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Newbie question RE new Bearings


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10 replies to this topic

#1 SubaruGL

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Posted 02 April 2011 - 09:00 AM

1987 GL Wagon AWD, auto, EA82, hitachi carb

If I find a way to pull my engine and check to see if I spun a bearing, does that mean I will have to go oversized or just replace with the standard size?

I know this is a totally dumb question. But I may have a friend willing to help and this would be my first time pulling an engine.

Thanks a bunch.

(Shopping options are standard, or 0.010" oversized)

#2 el_freddo

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Posted 02 April 2011 - 09:17 AM

1987 GL Wagon AWD, auto, EA82, hitachi carb

If I find a way to pull my engine and check to see if I spun a bearing, does that mean I will have to go oversized or just replace with the standard size?

I know this is a totally dumb question. But I may have a friend willing to help and this would be my first time pulling an engine.

Thanks a bunch.

(Shopping options are standard, or 0.010" oversized)


I'm still not convinced that you've spun a bearing - and I hope for your wallet that you haven't either! Might as well rebuild the engine or do an EJ conversion - they're about the same cost once you lay it out on paper if you do you're own labour on the conversion...

Anyway, the only way to know if you'll need to go oversize is once you've pulled the engine down and checke that the crank is still within specification for the standard bearing - otherwise its a grind and oversized bearings.

Cheers

Bennie

#3 GeneralDisorder

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Posted 02 April 2011 - 11:03 AM

Just get a used engine - rebuilding an EA82 is pointless. They are common as dirt and worth almost nothing. You will be hard-pressed to rebuild one for less than $1,000. The car isn't worth that.

GD

#4 Quidam

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Posted 02 April 2011 - 04:24 PM

1987 GL Wagon AWD, auto, EA82, hitachi carb

If I find a way to pull my engine and check to see if I spun a bearing, does that mean I will have to go oversized or just replace with the standard size?

I know this is a totally dumb question. But I may have a friend willing to help and this would be my first time pulling an engine.

Thanks a bunch.

(Shopping options are standard, or 0.010" oversized)


Hey,

If you spun a bearing, you'd see it in the oil when you drain. Shiney flakes. If you spun a bearing, you would have to go over size. No more than .010 turning the crank.

However, if I remenber it all, you had 5 qts of "coffee with cream" oil drain out after you got it. Severe corrosion on the metal bits, pipes, thermostat housing...

If it is the rod bearings, It's probably from running with coolant in the oil.

The engine has what 75,000 miles on it?

Now what,huh? A Loyale JDM SPFI EA=82 may be an option for you from a local source.

Or look here:http://www.car-part....-bin/search.cgi

Or

#5 SubaruGL

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Posted 03 April 2011 - 04:28 AM

I'm still not convinced that you've spun a bearing - and I hope for your wallet that you haven't either! Might as well rebuild the engine or do an EJ conversion - they're about the same cost once you lay it out on paper if you do you're own labour on the conversion...

Anyway, the only way to know if you'll need to go oversize is once you've pulled the engine down and checke that the crank is still within specification for the standard bearing - otherwise its a grind and oversized bearings.

Cheers

Bennie


Thank you Bennie, and I hope you're right too! I guess I will just reassemble it after I clean it up and replace the hoses, and make sure everything is coolant free, clean, and passages clear... then see what happens!

Just get a used engine - rebuilding an EA82 is pointless. They are common as dirt and worth almost nothing. You will be hard-pressed to rebuild one for less than $1,000. The car isn't worth that.

GD


Thanks GD, after all the reading on here I know a used engine is a smart option, or a conversion. I actually really wanted to do the EJ conversion like Bennie recommended above and I know many have done. Salvage yards like back in the day just don't exist in this area anymore, and older Subaru's must not have been marketed in this area much, I never see them. :/

Hey,

If you spun a bearing, you'd see it in the oil when you drain. Shiney flakes. If you spun a bearing, you would have to go over size. No more than .010 turning the crank.

However, if I remenber it all, you had 5 qts of "coffee with cream" oil drain out after you got it. Severe corrosion on the metal bits, pipes, thermostat housing...

If it is the rod bearings, It's probably from running with coolant in the oil.

The engine has what 75,000 miles on it?

Now what,huh? A Loyale JDM SPFI EA=82 may be an option for you from a local source.

Or look here:http://www.car-part....-bin/search.cgi

Or


Thanks Quidam, well like I said I looked very hard at the drained oil this time and I had to look very hard to see some tiny, almost dust-sized shiny metal. I am not sure if I spun bearing would be more obvious than that or not.

Yes, I had drained out a lot of fluid from the oil pan when I first picked up the car. And the previous owner had admitted she might have put some water into the oil opening my mistake a few times. :S Yes only about 76k... it ran nicely at first...

Someone else mentioned that there was still moisture built up inside from all the sitting. I guess I should have drained/cleaned it more, or did more oil changes. But the oil I drained yesterday did not look abnormal, albeit possibly a bit thinner than normal.

I'll check out that site... I wouldn't mind an SPFI EA82, or preferably, an EJ22 conversion. I've been researching enough here and elsewhere to know that GD's words are true. I never need this to be fast. I am planning it just for fun and a bit of word to haul tools and building materials for projects.

#6 SubaruGL

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 03:04 PM

Barely got anytime in today but I fixed the houses and pulled the timing belts, tensioners, flywheel and water pump pulley.

