94Loyale Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Okay guys, my rear wheel bearing (driver's side) has been making some noise recently. I have the bearing and seals (It's the big one piece unit, not the tapered bearings. Seeing as it's freezing cold out, and I have no garage or anything, I'd like to get this done as quick as possible Anybody have any tips on the best way to do it? Thanks! Edit, It's a 1994 Loyale, 4wd Any help to make things quicker is appreciated (trick to doing them,special tool needed, etc..) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 It definately helps to have the pin-socket for the ring nut, but not neccesary. I used to do then with a chisel and a hammer before I bought one. An impact and the proper pin socket sure helps with not destroying the nut though. Pound out the axle stub shaft with a soft-faced (copper is my preference, but brass works, or a block of wood). Do this before you remove the ring nut, or you may find the stub has rust-welded itself to the old bearings. Remove the ring nut, drift out the bearing(s), and drift the new ones in. I use a brass punch tapered to only hit the race... The bearings come several ways - single-peice, three peice, and five peice. Subaru OEM started out with the single peice, and then switched to a three peice in the early EA82 era somtime. All of them fit the same, and the three peice depricated the part number for the single peice in the EA81's. It doesn't matter which you use. Personally I like the three peice as they are easier to install.... GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 12, 2007 Author Share Posted December 12, 2007 Exactly what I was looking for, sounds like it shouldn't take me too long to do then. It sucks working out in the cold :-\ But the advice is what I was looking for, that should help me out alot! Thanks alot GD, you helped me out with my last electrical problem too, I really appreciate it! I've done the front bearings before on my old GL and didn't really run into any problems, this doesn't sound too bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 13, 2007 Author Share Posted December 13, 2007 well...I'm screwed, Got everything off without any major problems. In order to get the axle out, I unbolted the shock and pushed down on arm back there, that worked perfect. My problem though is the ring nut...Tried the hammer and chisel to do it, but it just mangled the nut. Now I'm worried that I won't be able to get the nut out with the proper socket. I shouldn't have tried to do it tonight, but I didn't foresee that nut being an issue. Now it's going to snow pretty bad tomorrow, and I'm stuck, my BMW goes no where in the snow. Guess I'll have to wait till tomorrow and see if I can find a socket like that at advanced auto. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 Sadly no one is going to carry that socket . It's very much specific to Subaru rear wheel bearings. Clean the area around the nut really well, and insure that you have bent back all of the locations that are bent into the notches in the ring nut. You CAN get it out. Remember that. First thing is to heat the control arm up AROUND the nut. Don't apply heat to the nut, but instead apply it to the outside of the control arm. Do it as quickly as you can so all the heat doesn't migrate to the nut. An oxy/acetelene torch is best, but a map gas hand torch will sometimes work. Once you have got it pretty hot, release the rust hold on the threads by making four notches around the outside of the bearing housing right over the ring nut threads with a sharp blow from a chisel. This will expand the metal and allow you to turn the ring nut out. Another alternative to replacing the rear bearing is to get a whole rear control arm with a good used bearing in it. I've swapped control arms many times as they are cheaper than the $50 that a bearing costs . GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 13, 2007 Author Share Posted December 13, 2007 So this unit here won't work will it? http://www.amprotools.net/product_images/T72048.jpg That's the stuff they sell at Advanced Auto around here. I saw that one when I was up there grabbing a 36mm for the castle nut (some how I lost my last one). But it looks to me like the pins are too spread out. Oh well, I guess I won't bother getting up early to pick up that socket :-\ Thanks for saving me a trip though. And the advice, as always, is much appreciated. I'll see what I can do before I go to work tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 That *might* work. But it looks like it's too thin and would shear off.... the ones specifically for Subaru rear ring nuts are like 1/4" thick. It's worth a try, but as you have seen beating on it with a chisel - that ring nut is a seriously stuck bastard, and it's none too small or thin or wimpy either. I think it would eat that woosy socket for breakfast. