seattlelegacy Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 I took my newly acquired 84 wagon for a spin last night. I know the pax front axle is shot, there isn't even much of a boot left on it. Tight turns, it makes all the noise in the world - obviously it needs a new front axle. I noticed the rear end is making a lot of clunking though. I mentioned this in another thread too, and some of you thought it might be a rear axle. As I was driving around, I put it in 4WD and the noise certainly got louder, leading me to think yes, it needs a new rear axle too, but when I got home, I inspected both rear axles, and couldn't see any obvious signs of failure. The boots were both intact and I didn't see any grease leaking out from them. Any other ideas here? Also, not sure if this helps, but when I put it in 4wd, I could not get the car around the roundabout on my street. I had to straighten out the wheel and put it in reverse! Thanks, Jordan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamtheq Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 My wife says I should cut out the Mexican food when I have a loud rear end, but as to your problem, how about the u-joints in the rear drive shaft? Are they solid? I've not experienced that in a Subaru before but my old full-size Blazer would act similarly (clunking, etc.) when I had bad u-joints. Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry DeMoss Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 Wheel bearings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted January 17, 2006 Author Share Posted January 17, 2006 My wife says I should cut out the Mexican food when I have a loud rear end, but as to your problem, how about the u-joints in the rear drive shaft? Are they solid? I've not experienced that in a Subaru before but my old full-size Blazer would act similarly (clunking, etc.) when I had bad u-joints. Ed Would the U joints be turning in 4wd though? (I honestly don't know) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamtheq Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 Would the U joints be turning in 4wd though? (I honestly don't know) Yes, the rear drive shaft turns when you are in 4WD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted January 17, 2006 Author Share Posted January 17, 2006 I meant 2wd, lol! That looks pretty silly doesn't it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry DeMoss Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 If you want to check your driveline get under there and grab it with both hands and rotate it back and forth while looking at the U-joint for slop.Good luck. Would the U joints be turning in 4wd though? (I honestly don't know) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollie715 Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 I meant 2wd, lol! That looks pretty silly doesn't it! Yes, the rear driveshaft turns all the time, as it is always connected to the rear wheels thru the differential. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subarian Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 Check the castle nuts for proper torque. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 crawl under the car to check for two things: one - grab the driveshaft (going from transmission to rear differential) and shake it around. excessive play will point to a bad ujoint. the ujoints can get bad and seize and still pass this test though occassionally so that doesn't necessarily rule it out, but a bad one typically will show by the grab and shake test. while yo'ure there (under the car) grab the rear diff and shake it as well, use the axles if you'd like. if it wobbles excessively the bearing above it is bad and the diff will clunk around while driving, shifting, etc. above the diff is a 17 mm bolt with a 22mm nut on the other side. this passes right trhough the rear diff carrier and bushing. these bushings go bad....most are 20 years old by now. clank clank is the result. with a flashlight and careful inspection you can see cracks in it or completely missing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrap487 Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 one more thing to add, just because the rear shafts look ok, it doesnt mean they are ok. grab them and see if there is any play at all, both shaking back and forth and trying to rotate. I have the same problem, put it in 4wd and my half shaft makes a horrible noise, I get under there and try and rotate it, and there is a HUGE amount of play in the axle joints. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave valiant Posted January 17, 2006 Share Posted January 17, 2006 I had a bad U-joint in my Brat that only made the clunking noise when in 2WD. If it s the U-joint, it is always a good idea to replace both of them. You never know when the other is going to go bad, and they are cheap and relativily easy to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted January 18, 2006 Author Share Posted January 18, 2006 Thanks for the responses guys. I'll get to it this weekend (right....). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Roberts Posted January 24, 2006 Share Posted January 24, 2006 Mine got real noisy; first, had the rear diff. replaced with a used one (it'd been beaten up when Hell's Subaru Shop (loooong story) had put in the wrong ratio used transmission, last summer and we also chewed up the rear tires real bad on the one 4wd trip we made. I'd worried about the rear drive train after that debacle. Besides, the car has 240k miles on it, so I figured, okay. WTH. The replacement rear diff. didn't end the noise (though it helped noticeably). So, they looked further. Turned out that one of the four bearings on the rear axles (2 per axle) was rusty. Mechanic did this job -- had to send the axle out to a shop with a hydraulic press to get the rusted bearing off of it. I looked at them on the shop table -- three bearings with black grease, and one reddish-orange bearing in orange-brown grease. It was just coming apart. Looks like it'd gotten wet sometime in the remote past and just had fresh grease squirted in over the water, after that, and rusted out inside. It's nice and quiet now. The previous owner sold it to me because he thought it was too noisy, just generally, for his damaged hearing. Yup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted January 24, 2006 Author Share Posted January 24, 2006 above the diff is a 17 mm bolt with a 22mm nut on the other side. this passes right trhough the rear diff carrier and bushing. these bushings go bad....most are 20 years old by now. clank clank is the result. with a flashlight and careful inspection you can see cracks in it or completely missing. Looks like the bushing doesn't exist. That may be the issue. Also, one more thing to add, just because the rear shafts look ok, it doesnt mean they are ok. grab them and see if there is any play at all, both shaking back and forth and trying to rotate. The shafts slide back and forth, but don't wiggle around much. Aside from the sliding, they are solid and don't have any play when I try to rotate them. I'm guessing the sliding back and forth is what they're designed to do as the axle needs to lengthen when the wheel drops..