sean56a Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 (edited) Hi there, I have a 97 Legacy 2.5 that I just did a head gasket job on. This was my first big job on a car so it's likely that I made some rookie mistake somewhere, because the engine will start, run roughly for 3-6 seconds, then sputter and die. If I try to rev the engine it will cause it to die quicker, unless I floor it in which case I can keep it running above 1750 RPMs. I did this for about 45 seconds until I saw white smoke pouring out of the engine. Turns out it was coming from the exhaust system before the cat. Also white smoke coming out of the tailpipe. Is it possible that I have some kind of exhaust blockage??? The fuel gauge is up past F (perhaps because it has been parked on a slight incline for 2 months?) Finally, the oil level on the dipstick seems WAY too high (at least 2 inches past the full mark) even though I put in exactly 4.7 quarts. Here's a full list of changes I made: New HGs Heads resurfaced due to .003" warpage Valve clearances (12 new shims) (everything assembled with lots of engine assembly lube - especially the camshaft bearings) New fuel filter, oil filter New exhaust manifold gaskets New Intake manifold gaskets New Timing belt New spark plugs and wires (gapless Bosch Platinum +2) New thermostat and top hose (done before the job) New driver's camshaft sprockets (chipped during removal) I can't see how it could be a valve/cam lobe clearance issue because I double checked my work with a feeler gauge and they came out perfectly. Could this be an alternator issue? Another concern of mine is that I may have tweaked something towards the back of the engine when I jacked up each side to get to the heads (did the whole job in-car). Before I started the car I spent about 20 minutes cranking the engine intermittently with the spark plug wires detached in order to build up oil pressure. I also filled the fuel filter with gas (using the car's pump, of course) before connecting it to the engine. Thanks so much for the help. Sean Edited November 11, 2009 by sean56a Add'l info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 vacuum leak, check engine light? too much oil - something leaking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 11, 2009 Author Share Posted November 11, 2009 Vacuum leak - I'm not sure. No check engine light yet. I'm mostly concerned about the white smoke leaking out of my exhaust system and tailpipe. The car has been sitting for a while though so it might just need to burn off. But why leaking out of the exhaust manifold when the path of least resistance should be through the tailpipe? Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster2 Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Oil level prolly okay. Checking oil when parked on a slant, give a false reading. Does the engine run long enough to be able to pull codes? Check all your wiring to verify everything is hooked up properly, same goes for all vacuum connections. Doubt that alternator is source of your problem. The white smoke thing is prolly associated with your problem, but I am not knowledgeable enough to know the answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 11, 2009 Author Share Posted November 11, 2009 Oil level prolly okay. Checking oil when parked on a slant, give a false reading. Does the engine run long enough to be able to pull codes? Check all your wiring to verify everything is hooked up properly, same goes for all vacuum connections. Doubt that alternator is source of your problem. The white smoke thing is prolly associated with your problem, but I am not knowledgeable enough to know the answer. I'll do that check again, but at this point it seems to be getting redundant. I don't have a computer so I can't get codes. Maybe I should go pick one up... Thanks for your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 11, 2009 Author Share Posted November 11, 2009 :foot-in-mouth: The hose running from the intake manifold to the air intake duct was never reattached. I checked it so many times!! Just shows that working in the dark is not the way to fix a car. Hehehe. Now that it runs without quitting, I have more problems. Excessive side-to-side engine vibration. More like a rhythmic rocking from left to right, actually. Chugging. Especially pronounced at the tailpipe. Most worrisome: oil mixed with (coolant?!) dripping out of my right valve cover gasket along the bottom. It's a light, creamy brown. Think burnt sienna. Maybe one drop every 20 seconds falls. WTF? I was pretty confident about my work down there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john in KY Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Creamy brown oil always indicates an oil-coolant mixture. Oil floats on water. You could have a couple of qts of water in the oil pan. Remove drain plug and note what flows out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 11, 2009 Author Share Posted November 11, 2009 Creamy brown oil always indicates an oil-coolant mixture. Oil floats on water. You could have a couple of qts of water in the oil pan. Remove drain plug and note what flows out. Going now. We'll see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 11, 2009 Author Share Posted November 11, 2009 ICK. 100% of the oil that came out of the drain plug was light brown and creamy. Could this be left over from the work I did? Or maybe there's some new leak I created? What course of action do you recommend at this point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john in KY Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I doubt it. Somewhere the coolant is mixing with the oil. Could be at a head gasket or an intake gasket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 Intake gasket? Really...? I'll keep it in mind. I waited an hour while the oil drained out, then I refilled it. Immediately I noticed the engine running MUCH better. No more chug, no more heavy vibration of the engine itself. Unfortunately I still have white smoke coming out of the tailpipe. Also a great deal of white smoke is leaking out of the right section of the exhaust manifold and I have white smoke in my oil filler tube. :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek: How on earth would I have managed to ************ up the head gaskets? Honestly I cleaned the living ************ out of the surfaces, had the heads machined and steam cleaned, and when I installed the gaskets I followed the torquing procedure with great care. There was no way to mess up