dlm5774 Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 Hi, I've got a 1998 Subaru Outback, 2.5 About 8 months ago I replaced my front brake pads & rotors and also had a new front right axle shaft (CV) installed. As I was driving home today my ABS light came on and the car started making an awful grinding noise. I stopped at the nearest mechanic and told them what happened, the history of the car...etc. They took off the front right tire and the mechanic said that the nut that holds the rotor in place came right off in his hand! The rotor is all marked up because it wasn't held down tightly. He said that whoever diid the brake job/cv work didn't tighten the nut properly. Now they have to replace or regrind the rotor, check the pad, and check the left side too. I was also told I may have to replace the wheel bearing and the ABS senso, depending on how extensive the damage is. This is all double dutch to me! Is it possible that the mechanic that did the brake job didn't tighten the nut and now 10,000 miles later I'm seeing the effect? Am I going to have to sink a bunch of money into fixing this - Does anyone know what a new front wheel bearing + labor costs? Is there another explanation as to what could have happened? The mechanic said it was "poor" workmanship. Is he right? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoodsWagon Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 Yeah, he's probably right. If you don't tighten down the axel nut properly, everything in the area gets damaged. You're lucky the axel didn't strip out in the hub. There's a cotter pin that holds the axel nut in place. If the origional mechanic didn't install it or reused the old one and it broke, then it's his fault. He may also be an impact gun type of guy. That often leaves the nuts with the wrong torque. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon38iowa Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 Hi, I've got a 1998 Subaru Outback, 2.5 About 8 months ago I replaced my front brake pads & rotors and also had a new front right axle shaft (CV) installed. As I was driving home today my ABS light came on and the car started making an awful grinding noise. I stopped at the nearest mechanic and told them what happened, the history of the car...etc. They took off the front right tire and the mechanic said that the nut that holds the rotor in place came right off in his hand! The rotor is all marked up because it wasn't held down tightly. He said that whoever diid the brake job/cv work didn't tighten the nut properly. Now they have to replace or regrind the rotor, check the pad, and check the left side too. I was also told I may have to replace the wheel bearing and the ABS senso, depending on how extensive the damage is. This is all double dutch to me! Is it possible that the mechanic that did the brake job didn't tighten the nut and now 10,000 miles later I'm seeing the effect? Am I going to have to sink a bunch of money into fixing this - Does anyone know what a new front wheel bearing + labor costs? Is there another explanation as to what could have happened? The mechanic said it was "poor" workmanship. Is he right? Thanks If he (where you originaly had it worked on) is a reputable Mechanic I would offer this guy two choices: Fix it to your specifications, or face a law suit. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OB99W Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 If he (where you originaly had it worked on) is a reputable Mechanic I would offer this guy two choices: Fix it to your specifications, or face a law suit.If the original mechanic was "reputable", we probably wouldn't be having this discussion (although I suppose anyone is entitled to a mistake; hopefully one of this kind very infrequently). I'd be more inclined to have someone else do the repair, and the choice for the first guy would be paying for the repair or facing a suit (perhaps in small claims court). Of course, that would require reasonable proof that the failure was actually due to the first mechanic's incompetence/negligence/whatever; the evidence and/or testimony might not be as easy to obtain as you'd like. Lots of people will point fingers until they're asked to do it in a court of law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 There's a cotter pin that holds the axel nut in place. If the origional mechanic didn't install it or reused the old one and it broke, then it's his fault. my 970bw has a cripm in the csatle nut to hold it in place rather than a cotter pin ... same difference. but if not crimped, or torqued properly then it could losen. i also hear that with new axels come new castle nuts(?). does it look newer than the left? if this were on the left side of the car it may not have loosened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 sounds like a bad job by the previous mechanic. the wheel bearings may not be ruined, i would not replace them unless there's sure signs of damage/issues. how long did you drive the vehicle like this? an entire used hub can be purchased for $35 - $75. i'd buy a used hub and have it installed before paying for new bearings and all that labor on a hub that could have issues anyway. they are easy to swap and these front bearings don't fail enough to cause alarm in installing a used one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlm5774 Posted September 7, 2006 Author Share Posted September 7, 2006 Well, I do have to replace the passenger side wheel bearing! My local mechanic is 100% convinced it's because the nut was not tightened to the correct specifications when I had the brake job done at Firestone. I suggested a used hub, but the mechanic