(see my simpleton diagram)? Thanks guys. Simple diagram: rear diff. X-boot-------shaft--------boot-X wheel ..........................<---slide--->....................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torxxx Posted January 24, 2006 Share Posted January 24, 2006 axles have side to side movement. That allows for angle changes in your suspension. I.E. bottomed out or tire off the ground. I'm betting on the rear diff hanger bushing. Mine is toast and I get a really nasty clunk when my LSD locks up. Check at the flange where the driveline bolts to the rear diff. If the x-member right above the flange has bare metal showing or if there is bare metal on your driveline flange or bolts you need to replace that diff hanger bushing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 Alright, here's what mine looks like. Think this is the clunk? The thing is, it doesn't look like its been moving much at that point. What is the bushing called, and can you get them new?? Thanks guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 Alright, here's what mine looks like. Think this is the clunk? Bump for added photo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subarunuts Posted January 25, 2006 Share Posted January 25, 2006 Well - the noise shouldn't be there, but binding (not being able to go in a circle) is normal for any 4WD without a center differential. That's the major difference between the older soobs, and legacy's (AWD) and the like. So that part is perfectly normal. As for the clunking sound.... jack up the rear so both wheels are off the ground. THEN check the driveline for play - shake it and see if it's got any play. Turn it (with trans in neutral 2WD) to see if there is any binding. Binding indicates either a problem with the u-joints, or a problem with the differential. Most likely the u-joints tho. You can't just crawl under it because with the wheels on the ground, the driveline is not free to spin, and it's doubtful that you would feel any play at all. The wheels would bind the driveline, and not allow the play in the joints to be noticed. I had a u-joint bearing go out and made that same mistake. Thought it was the diff, but after jacking it up realized that it has to be under no load before checking it for play. While you have the wheels up, check the wheel bearings - spin the wheels and try to shake them back and forth. Could be a wheel bearing is starting to get crunchy. If you can't move the front diff bushing by hand, then it's probably fine. I've never had one fail on me - they are pretty tough.... I wouldn't want to try and find a new one tho - dealer only part for sure. Junk Yard is the best bet for that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 I did lift the car off the ground, spun the wheels, looked for play, shook the crap out of both axles, wheels, rear driveline, U joint, etc. etc. No dice. Wheels turn freely, and very smooth. I've had a wheel bearing go, and this sounds nothing like it. Hmmmm..... *scratching head*. Jrodan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subarunuts Posted January 25, 2006 Share Posted January 25, 2006 But did you spin the driveline or just the wheels? Spinning the wheels (one at a time) will excersize the diff, but not spin the driveline at all. It might be that one of the bearings in the u-joints has rusted solid - that would cause some serious clunkage. Shaking it wouldn't show any play, but turning it you would notice a "hard spot" or binding halfway through each turn. Make sure the trans is in 2WD when you try to turn it or the front wheels will stop it from turning. Had this happen to a steering u-joint on my EA81 a while back. There was a hard spot in the steering, and I couldn't find the problem for the longest time. I even tore down the power steering rack looking for issues. Finally found the rusted steering joint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 But did you spin the driveline or just the wheels? Spinning the wheels (one at a time) will excersize the diff, but not spin the driveline at all. It might be that one of the bearings in the u-joints has rusted solid - that would cause some serious clunkage. Shaking it wouldn't show any play, but turning it you would notice a "hard spot" or binding halfway through each turn. Make sure the trans is in 2WD when you try to turn it or the front wheels will stop it from turning. Had this happen to a steering u-joint on my EA81 a while back. There was a hard spot in the steering, and I couldn't find the problem for the longest time. I even tore down the power steering rack looking for issues. Finally found the rusted steering joint. I'm pretty sure the driveline spun when the wheels did. But I'll try it again, and see if I can spin the rear wheels by turning the driveline. Earlier in the post, someone else indicated that the driveline spins whenever the rear wheels spin. Thanks for the ideas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subarunuts Posted January 25, 2006 Share Posted January 25, 2006 Sorry - should have been more descriptive - the driveline spins whenever BOTH wheels spin at the same time AND the same direction. If you spin one with it off the ground the diff rotates internally, and the driveline remains stationary... (the opposite wheel will spin the other direction) hence everything was smooth when you spun just one wheel. Spinning the driveline will spin both wheels the same direction, and will give you an idea of the shape the u-joints are in. I've had several u-joints stop u-ing in the past. Always accompanied by the clunking that gets worse when in 4WD. The symptoms are very similar to what you describe. I'm pretty sure the driveline spun when the wheels did. But I'll try it again, and see if I can spin the rear wheels by turning the driveline. Earlier in the post, someone else indicated that the driveline spins whenever the rear wheels spin. Thanks for the ideas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seattlelegacy Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 Sorry - should have been more descriptive - the driveline spins whenever BOTH wheels spin at the same time AND the same direction. If you spin one with it off the ground the diff rotates internally, and the driveline remains stationary... (the opposite wheel will spin the other direction) hence everything was smooth when you spun just one wheel. Spinning the driveline will spin both wheels the same direction, and will give you an idea of the shape the u-joints are in. I've had several u-joints stop u-ing in the past. Always accompanied by the clunking that gets worse when in 4WD. The symptoms are very similar to what you describe. Sweet, I'm going to give it a try tonight, thanks for the help!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.