Then I pulled the oil filter (possible small silver flecks barely seen) and oil pump (the screws did not seem torqued down much at all!). The "mickey mouse" gasket seemed in good shape, a little flattened. The oil that came out was a bit thin and light brown, but nothing like the mess before. Then I noticed the inside of the inner oil pump gear had rubbed some against the housing. It looked pretty fresh but hard to tell as it has been living in oil. On the mating surface of the block, I see a few black marks, I'm assuming maybe from burned oil?

Tomorrow I hope to jack the engine/trans up a bit and pull the pan. I did notice oil residue around the exhaust port outlets. It looks like it would have come out of the ports (the heat shields are quite clean), but that's hard to say I guess. I also want to pull the cam gears and cam seals and see if I can note any excess play in them.

Oil pump out:
Posted Image

Gasket not bad, marring of inside of the pump from inside edge of the inner gear:
Posted Image

Oil not the worst I've seen, maybe some water in it or a tiny bit thin... noted light brown color:
Posted Image

This gear on the front of the corner of the oil pan that the timing belt rides on has a seal in back that is notably out and worn. The gear functions ok, but does anyone know what that gear is called? My timing belt kit never came with a replacement and I would like to get one.
Posted Image

#7 grossgary

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Posted 10 April 2011 - 02:50 AM

ebay has EA82 timing belt kits for really cheap - you get all new pulleys and belts for like $60-$80. well worth it over replacing parts one at a time and leaving other 20+ year old pulleys in there with no grease in them.

i imagine you're resealing the entire oil pump, that mickey mouse gasket is too warn to reuse. i don't see the other EA82 oil pump oring, was it there? EA82's have the mickey mouse gasket, front oil pump shaft seal (under the sprocket and 12mm bolt on the front nose), and an oring. i mean my dial up (no high speed available here) would only load a small portion of the picture so maybe I missed it?

#8 SubaruGL

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Posted 10 April 2011 - 05:29 AM

ebay has EA82 timing belt kits for really cheap - you get all new pulleys and belts for like $60-$80. well worth it over replacing parts one at a time and leaving other 20+ year old pulleys in there with no grease in them.

i imagine you're resealing the entire oil pump, that mickey mouse gasket is too warn to reuse. i don't see the other EA82 oil pump oring, was it there? EA82's have the mickey mouse gasket, front oil pump shaft seal (under the sprocket and 12mm bolt on the front nose), and an oring. i mean my dial up (no high speed available here) would only load a small portion of the picture so maybe I missed it?


Oh sorry I should maybe size the photos down :/ but yes I just put on the timing belt kit 4 miles ago that was recommended to me off ebay and worked well. It just did not have anything to tend to the sprocket gear down in the lower right corner (looking at the friend of the engine).

Yes I'm going to service the oil pump gear, the mickey mouse gasket was in surprisingly good shape, although a little flattened I think I would be able to reuse it. But I order the 3-ring set from beck/arnley. The thing I showed the picture of on the oil pump was the wheel that turns the gear on the inside of the pump had caused some marring on the inside of the oil pump casing. Maybe the new gaskets will fix that.

Here is a reduced version of the picture above showing the marring and old mickey mouse gasket if you want to see:
Posted Image

Figuring I'll give the pump some good cleaning with kerosene and make sure all orifices I can go to are clear, as I will try to do to the best of my ability within the oil pan, pickup, and screen

Thanks for info too grossgary!

Edited by SubaruGL, 10 April 2011 - 06:36 AM.


#9 SubaruGL

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Posted 11 April 2011 - 07:54 AM

Pulled the cam gears and cam seal holders... Happily oil present on both passenger side (where the noise was) and drivers side. Saw some wear on both (photos follow), but assume it's normal since both sides are pretty much even?

Passenger side:
http://i524.photobuc...GL/cdbee7cc.jpg
http://i524.photobuc...GL/5935d0b5.jpg

Drivers side:
http://i524.photobuc...GL/ec44ba37.jpg
http://i524.photobuc...GL/1e036092.jpg

#10 SubaruGL

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Posted 19 April 2011 - 05:43 AM

The engine is coming out. I'm pretty confident it is a crank bearing for cylinder #1. Won't know for certain until it is out and apart, but I was able to manually turn the engine over and fight compression :) Until I got to cylinder 1. There was an area of reduced force.

I also was able to apply pressure to each of the nuts, and only found movement in that one from my video (cylinder 1).
Posted Image

I still can't believe I found no metal like had been suggested I would. But should be interesting when I get it apart. I'm hoping if no damage has been done I might be able to just rebuild the bottom end.

#11 SubaruGL

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Posted 24 August 2011 - 10:03 AM

Well finally decided to make time and split the engine and try to sort things out. Got a chance to rearrange my shop (porch), and got to removing the heads. Damn the coolant passages were a mess. I don't own an impact gun so couldn't get the bellhousing shroud off to try and crack the engine this past weekend.

So far I all I found wrong was 2 of the lifters seemed to be seized. I just labeled the parts, cleaned the block some, and straightened up. Hope to get the engine apart this week and have a friend look at the innards by the weekend. My money is still on one of the crank bearings.

Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image

Its getting cleaner and ready to explore. Not sure if I'm polishing it or just paint... I figure to spend this kind of money it should look pretty too :)

Posted Image Posted Image




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