the gaskets, either. Only one way they fit. Very confused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 Are you loosing coolant? nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hondasucks Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 win/lose tight/loose Depending on how bad the head gasket was blown, you will get steam out the exhaust until it all boils out (need to drive it though) After you changed the oil, is the oil still creamy? If so you might have a cracked head or something. You said you had it all machined, did you have the heads checked for cracks? Was it ever severely overheated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 Are you loosing coolant? nipper Not a significant amount. I poured about 3 oz. in when I changed the oil. win/lose tight/loose Depending on how bad the head gasket was blown, you will get steam out the exhaust until it all boils out (need to drive it though) After you changed the oil, is the oil still creamy? If so you might have a cracked head or something. You said you had it all machined, did you have the heads checked for cracks? Was it ever severely overheated? I haven't driven it yet, nor run it long enough to really boil off residual coolant if that is indeed the case. The thing is I never had coolant in my oil until now. The engine was overheated severely once. I was hard driving in the mountains and the car died. Then I noticed that it was running hot. I was about 15 miles from home so I did the home trip in legs without overheating the engine too much. The warpage as detected by the machine shop was .003", which is just outside the spec of .002". I'll check to see if the oil is creamy again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 Quick Q: can coolant in the oil damage the engine? Even a small amount? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 Can we do a wet and dry compression test? I am wondering if a cylinder sleeve shifted. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 Creamy again, but less so this time. When I ran it, I noticed some interesting factors as of yet unreported: tach takes 5 secs to register after starting. engine is idling along at 1250. the left and right turn signals are semi-illuminated. if i engage a turn signal, left or right, the tach drops to zero then ticks with the turn signal tick. finally the idle drops if i turn the headlights on. yikes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 Did you mess with any of the wiring harnesses? Did you pinch one? nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 Did you mess with any of the wiring harnesses? Did you pinch one? nipper I suppose it's possible. I was certainly not aware of destroying any connection... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 win/lose tight/loose Depending on how bad the head gasket was blown, you will get steam out the exhaust until it all boils out (need to drive it though) After you changed the oil, is the oil still creamy? If so you might have a cracked head or something. You said you had it all machined, did you have the heads checked for cracks? Was it ever severely overheated? Hey all, I want to run it in place for a while to see if the coolant boils out. The oil is less creamy on the second change so I want to run it for a half hour, change the oil, run it again, then check the oil for creaminess. How dangerous for my engine would it be to do this? As I said above, it seems as though there is definitely still some coolant in the oil, but I really need to rule out the possibility that I spilled lots of coolant into the oil passages when I removed the heads. What is the longest amount of time I can safely run the engine with coolant in the oil? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik litchy Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 Creamy again, but less so this time. When I ran it, I noticed some interesting factors as of yet unreported: tach takes 5 secs to register after starting. engine is idling along at 1250. the left and right turn signals are semi-illuminated. if i engage a turn signal, left or right, the tach drops to zero then ticks with the turn signal tick. finally the idle drops if i turn the headlights on. yikes sounds like a grounding problem. as far as coolant in the oil, it is very bad for the bearings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 sounds like a grounding problem. as far as coolant in the oil, it is very bad for the bearings. I did have a slight problem with the ground wire that bolts to the intake manifold. I didn't think I messed it up, but I wasn't exactly gentle either. I'll check it out, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 You need to use a crankcase cleaner like Seafoam in the oil to help get the water out. And you may need to change the oil numerous times to get it all. That can get expensive. Your best bet for now is to pressure test the cooling system and make sure the gaskets are not leaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean56a Posted November 13, 2009 Author Share Posted November 13, 2009 (edited) You need to use a crankcase cleaner like Seafoam in the oil to help get the water out. And you may need to change the oil numerous times to get it all. That can get expensive. Your best bet for now is to pressure test the cooling system and make sure the gaskets are not leaking. Thanks. A mechanic friend told me as much re: pressure testing the coolant. Though I wonder if it's worth it. The car has had three different loads of oil in it so far and though the last one looked like it had taken care of it for a ten-minute drive, after it started chugging and spewing white smoke like before. Still have white smoke in the oil filler tube. Also looks like there's a bit of an oil slick on top of my coolant in the radiator. All signs point to ----> ************ up. Edited November 13, 2009 by sean56a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hondasucks Posted November 13, 2009 Share Posted November 13, 2009 I've seen cars with blown head gaskets take 2-3 oil changes to get all the water out of the coolant. Make sure the coolant is full, and keep an eye on the temperature gauge if you run the engine, also I'd run the heater, as if it's using coolant, the heater will stop blowing hot air once the heater core has drained. That will warn you of impending doom quicker than your temp gauge will. I'll pick the Senior Master Tech's brain tomorrow at work and see what he says. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.