Steves72 Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 (edited) Today I was returning home when I noticed an odd sound. I was able to determine that the sound was not apparent with the car stopped, did not occur with the transmission in park (or neutral) and revving the engine. It does occur when your foot is on the gas. If you take your foot off the gas and allow the car to coast the sound disappears. It starts back up as soon as you put your foot back on the gas pedal (even lightly). You can feel the vibration if you rest your hand on the shifter. The sound is speed sensitive (not RPM) related. I checked both the transmission fluid and the differential fluid when I got home. Both were normal and did not smell abnormal. I am guessing that it might be a wheel bearing or something in the back of the transmission? Any educated guesses would be appreciated. Added Note: both front axles are less than two years (one is less than one year). Neither boot is damaged. One axle, the newer is an raxle.com axle, the slightly older one is an MWE axle. And, I am following this thread which does sound similar: http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=134518 Steve Edited August 11, 2012 by Steves72 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 could you create the noise by creeping along with someone pacing the car to locate the noise? left right front rear, it would help. comparing the temps of the hubs after a drive might find one wheel hotter than it's mate - perhaps indicating a bearing or possibly a brake problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steves72 Posted August 12, 2012 Author Share Posted August 12, 2012 could you create the noise by creeping along with someone pacing the car to locate the noise? left right front rear, it would help. comparing the temps of the hubs after a drive might find one wheel hotter than it's mate - perhaps indicating a bearing or possibly a brake problem. No, I could not. The noise is not apparent at very slow speed and does not occur when the car is cold. It starts after about 10 minutes of driving and is only noticeable above 25 mph. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY_Dave Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Front or rear pinion or trans bearing, maybe the driveshaft carrier bearing. What is the pitch of the noise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steves72 Posted August 15, 2012 Author Share Posted August 15, 2012 With no clue, I took it to my mechanic. He identified the issue as the bearing which carries the output shaft stud. It can be seen here - http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/66-problems-maintenance/23368-ring-clips-cv-joint-axle.html Scroll down to the 4th message in the thread posted by driveby. It's item 6 in the picture. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted August 15, 2012 Share Posted August 15, 2012 (edited) on the off chance it has not been repaired yet, you could put in the FWD fuse and see if that eliminates the noise. making the noise under throttle only suggest that it should go away with the fuse in. same with carrier bearing in the center support of the drive shaft. i'm impressed he could identify it. it seems odd to me that a bearing that is lubed by the trans fluid pump would fail, but it happens. Edited August 15, 2012 by johnceggleston Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY_Dave Posted August 15, 2012 Share Posted August 15, 2012 Never heard of one of those going, maybe a previous owner drove with a very bad DOJ for a looong time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted August 15, 2012 Share Posted August 15, 2012 or towed it with the front wheels up and the rear wheels down.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY_Dave Posted August 15, 2012 Share Posted August 15, 2012 It's the side bearing for the front diff, the one that carries the stub axle, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steves72 Posted August 15, 2012 Author Share Posted August 15, 2012 It's the side bearing for the front diff, the one that carries the stub axle, I think. Yes, I believe you have pointed out the correct part. I do not know what the technical name for that bearing is but is is a type of carrier bearing. It does support the axle stub and there is one on each side of the transmission. Only one of them has gone bad on me and I did not feel it until Saturday. I did not like the feel of the vibration so I did not want to continue to drive it waiting for it to get much worse just in case it was the transmission itself. The symptoms I experienced was a vibration when pushing on the gas pedal. The harder the engine was working the more pronounced the vibration. There is a long down hill run on my way home and I lifted my foot off the gas pedal while the car accelerated on its own down that hill. At the bottom I was doing close to 75mph - no vibration. As soon as I put my foot back on the gas to climb the next uphill run, the vibration returned. There is another active thread on this board right now with symptoms very similar to mine. That car's symptoms sound more sever than mine. Perhaps because the issue has not been addressed immediately. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY_Dave Posted August 15, 2012 Share Posted August 15, 2012 It would make sense the symptoms of that bearing being bad/loose would mimic a bad DOJ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted August 16, 2012 Share Posted August 16, 2012 All the symptoms of a bad DOJ; fortunately only lightly. I would bet that the bad axle is the one on the catalytic converter side. The heat from that seems to cause the boots to fail on that side and perhaps the lubrication for the DOJ to not be as effective as it could be. First time I've seen this on an AT; all of mine have been with the 5MT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steves72 Posted August 16, 2012 Author Share Posted August 16, 2012 All the symptoms of a bad DOJ; fortunately only lightly. I would bet that the bad axle is the one on the catalytic converter side. The heat from that seems to cause the boots to fail on that side and perhaps the lubrication for the DOJ to not be as effective as it could be. First time I've seen this on an AT; all of mine have been with the 5MT. I will reiterate once more - this was not a failed DOJ. The failed component was not related to the CV joint. The failed bearing is inside the transaxle case. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steves72 Posted August 16, 2012 Author Share Posted August 16, 2012 Well, I said I would report back what the issue was when it was solved. It turns out that there are more issues than originally thought. I went to get the car back today and instead of my car I drove home in a loaner. After the carrier bearing was installed and torqued to specifications the vibrations were even worse. The axle and new bearing were pulled back out and at least two different differential pieces were fished out of the case. My mechanic is uncertain if the bad bearing caused the teeth of the gears to break off or if the teeth breaking off led to the bearing failure. When I first felt this on Saturday I was 30+ miles from home and drove it in that condition. I drove it another 4 miles on Sunday, 28 miles to and from work on Monday. Finally, 10 more miles Tuesday morning to drop it off with my mechanic. Perhaps I should not have driven it that far but you do what you have to do. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Well, I said I would report back what the issue was when it was solved. It turns out that there are more issues than originally thought. I went to get the car back today and instead of my car I drove home in a loaner. After the carrier bearing was installed and torqued to specifications the vibrations were even worse. The axle and new bearing were pulled back out and at least two different differential pieces were fished out of the case. My mechanic is uncertain if the bad bearing caused the teeth of the gears to break off or if the teeth breaking off led to the bearing failure. When I first felt this on Saturday I was 30+ miles from home and drove it in that condition. I drove it another 4 miles on Sunday, 28 miles to and from work on Monday. Finally, 10 more miles Tuesday morning to drop it off with my mechanic. Perhaps I should not have driven it that far but you do what you have to do. Steve Bad news. Sorry for that. No, with a minor vibration, there's certainly no reason to believe the issue is serious enough to call a tow truck rather than driving it home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 besides, the damage was already done. time to located a used trans, http://www.car-part.com . sort by distance to see what is close, shipping will add $150 or more to the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivans imports Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 front ujoint in rear driveshaft have had 3 in a row all toast one destroyed the tailshaft on trans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY_Dave Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 front ujoint in rear driveshaft have had 3 in a row all toast one destroyed the tailshaft on trans Curious- were some of those cars equipped with VDC? The U-joints tend to go quicker on those since the rear wheels do most of the work (45/55 normal split). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivans imports Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 one was a 3.0 six with vdc others were high miles out backs over 350000kms Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steves72 Posted August 29, 2012 Author Share Posted August 29, 2012 Final report. Got the car back today. My wallet is 4k lighter and the car has a remanufactured transmission. The front differential was shot. A remanufactured differential was not available anywhere. The only way I could get a differential was to buy a whole transmission. No one around this area had a used transmission. My mechanic got one from the dealer. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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