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 This is the one: From here: http://shoptoolsshoptools.com/shopexd.asp?id=1156 GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 even a light duty propane torch will help, you can pick those up for $10-$20 even. heat it for about a minute or 90 seconds if you're not familiar with that technique. if it doesn't work, let it cool back down before trying again. two reasons - the heating/cooling could break the rust and if both are hot it could make it harder. there's also a "freezing" product that works under the same concept..but in reverse so to speak. that in combination with heat may help too. hey GD, is PB Blaster, Liquid Wrench or Deep Creep being used? is that okay around bearings if you're replacing them? that stuff is awesome at helping with rust (do not use WD40). installing a used hub isn't a bad idea if you think you can get yours off. rust is such a nuissance around here, it's really the thorn of all older subaru's around here. you should be able to find a used hub for $25-$35 easily if they're as available around you as they are around here. you could even buy one, install your new bearings, then install the hub to the car. more money out of pocket, but could reduce down time if you can't get that nut loose. if you were close to morgantown, you could borrow my tool, i have one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 i think you're close to Harry's - they have hubs for probably $15 or something, they are super cheap and loaded with subaru's. hard to believe they wouldn't have an EA82 rear hub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 13, 2007 Author Share Posted December 13, 2007 Haha, yes, compared to the Subaru socket, that one I saw does look pretty wimpy. And like I said, I'm thinking the pins are spread too far apart on that other one. I'll get up early tomorrow, hopefully before the snow and try heating it up. Gary, I sprayed the hell out of that nut,haha, I use that Kano Kroil stuff. I don't know if your familiar with it, but its great! As for the freezing spray, I was trying that too, too bad it was already freezing outside Then, about a used hub, there are 3 junkyards within 10 min of me that are loaded with older subarus. I love it! I just picked a bad night to do it, thought I could get it done before the snow tomorrow. After getting it apart, it looks like I could have run it for a few more days through the snow without anything bad happening. It was making some serious noise, and I finally had time tonight. Sometimes motivation is a bad thing.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 13, 2007 Author Share Posted December 13, 2007 I am pretty close to Harry's, but there are a few others that are closer. One of them is only 2 miles up the road from me, and he has a bunch of subaru's also. If I can't get that ring off, then I guess I'll go grab the whole hub. I'll let you guys know tomorrow then! Thanks for everything so far! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 right on, i've heard of that stuff. hopefully you have something to heat it up with. i've had them come loose with very little effort after heating before, it's almost uncanny sometimes. can't guarantee anything but don't want to miss this trick either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 13, 2007 Author Share Posted December 13, 2007 I'll give it a try, thanks for the ideas! Regardless of having the Subaru or not, the road is a solid sheet of ice this morning, so we're not working today anyway. I'll figure out what I can with the car with my time off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RONAN Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 Changed mine a year ago. I had a similar problem, no socket, nut frozen. I drowned it in kroil and rapped on the nut to work that oil in. I used heat on it until it was smoking and with a brass punch and hammer broke the nut loose with out damage to the slots. Good luck, I can sympathize with working out in the elements. Waiting for all this rain to pass out of my area so I can start troubleshooting my own problem... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemaker13 Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 I banged the ring up pretty bad w/ a punch/chisle and hammer. In the end I had to use a die grinder to cut out the "bad" spots around the ring. Where it is punched in to lock the ring, I had to cut some of that away to unlock it. It is a tricky setup... has anyone ever gotten it out w/o banging the piss out of it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 13, 2007 Author Share Posted December 13, 2007 Well, I don't have access to an oxy/acet torch right now. Do you think one of those little map or propane torches will do alright? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 14, 2007 Author Share Posted December 14, 2007 Nevermind, while i was at the hardware store, I picked up something pretty cool. It's a mini torch set with oxy and map gas. It's pretty bad rump roast actually, more than enough to make things red hot, and it can cut little stuff. However, the ring nut is still intact. I wonder if all the heat from the bad wheel bearings locked it in there good? Oh well, I'm pulling the whole hub, and grabbing one from the junkyard on Saturday. Of course though, it can't go well. No problems except for the brake line (brake lines hate me) and the main bolt that the hub swings from. That one is a ***************. I'll get it though. I think I'll have the junkyard guys pull that hub for me and pay an extra 10, I don't feel like doing it twice,haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 Do you think one of those little map or propane torches will do alright? i mentioned that earlier:even a light duty propane torch will help, you don't want to overheat the items you are working, otherwise it doesn't help