All was going well and then I went to put the last timing idler on the belt to button it all up and it stripped the threads... Helicoil kit was available, but it didn't come with a drill bit and no one has one locally... So I now have a stripped hole in the block and a 13/32 bit on order

Edited January 25, 20242 yr by Daskuppler

On 1/24/2024 at 7:44 PM, Daskuppler said:

All was going well and then I went to put the last timing idler on the belt to button it all up and it stripped the threads... Helicoil kit was available, but it didn't come with a drill bit and no one has one locally... So I now have a stripped hole in the block and a 13/32 bit on order

Oh man that's so tough. But hey you are VERY close. 

I have chased the existing/damaged threads and installed a longer bolt a couple of times.  The bolt holes are sometimes (always?) deeper than the bolts, so there are unused clean threads in the bottom of the holes. You can poke a tooth pick or coat hanger down the hole and compare it to the length of bolt sticking out the back of the pulley so you know how much "additional" thread you're getting.  Not that you'd want to do this of course!

So I got the 13/32 drill bit for the helicoil, drilled a nice hole, and then jacked up the threads tapping it. It was all going very well, then the tap kicked off crooked and then slipped in the threads.  Helicoil threads in and locks in place, but the bolt won't tighten down on it and ends up spinning the helicoil.  Pulling the bolt removes the helicoil.  How bad is this?  Where do I go from here?  I don't think a bigger bolt will fit through the idler...

Would something like this be acceptable: https://www.amazon.com/TIME-SERT-BIG-SERT-Oversized-Metric-5012/dp/B003QB5HR6/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_bdcrb_top?ie=UTF8

How do you ensure the new hole is perfectly centered with the old one?

Edited January 26, 20242 yr by Daskuppler

For less money

https://www.mcmaster.com/93715A630/

insert tool

https://www.mcmaster.com/94010A330/

You can also find taps and drill bits there at McMaster-Carr

I had to do the helicoil repairs on all timing idler & tensioner holes on a 2003 Forester engine in 2021.

Take your time when tapping holes and clean out chips with compressed air frequently as you go.

Edited January 26, 20242 yr by czny

13 minutes ago, czny said:

For less money

https://www.mcmaster.com/93715A630/

insert tool

https://www.mcmaster.com/94010A330/

You can also find taps and drill bits there at McMaster-Carr

I had to do the helicoil repairs on all timing idler & tensioner holes on a 2003 Forester engine in 2021.

Take your time when tapping holes and clean out chips with compressed air frequently as you go.

Thank you! How do those work? Will they work with the current messed up hole and slightly crooked threads (or what's left of them)?

1 minute ago, Daskuppler said:

Thank you! Looks like those require a 14mm hole. Is there enough meet around this particular one for a hole that size? How do you ensure the drill bit is centered in the hole?

 

2 minutes ago, Daskuppler said:

Thank you! How do those work? Will they work with the current messed up hole and slightly crooked threads (or what's left of them)?

Drill & tap hole for new insert. Screw insert in with another bolt, short piece of tube backed with a nut. Drive in stakes until flush.

Choose your inserts carefully because some sections on front of engine have limited metal to anchor into

9 minutes ago, Daskuppler said:

 

Work up to the needed drill size in steps from smaller to required size. Use drill & tap fluid.

Find a friend with a steady hand to do the drilling if you think you can;t hold the drill steady.

You may be able to find thick-walled steel bushings at McMaster to hold against the case surface for a drill guide. Some are available at bigger Ace Hardware stores too.

Take your time. Don't rush it.

Edited January 26, 20242 yr by czny

You mentioned you're doing it in car right?  At this point, might as well remove the radiator to get the best possible outcome for tapping a hole... especially if it might break through into block.

26 minutes ago, nvu said:

You mentioned you're doing it in car right?  At this point, might as well remove the radiator to get the best possible outcome for tapping a hole... especially if it might break through into block.

It is in car, radiator was removed for the head gaskets and hasn't gone back in yet. A machine shop loaned me a time sert set to try out with a liberal application of loctite 271. If it doesn't work, they said it will need to go to them for repair.

Did you install one helicoil or two?  They’re short right?  They need stacked and threaded tightly to one another?

you can also get right angle drill attachment or sometimes I’ve rented a really nice right angle drill. Gives more space and better control  

Worst case scenario I had a timing bolt rip a huge chunk of engine out. The bolt was threaded into a big chunk that just snapped right out of the block. No fluid cavities.  A machine shop threaded the block and made a huge rump roast threaded replacement piece of metal with the treaded timing bolt hole in the middle. Installed their custom insert. Installed timing bolt and pulley on that.  Worked great and they charged me like waaaay to little money for it like $200 or something absurd. I’d never expect that again but it was way better than expected when everyone said the engine was toast. It was my car and ran great. 

