Geolguy Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Hello. When I turn the steering wheel, especially on dry pavement, I am feeling a growling sensation coming from the front end. Going straight, no growl. It almost feels like it is binding up. Not sure if Growl is the right word, but definitely like it is binding up. It is a 2005 Subaru Forester with about 110,000 miles on it. Any help would be appreciated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Hello. When I turn the steering wheel, especially on dry pavement, I am feeling a growling sensation coming from the front end. Going straight, no growl. It almost feels like it is binding up. Not sure if Growl is the right word, but definitely like it is binding up. It is a 2005 Subaru Forester with about 110,000 miles on it. Any help would be appreciated! could be air being sucked into the power steering system, or other PS problem. While idling, look in the PS reservoir tank for bubbles or foam. There should be none, maybe a little flow/movement ,but no bubbles. any work done recently on the car? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geolguy Posted April 17, 2012 Author Share Posted April 17, 2012 No work done lately. New tires back in November. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geolguy Posted April 17, 2012 Author Share Posted April 17, 2012 Oh. And the binding sensation happens while moving. Like turning a corner at a stop light or entering a parking spot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY_Dave Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Classic AWD binding symptoms. Auto or manual? If an auto put in the FWD fuse to disable the rear wheels and see if the problem goes away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geolguy Posted April 17, 2012 Author Share Posted April 17, 2012 It is an automatic. I did not know this, and I will look, so you are saying there is an open fuse location to just utilize front wheel drive? So with that fuse in, the rear wheels would just be rolling along with the ride, and the drive train to the rear wheels is just "resting," Then if the RWD is binding, it would not occur with that setup. Interesting, but a good diagnostic for sure. I will try later today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) No work done lately. New tires back in November. All 4? If not, then that could be the source of the torque bind. Or were the previous tires mixed sizes or brand? Tire circumference 'should' be less than 1/4" or so difference. basically, same brand and wear level (and proper inflation) tires all around. Edited April 17, 2012 by 1 Lucky Texan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 It is an automatic. I did not know this, and I will look, so you are saying there is an open fuse location to just utilize front wheel drive? So with that fuse in, the rear wheels would just be rolling along with the ride, and the drive train to the rear wheels is just "resting," Then if the RWD is binding, it would not occur with that setup. Interesting, but a good diagnostic for sure. I will try later today. The main reason they have that mode is for when you're running a spare tire. The spare tire has a much smaller diameter and will damage the awd system in an automatic. So you use the fuse to lock it in fwd (disconnect the rear transfer clutch) so it doesn't fry the transfer clutches. But it's also good for diagnostics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) Don't be too alarmed as this is an effect of how the AWD system works. Some smoother than others. MAybe you should have the transmission fluids changed, since yout mileage is at the right moment for it to be due if not done yet. If your noise is afterall the power steering, please use ATF trans fluid in the power steering since that is what it uses, and not the clear GM steering fluid that everyone is used to as it will ruin the pump. my folk's 97 forester does this. my 94 legacy does this. make sure all the tires are even pressure, as one tire lower than the other can aggravate this symptom. a *slight* rumble is expected and is normal for tight turning, but if it gets worse, then check the above(tires, replace fluid, inspect cv axle boots) if your new tires are only a pair, mount them diagonal. Ideally, you replace all 4 with matching brand at same time. But in the real world, people can afford 2 tures. What you don't want is a difference in rotation between the front and rear axles. If you mount odd tires diagonal from each other, you have one in the front and one in the back that match rotation through the 4wd clutches, and any other difference in rotation will be absorbed by the open center diffs. Edited April 17, 2012 by MilesFox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geolguy Posted April 18, 2012 Author Share Posted April 18, 2012 Tires are all the same... stock size... all new last November. This "binding" just started to occur about a month ago and has gotten progressively worse. I have 1000 Ford F150 and when in 4x4 it also "binds" when turning a corner, and that is normal for that truck. The Subaru is doing somewhat the same thing except is not normal, from my perspective having driven it for 110000 miles then within the last 500 miles get this binding thing going on. I