you. this is a very good example of "more is not better". the right amount works perfectly, more or less does you no good. heat it for about a minute or 90 seconds if you're not familiar with that technique. if it doesn't work, let it cool back down before trying again. two reasons - the heating/cooling could break the rust and if both are hot it could make it harder. has anyone ever gotten it out w/o banging the piss out of it? i think it often comes down to rust and the elements. the north east frequently turns quick jobs into really, really long jobs just from corrosion/rust. if you have many to do or have rust to contend with the tool is probably a good idea. i recommend what i did...BUY IT NOW, before you need, then you'll never have to use it! i haven't even pulled it from the package since i bought, don't even remember when. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 has anyone ever gotten it out w/o banging the piss out of it? Sure - with the proper socket, and my 480 ft/lbs impact they come right off. Generally I don't even have to bend the tabs out. But the natives here don't know from rust. I saw some once while I was on vacation to Hawaii..... :-p GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted December 14, 2007 Share Posted December 14, 2007 the right amount works perfectly, more or less does you no good. Yep - the idea is to not allow the heat to migrate into the "next layer" before you get a chance to start beating. Expand the outside, and pound on the still cool inside - the temperature DIFFERENCE is what is important, not that absolute application of heat. That's also why a BIG torch works best. It can throw down more heat at a faster rate. This allows you to get the hot part hotter, while the migration of heat to the next layer is still trying to catch up. A few well placed sharp blows from a chisel will also expand the hot metal and assist in this process. It does take a bit of experience to get this right most times. But it also depends on the size of torch. I can get to RED hot in about 10 seconds or less with the torch at work. I routinely take apart press fit pump impellers with our 10,000 lb shop press using it. Sometimes takes 20 or 30 minutes of continuous heating and pressure but those assemblies weigh around 100 lbs or more. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 14, 2007 Author Share Posted December 14, 2007 Thank you guys, I do grasp the concept on heating the hub up rather than the nut. I was just saying how that little torch set I picked up was pretty cool. I've about given up on the ring nut though, thats why I started to pull the whole control arm/hub. I can only take so much failure before I move on to another idea. I'd still be working on that nut if it weren't so damn cold out, and if I didn't have to lay on snow to work on the car :cool: Hopefully it will live again on Saturday, if I can manage to get that control arm bolt out, rust sucks.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulpicard Posted December 15, 2007 Share Posted December 15, 2007 94Loyale, I went through the exact same scenario you are going through . I don't have any j/y's within 200 miles that have Suby stuff, though. Wound up pulling the rusty arm/hub assy and bringing it to our (old-school) machinist. He arc-welded a bead inside the ring-nut. When that cooled, it shrunk and unscrewed with nothing more than a pair of channellocks. Of course a new ringnut was required (minor $$ at the Suby store 100 miles away) Last resort, I know, but it worked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 15, 2007 Author Share Posted December 15, 2007 Paul, if I didn't have so many junkyards right around me, I'd be doing the same thing. If that wasn't an option, I'd be pulling the hub/control arm and welding a big socket to that ring nut But rather then going through all that trouble, I'll just swap the whole unit. However, with my luck, and the way these hour jobs turn into days...I'm sure the unit I get from the junkyard will have the ring nut welded to the hub too :cool: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94Loyale Posted December 16, 2007 Author Share Posted December 16, 2007 Well....Mission Accomplished.... After working the whole day on it, and going to the junkyard to pull a new hub/control arm. Brought the "new" one home, and swapped out the bearings. The bleeder decided it wanted to be free on both my wheel cylinders, so I bought a new one. A brake line that was expertly crafted out of rust broke, so I changed it. I tried to bleed the brakes, and...you guessed it, another brake line blew So I replaced that also. I'm not sure if anyone has experience with these type of brake lines, but I would not recommend purchasing the Forged Rust lines. They suck. So, with my last bit of hope, I took a test drive, and all is well. All in all, it was a pain in the rump roast. I had written a suicide note while in the middle of working on it, but I tore it up when I got back from my test drive. So if anyone has any questions about swapping rear wheel bearings, I am now certified. Thanks to everyone for the great advice, and for helping me through the process. It makes things alot easier when I have friends, like all of you, to give new suggestions that I hadn't thought of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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