Legacy! Sweet lego My fave kind too, first gen, series one. And one of my GL! I likey the color scheme, but no bumper? And heres a photo I took for you mitsu haters! ;P No good, its not on fire and there aren't people running away from it! :-p Nor is a guy beating it with a wrench cuz it won't run. But alas, I do enjoy seeing general mitsubishi destruction. Twitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil240Z Posted September 6, 2009 Author Share Posted September 6, 2009 Sweet lego My fave kind too, first gen, series one. Its super clean, almost no blemishes. the windshield has a crack in it but its not that bad, or at least compared to the GL. I likey the color scheme, but no bumper? Yeah... that's how it was when i got it. seen a hard life I think. I should take a pic of the trunk lid. that's the coolest part! also there's no back bumper either. do wagon back bumpers work? I saw a wagon at the junk yard but wasn't sure it would work. Also the windshield leaks and it rains alot here in Washington. No good, its not on fire and there aren't people running away from it!Nor is a guy beating it with a wrench cuz it won't run. But alas, I do enjoy seeing general mitsubishi destruction. Well glad I could at least help you with the last part. Heres Mirra's STi.... By the way, that is a bad pic but just so you all the tires were flat and one wheel was totally gone... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericem Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 Next you need to pickup one of these and this and a 06 tmic and td04 turbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil240Z Posted September 6, 2009 Author Share Posted September 6, 2009 Next you need to pickup one of these and this and a 06 tmic and td04 turbo Agreed. Need and want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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