Auto window doesn't know when to stop

[Max Power]

Hello all -

The motor for the front passenger window of my 97 OB does not automatically stop once the window has fully retracted. The end result is a series of clunking noises from inside the door which last as long as the window switch is activated. All other window motors stop when the corresponding window is fully retracted.

What causes this to happen? How does one correct this condition?

Thanks in advance,

mp

[Legacy777]

Most switches would stop when the current increases, ie the motor is not moving, but still trying to move. You may want to try and find a used switch at a junkyard and swap it.

[Max Power]

Thanks for the suggestion; I will certainly try a replacement switch.

Any thoughts as to which switch (driver or passenger)?

The results are the same regardless of whether I use the driver switch or the passenger switch. I can certainly replace both. However, the local bone yard is rip-off when it comes to switches, and I'd rather save the $.

 

Thanks again,

 

mp

[Legacy777]

Hmmm....I think I may have misunderstood you.

 

So you have a problem when the window is being "rolled" down correct? When the window is being put up, the window stops just fine?

 

If so, I'd actually suspect/wonder if there is an issue at a certain spot in the gearing that is allowing the motor to continue to run and cause the clunking. I don't think electrical would cause what you're seeing.

[211]

Thanks for the suggestion; I will certainly try a replacement switch.

 

Any thoughts as to which switch (driver or passenger)?

 

The results are the same regardless of whether I use the driver switch or the passenger switch. I can certainly replace both. However, the local bone yard is rip-off when it comes to switches, and I'd rather save the $.

 

Thanks again,

 

mp

 

then I would speculate that the problem is in the motor. The switch only closes the loop allowing current to flow to the motor alternating polarity depending on if your rolling up or rolling down the window. If the motor is continuing to operate after the load increases (IE window can't roll up anymore) there's something in the motor circuit not telling it to stop.

 

 

Dig that deep but while you're in there take a look at the gears like posted earlier. Perhaps the gears are stripped and not transferring that load into the motor like it should thus not triggering the stop mechanism/circuit.

 

EDIT:

Unless there's an electrical switch that's triggered when the window gets to a certain position. It would have to be a "normally closed" switch so when the windows all the way down/up it hits the switch opening the circuit. I havn't had a door panel apart so that's just a guess...

[Max Power]

So you have a problem when the window is being "rolled" down correct? When the window is being put up, the window stops just fine?

 

Yes, the problem occurs when rolling the window down and the window reaches the point when it would normally stop. Putting the window up works fine.

 

If so, I'd actually suspect/wonder if there is an issue at a certain spot in the gearing that is allowing the motor to continue to run and cause the clunking. I don't think electrical would cause what you're seeing.

 

Ok, I'm on board with that theory. I'll look for a worn tooth in the gear or something similar.

 

Thanks again,

 

mp

[nipper]

The current sensing is built into the switch. The motor is just a motor. I am voting for a problem with the master controlled (drivers door switch).

 

We are talking about the auto down feature?

 

nipper

[msmithmmx]

I have this same problem. I just purchased a new master switch for 10 bucks off Ebay. When I hit the auto-down it just keeps trying to lower the window when its down allready

[211]

The current sensing is built into the switch. The motor is just a motor. I am voting for a problem with the master controlled (drivers door switch).

 

We are talking about the auto down feature?

 

nipper

 

But he said it happens with both drivers and passenger switch. Which is why I thought it was the motor. Oh, well, I guess basic troubleshooting skills don't apply here.

[Max Power]

The current sensing is built into the switch. The motor is just a motor. I am voting for a problem with the master controlled (drivers door switch).

 

We are talking about the auto down feature?

 

nipper

 

Sorry, Nipper, my explanation wasn't great. It's not the auto down feature. The passenger side window motor doesn't stop when it should, whether controlled by the driver's switch or the passenger switch. This only happens when rolling the window down.

 

I'm leaning towards a broken tooth in the mechanism inside the door. That makes the most sense to me, since the motor runs and the window clunks until I release the switch.

 

I'll look at it over the coming weekend and report back.

 

Cheers,

 

mp

[johnceggleston]

i have a 97 obw that the auto down is funny. when the window reaches the bottom, something continues to engage. and until it releases, i can't raise the window. and nothing i do wil release it. it has it's own time frame, not long but still it's own. if i lower the window manually and stop it just before the bottom, no problem. i think i would prefer the no auto down as oppsed to this. can the auto down be disconnected?

 

 

what is a power window regulator? do these cars have them? could this be the problem? or is it just the switch?

[nipper]

i have a 97 obw that the auto down is funny. when the window reaches the bottom, something continues to engage. and until it releases, i can't raise the window. and nothing i do wil release it. it has it's own time frame, not long but still it's own. if i lower the window manually and stop it just before the bottom, no problem. i think i would prefer the no auto down as oppsed to this. can the auto down be disconnected?

 

 

what is a power window regulator? do these cars have them? could this be the problem? or is it just the switch?

 

All cars with windows that go up and down have window regulators. Thats what makes them go up and down. A power one just means it has a motor.

 

Auto up and down cant be disconnected, as it is built into the switch. Replace the master switch with one from a junkyard and that should solve that issue.