3 hours ago, idosubaru said:

Did you install one helicoil or two?  They’re short right?  They need stacked and threaded tightly to one another?

you can also get right angle drill attachment or sometimes I’ve rented a really nice right angle drill. Gives more space and better control  

Worst case scenario I had a timing bolt rip a huge chunk of engine out. The bolt was threaded into a big chunk that just snapped right out of the block. No fluid cavities.  A machine shop threaded the block and made a huge rump roast threaded replacement piece of metal with the treaded timing bolt hole in the middle. Installed their custom insert. Installed timing bolt and pulley on that.  Worked great and they charged me like waaaay to little money for it like $200 or something absurd. I’d never expect that again but it was way better than expected when everyone said the engine was toast. It was my car and ran great. 

I only had one helicoil in.  I couldn't get a second one in.   I got a time sert installed and it torqued down to the 30 ftl lbs spec.  I'll check it again in the morning after full cure.  That being said, I cleaned the area up a little better and realized that this particular bolt hole is actually in the water pump housing, not on the block; so worst case scenario I'm out a new water pump for $150 and I get a nice new clean hole.  Working at 4am is not my sharpest time!

Started it this morning and it poured oil from both sides, top and bottom of the heads....

11 hours ago, Daskuppler said:

Started it this morning and it poured oil from both sides, top and bottom of the heads....

I hope you didn’t put the head gaskets on backwards so the oil gallery hole in the HG is on the wrong side! 

🤞

56 minutes ago, el_freddo said:

I hope you didn’t put the head gaskets on backwards so the oil gallery hole in the HG is on the wrong side! 

🤞

I did writing out on both sides... All the holes looked like they lined up...

There's only one high pressure oil passage on the top of the gasket.  If it's flipped backwards that would explain the leak.  It's the topmost oval one.

  

 

It should match to the top port

Edited January 28, 20242 yr by nvu

On 1/27/2024 at 9:26 AM, Daskuppler said:

Started it this morning and it poured oil from both sides, top and bottom of the heads....

Sounds like HG not fitted in proper orientation. They only install one way and can’t be flipped front to back or top to bottom. 

1 hour ago, idosubaru said:

Sounds like HG not fitted in proper orientation. They only install one way and can’t be flipped front to back or top to bottom. 

That seems to be what I've done. Driver I have to order new gaskets, sounds I get the turbo MLS ones or start eth the single layer graphite coated ones Subaru sold me?

Did you have the heads resurfaced at a machine shop for this rebuild?  If so, go with the MLS ones, 11044AA770 or 11044AA670

Look up how to press back the tensioner with a c-clamp for reuse.  Going too fast can pop the internal seals. 

This video looks like the correct way.

 

Edited January 30, 20242 yr by nvu

2 hours ago, Daskuppler said:

That seems to be what I've done. 

Bugger

2 hours ago, nvu said:

If so, go with the MLS ones, 11044AA770 or 11044AA67

That second part number is a digit short. I can’t remember if it’s 673 or something else. 

I learned the other day that what you call a C clamp we call a G clamp over here - because it looks like a G! Thought I’d share  

Cheers 

Bennie

8 hours ago, nvu said:

Did you have the heads resurfaced at a machine shop for this rebuild?  If so, go with the MLS ones, 11044AA770 or 11044AA67

Look up how to press back the tensioner with a c-clamp for reuse.  Going too fast can pop the internal seals. 

This video looks like the correct way.

 

Is one part number better than the other?  It looks like the graphite coatings are reversed

19 hours ago, el_freddo said:

That second part number is a digit short. I can’t remember if it’s 673 or something else. 

Ah, I copied wrong, it should be 11044AA670 gonna edit the original.  Thanks

13 hours ago, Daskuppler said:

Is one part number better than the other?  It looks like the graphite coatings are reversed

Actually I realized the pics I posted above have the 770 on top, and 670 below.  The top center area is different, but for your use case either is fine.  They are both MLS designs.

Thank you everyone for the info!  I just ordered two of these: 11044AA670

Job finished up well today.  Must have had some oil and coolant issues with the replacement gasket for the short while it ran (the car smoked from the tailpipe for about 45 minutes at idle when it started up.  I also had a hell of a time getting coolant to circulate, the lower radiator hose stayed ice cold for a long time, pesky air bubbles!  Glad it's back on the road again!  Thank you everyone for your help and knowledge!