will do some diagnostics later (look at CV boots, ps fluid, fuse add for just FWD etc.... THanks for all the help people have provided. I am amazed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 No it is not normal. A ocassional jerk or a growl for about 5 feet after parking the car in a spot is normal. This is the time it takes the puter to figure out your not stuck just backing out of a spot. Transmission fluid flush 1st. If that doesnt do it a bottle of transX and cross your fingers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 sometimes folks report similar symptoms from bad u-joints. using the FWD fuse will help diagnose things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geolguy Posted May 2, 2012 Author Share Posted May 2, 2012 Thanks for all the help. Changed/flushed the transmission fluid and the problem went away completely!!!! The mechanic did put in some type of new fluid product which is apparently important than using the old type fluid. If anyone needs the name of the fluid I would be glad to check into it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unibrook Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Glad you resolved it. I will just add for future searchers that if your car was a manual tranny, with front wheel torque bind symptoms when warm, then the fix is to change out the front differential fluid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 (edited) Glad you resolved it. I will just add for future searchers that if your car was a manual tranny, with front wheel torque bind symptoms when warm, then the fix is to change out the front differential fluid. ??? Could you expand on this. The front diff is open, and shares its lube with the manual transmission. Thanks for all the help. Changed/flushed the transmission fluid and the problem went away completely!!!! The mechanic did put in some type of new fluid product which is apparently important than using the old type fluid. If anyone needs the name of the fluid I would be glad to check into it. but yeah, glad it was fixed and ,sure, tell us what fluid your mech used. Edited May 2, 2012 by 1 Lucky Texan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I think he meant the center diff, a brain slip on his part, not front diff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unibrook Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Just to clarify. Read carefully what I wrote........if you car is a MANUAL TRANNY, then you would want to change the front diff fluid. This cures front wheel torque bind. Rear wheel torque bind is a problem with the center diff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Just to clarify. Read carefully what I wrote........if you car is a MANUAL TRANNY, then you would want to change the front diff fluid. This cures front wheel torque bind. Rear wheel torque bind is a problem with the center diff. Sorry, but that doesn't make any sense. In a manual the front diff and gearbox share the same oil. There's one dip stick, one drain plug. The front diff is also open. On EVERY subaru except the STi. With no exception (except maybe JDM stuff, no idea there). The center diff is a sealed unit. No gear oil touches the inner workings of the center diff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unibrook Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 (edited) Think of it this way. When people talk about torque bind, everyone seems to assume they mean the rear wheels are binding. When, in fact, it might be the rears, or it might be the fronts. On a manual tran subaru, if the rear wheels are binding, the problem is most likely your center diff (no fluid change possible there). If it is the FRONT wheels binding, then the problem is your front diff. You simply change your front diff fluid to cure it. Or at least, this is the first thing you should do to try to cure it. (the fact that the fluid is shared by the gearbox is neither here nor there). Edited May 2, 2012 by unibrook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
987687 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Torque bind isn't just rear or front binding. Torque bind is the word that stemmed from automatic transmission center clutches not disengaging. But the asem word does apply to fried center diffs in the manual transmission. It's not front or back wheels binding independently, it happens because the front and back diff aren't allowed to spin at a different speed. Think of a 4wd truck in 4wd on dry pavement. That is exactly the idea behind what happens when a subaru center diff locks up. If your manual transmission was having a binding problem that a oil change fixed, something is probably wrong with it. If the front diff was binding up, chances are it's been ruined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unibrook Posted May 3, 2012 Share Posted May 3, 2012 Well, I suppose we don't have to use the phrase torque bind, if that creates confusion. But on my 2001 Forester 5MT with 109k miles on her, only the front wheels were grabbing the pavement on slow turns when the car was warm, never when cold. Changing the front diff fluid fixed it. 5k miles later still running fine, no symptoms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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