 

nipper

[johnceggleston]

All cars with windows that go up and down have window regulators. Thats what makes them go up and down. A power one just means it has a motor.

 

Auto up and down cant be disconnected, as it is built into the switch. Replace the master switch with one from a junkyard and that should solve that issue.

 

nipper

 

thanks

[msmithmmx]

I replaced the the driverside master window switch and I am still having the same problem. If I use the auto down, after the window goes down every 5 seconds after it keeps trying to lower it. Could it be the motor? If I push it a tad up it stops trying to lower it.

[Cougar]

I replaced the the driverside master window switch and I am still having the same problem. If I use the auto down, after the window goes down every 5 seconds after it keeps trying to lower it. Could it be the motor? If I push it a tad up it stops trying to lower it.

 

The power window circuit breaker is resetting and tripping again. It sounds like the new switch you put in has a problem in the switch position since you say it can be moved slightly to stop the action.

[nipper]

or a bad circuit breaker, or a bad motor. Sadly we dont have much exp with this, as they are fairly trouble free.

 

Have you tried making the motor run without the switch?

 

nipper

[srs_49]

I think it's the lower window position limit switch. Either it failed or is knocked out of alignment.

 

BTW, the driver's side windows on my '87 BMW does the same thing. Just waiting for something else to go wrong to make me pull the door panel off:rolleyes:.

[Skip]

It was my understanding that

the auto down (and or up in the older units)

 

Worked via a logic circuit that watches the current

the window motor is drawing.

 

When the window hits it's stop the current increase

causes the circuit to turn off the power to the motor.

 

I would try and find a boneyard power window control unit

(some where under the fnt pass seat, I believe)

[srs_49]

It was my understanding that

the auto down (and or up in the older units)

 

Worked via a logic circuit that watches the current

the window motor is drawing.

 

When the window hits it's stop the current increase

causes the circuit to turn off the power to the motor.

 

I would try and find a boneyard power window control unit

(some where under the fnt pass seat, I believe)

 

You may be right about the current-draw monitor. But, if it were me, I would want a hard limit switch (not that I have that option). Seems like there are too many other things that could cause the motor current to increase such as a mis-aligned window, sticking weather stripping, snow/ice, or just plain aging of the motor or bearings, any of which could cause the window to stop prematurely if was just based on current draw.

[nipper]

You may be right about the current-draw monitor. But, if it were me, I would want a hard limit switch (not that I have that option). Seems like there are too many other things that could cause the motor current to increase such as a mis-aligned window, sticking weather stripping, snow/ice, or just plain aging of the motor or bearings, any of which could cause the window to stop prematurely if was just based on current draw.

 

A cricuit is much cheaper to build and no switch to go bad. And really how many poorly aligned windows do subarus have? Or bad window mechanisims?

 

 

nipper

[Skip]

It is possible that the circuit was designed

back when the drivers window had

the auto UP feature also.

(eighties GL models I believe some very early Legacys)

 

This may have been a safety factor for Justin C.

 

 

Justin Case an object (hand, head, cat ect) got in the way

of the window closing.

 

The feature could have been carried over with no

new parts / engineering needed.

[srs_49]

A cricuit is much cheaper to build and no switch to go bad. And really how many poorly aligned windows do subarus have? Or bad window mechanisims?

 

 

nipper

 

Nipper - I'll have to defer to your experience as to the number of Subies with misaligned windows or bad mechanisms. My experience is limited to the OBW I have now:).

 

However, a well designed current monitoring circuit; one that will work reliably for 10 years or more over a -25 deg C to + 50 deg C temperature range and work with a variety of loads is not a trivial thing to design, and probably will not be cheaper than the limit switch. Though limit switches, being mechanical devices (unless they're optical or some other type on non-contact sensing) do have a lifetime limit, that lifetime can be in excess of 1 million operations for a high quality switch.

[nipper]

Nipper - I'll have to defer to your experience as to the number of Subies with misaligned windows or bad mechanisms. My experience is limited to the OBW I have now:).

 

However, a well designed current monitoring circuit; one that will work reliably for 10 years or more over a -25 deg C to + 50 deg C temperature range and work with a variety of loads is not a trivial thing to design, and probably will not be cheaper than the limit switch. Though limit switches, being mechanical devices (unless they're optical or some other type on non-contact sensing) do have a lifetime limit, that lifetime can be in excess of 1 million operations for a high quality switch.

 

From the automotive design point of view (My field) anytime we can replace a mechanical switch with a chip, its a cost savings. Not only in up front costs, but in warrenty costs. Switches are good in fixed positions, but when they get shocked from door slams, they usally get damaged over the life of the car. The test cycles are results of lab conditions. I used to test micro switches.

 

 

Also making chips to whats required for the automobile really isnt that special anymore nor expensive anymore.

 

nipper

[kennethjohann29]

This is why I hate auto windows.. They tend to get way too dicey

[heartless]

can we PLEASE not dig up 3-4-6 yr old threads to make a simple statement like that??? especially one that adds absolutely nothing to the discussion????

 

sheesh, there has been a rash of this lately by several new people, and it is driving me crazy!