won't guarantee the work if I go that route and I don't want to try and save a few bucks only to find I have trouble all over again. I just want things done right this time around. Total cost is about $500. The garage that did the original brake job is not helping the situation. They are over 50 miles away and told me I need to take the car to them first. It's not driveable and they won't reimburse my tow truck costs unless they do decide they are at fault (what are the chances of that happening?). I'm going to have my local mechanic do the work and document everything. Then I can send all the info in to the company headquarters to try and get some kind of compensation. Lessons learned...you get what you pay for! I thought I was getting a good deal getting my brakes done at a Firestone! But in the end it cost me over $750 for a new set of rotors and brakes for my front wheels, not to mention the hassle. In addition, Firestone's customer service is pathetic! Their manager laughed at me when I explained the situation and told me that because I had put about 10,000 miles on the car since they did the brake job, there was no way the incidents could be related. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tcspeer Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 The axle nut does not come off for a brake job, did the people that done the brakes also replace the axle? or did some other shop do that? Well, I do have to replace the passenger side wheel bearing! My local mechanic is 100% convinced it's because the nut was not tightened to the correct specifications when I had the brake job done at Firestone. I suggested a used hub, but the mechanic won't guarantee the work if I go that route and I don't want to try and save a few bucks only to find I have trouble all over again. I just want things done right this time around. Total cost is about $500. The garage that did the original brake job is not helping the situation. They are over 50 miles away and told me I need to take the car to them first. It's not driveable and they won't reimburse my tow truck costs unless they do decide they are at fault (what are the chances of that happening?). I'm going to have my local mechanic do the work and document everything. Then I can send all the info in to the company headquarters to try and get some kind of compensation. Lessons learned...you get what you pay for! I thought I was getting a good deal getting my brakes done at a Firestone! But in the end it cost me over $750 for a new set of rotors and brakes for my front wheels, not to mention the hassle. In addition, Firestone's customer service is pathetic! Their manager laughed at me when I explained the situation and told me that because I had put about 10,000 miles on the car since they did the brake job, there was no way the incidents could be related. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tcspeer Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 I agree this is the best way to take care of this, I got my last used hub for 35.00 dollars if I remember right and it's very easy to change with the help of the people here and a Haynes manual. sounds like a bad job by the previous mechanic. the wheel bearings may not be ruined, i would not replace them unless there's sure signs of damage/issues. how long did you drive the vehicle like this? an entire used hub can be purchased for $35 - $75. i'd buy a used hub and have it installed before paying for new bearings and all that labor on a hub that could have issues anyway. they are easy to swap and these front bearings don't fail enough to cause alarm in installing a used one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon38iowa Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 Hi, I've got a 1998 Subaru Outback, 2.5 About 8 months ago I replaced my front brake pads & rotors and also had a new front right axle shaft (CV) installed. As I was driving home today my ABS light came on and the car started making an awful grinding noise. I stopped at the nearest mechanic and told them what happened, the history of the car...etc. They took off the front right tire and the mechanic said that the nut that holds the rotor in place came right off in his hand! The rotor is all marked up because it wasn't held down tightly. He said that whoever diid the brake job/cv work didn't tighten the nut properly. Now they have to replace or regrind the rotor, check the pad, and check the left side too. I was also told I may have to replace the wheel bearing and the ABS senso, depending on how extensive the damage is. This is all double dutch to me! Is it possible that the mechanic that did the brake job didn't tighten the nut and now 10,000 miles later I'm seeing the effect? Am I going to have to sink a bunch of money into fixing this - Does anyone know what a new front wheel bearing + labor costs? Is there another explanation as to what could have happened? The mechanic said it was "poor" workmanship. Is he right? Thanks By the way; Last time I had my tires rotated, the service person didn't tighten the lug nuts enough! The next day one was missing and another was half way off! The shop manager fell over himself appologizing, moreover, he happily replaced the missing one with a new OEM nut, and he had the guy who goofed check all the lug nuts. These things happen at every shop, at least, occcasionaly. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 since i am not perfect, for years i have used as my motto, "everyone makes mistakes, it's how you correct them that's important." By the way; Last time I had my tires rotated, the service person didn't tighten the lug nuts enough! The next day one was missing and another was half way off!The shop manager fell over himself appologizing, moreover, he happily replaced the missing one with a new OEM nut, and he had the guy who goofed check all the lug nuts. These things happen at every shop, at least, occcasionaly. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 since i am not perfect, for years i have used as my motto, "everyone makes mistakes, it's how you correct them that's important." Words to live by. Thanks, johnc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jib Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 Yes, I hear of cars leaving shops with loose lug nuts enough that it's scary. Check them anytime someone else works on you wheels. jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon38iowa Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 Yes, I hear of cars leaving shops with loose lug nuts enough that it's scary. Check them anytime someone else works on you wheels. jack I agree, moreover, I think its a good idea to check after work is performed of any kind. If one finds an issue then the shop can't blame it on mileage. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrturbo Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 ???? i would maybe consider another mechanic if he told you that nut holds the rotor on, and there isn't a cotter pin to hold it it is a crush type nut. the bearing failed because of not having the proper torque from the nut coming loose. and also i wouldnt waste your time on a used hub, you will be back to where you are at now at some time or another. it is a much better deal to just get a new bearing pressed into the hub. who knows what mileage will be on the used hub you would get. and the abs light is probably on because when the bearing failed the hub pitched to the side and knocked the little nub that sticks off the end of the wheel sensor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tcspeer Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 Not always better to press a new bearing into an old spindle, sometimes the hub has been damaged after running with a bad bearing. Then you are out lots of money and still need to have it repaired. Why not buy the used spindle and hub and replace it and then buy a bearing for around 40.00 and put it in the hub you took off or have someone else press it in, then you have a spare. ???? i would maybe consider another mechanic if he told you that nut holds the rotor on, and there isn't a cotter pin to hold it it is a crush type nut. the bearing failed because of not having the proper torque from the nut coming loose. and also i wouldnt waste your time on a used hub, you will be back to where you are at now at some time or another. it is a much better deal to just get a new bearing pressed into the hub. who knows what mileage will be on the used hub you would get. and the abs light is probably on because when the bearing failed the hub pitched to the side and knocked the little nub that sticks off the end of the wheel sensor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrturbo Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 you could do that, but it would be pretty pointless to do if your parts are still good. it is a gamble either way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tcspeer Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Yes it a gamble all the time, yesterday I bought a fuel pump for my 98 Legacy wagon from O'Reilly's and it was 82.00 dollars but they said unless I bought the new strainer for another 20.00 dollars it had no warranty, I took the gamble and passed on the strainer and warranty. you could do that, but it would be pretty pointless to do if your parts are still good. it is a gamble either way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrturbo Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 the funny part about that is that they will all tell you that but the way most auto stores history systems work they cant tell if you purchased one of not. for ex. i ran an advance auto store for a couple years and if you purchased those 2 parts sep. the pump would flag for cust info and the strainer wouldnt. so if anything happens you could just tell them you bought if but not at the same time and there is nothing they could do about it. just gotta know how to work their system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcoaster Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Either your mechanic is wrong, or the other shop removed more stuff than necessary to replace the rotor. I've replaced the front rotor on my former 96 outback (before I traded up to a 2004) and the rotor replacement is super easy. It was just loosening the two big rusted bolts that holds the caliper to the spindle assembly was the hardest part. The rotor is simply held in by your tire! The rotor is actually a separate peice from the hub itself. I've heard some common problems is that the rotor gets somewhat stuck on the hub due to rust. A few taps with a rubber mallet is all it takes to break it free. For my car, it was just a firm tap with the palm of my hand and the rotor freed itself from the hub and the rotor slid right off. The abs teeth are on the hub itself. No axle nut to remove. I would suggest that you buy a Haynes manual for your car. You will be suprised at how some stuff are easy to replace on your Subaru. If you still want to have a mechanic do it for you, at least you are armed with information how to replace things and you will be able to tell if your mechanic is right, or trying to milk money from you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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