idosubaru Posted September 24, 2018 Share Posted September 24, 2018 What’s the overall trend of the CVT failures? Isn’t it more noticeable because of subarus pronounced sales figures or are people avoiding them? What kind of warranty do the Subaru installed units (reman or new) come with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 (edited) We saw lots of failures at the dealership where I worked, BUT, most of the ones I saw are ones that had not had any fluid changes....and still a relatively small percentage of the cars we saw. They bumped the warranty on the early ones to 100k miles. IIRC, replacement new ones have a 1 year warranty, and reman 3 year. Labor if they installed it, parts only if not. Personally, I wouldn't avoid it for reliability reasons, just make sure it's had fluid changes (preferably with OE fluid, although GD has posted a good alternative, Amsoil I think). Edited September 25, 2018 by Numbchux Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikec03 Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 Quote We saw lots of failures at the dealership where I worked, BUT, most of the ones I saw are ones that had not had any fluid changes What was the typical mileage at failure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 25, 2018 Author Share Posted September 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Numbchux said: Personally, I wouldn't avoid it for reliability reasons, just make sure it's had fluid changes (preferably with OE fluid, although GD has posted a good alternative, Amsoil I think). Thanks - more and more friends/family/acquaintances/colleagues are asking questions about them. Subaru dealer has one for sale they installed a used transmission into (i didn't know they did that), craptastic 1 month warranty and so far they haven't said what the mileage was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted September 25, 2018 Share Posted September 25, 2018 3 hours ago, mikec03 said: What was the typical mileage at failure. 80k+ typically. They came out of the woodwork when the warranty was extended to 100k for awhile 2 hours ago, idosubaru said: Thanks - more and more friends/family/acquaintances/colleagues are asking questions about them. Subaru dealer has one for sale they installed a used transmission into (i didn't know they did that), craptastic 1 month warranty and so far they haven't said what the mileage was. Yea, we did plenty of used ones if the car was out of warranty (or before the extension). Junk yard ones were plentiful and cheap, which tells me they do not fail very often (more good transmissions in the junkyards than people looking for them). The remans are like $6k, and a low mileage junk yard one is like $6-800....no brainer. We needed a CVT for a Nissan of some sort at one point, and I spent some serious time calling around to find one at all, and when I did they wanted like $4k, for a junkyard transmission with basically no warranty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 26, 2018 Author Share Posted September 26, 2018 Great, thanks. Got it, I’ve seen that with fords, land rovers and Isuzu’s where the trans fails all the time and used ones are insane expensive for something that frequently fails. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
czny Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 (edited) This term, CVT, had me scratching my head so I searched: Now that I've seen it I can't help but think of old machinery vari-speed drives married with silent chain instead of a wide rubber v-belt. Twisting & bending torque on that CVT belt must mean its a wear service item along with those pulleys. Vari-speed has been around for decades. How do I know of variable speed drives - production metal turning & milling machines. http://www.lovejoy-inc.com/products/variable-speed-drives.aspx You'd think they could've put that internal filter element in a more convenient spot........ Edited September 26, 2018 by czny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 (edited) There were older models with CVT too - but I think it required modern fluids and sophisticated electronics to be able to transfer 'significant' power in a unit small and light enough, and with decent reliability, for a motor vehicle. I think the first Justy's were CVT. Using the van Doorne trans? those had less force on them than modern cars I suppose. CVTt has a fairly long history. Benz may have had a European patent in 1886, got a US patent in 1935. Some early motorcycles had stepless trans. Volvo had them , Audi, etc. There may also be systems that use variable volume hydraulic pumps and 'nutating cones' , toroidal systems, planetary gears??? etc. I guess they all have their own set of issues..... Edited September 26, 2018 by 1 Lucky Texan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProspevtiveSubiBuyer Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 So I've been interested in purchasing an Outback only to find out that the auto transmission only comes in the goofy "rubberbanding" CVT. Now I'm reading that they are failing (https://www.forbes.com/sites/jensen/2017/07/07/facing-complaints-subaru-offers-extended-warranties-on-1-5-million-vehicles/#4145b6bf79dc). This makes me want one much less to the point where I won't be buying one. Is the 5EAT transmission compatible with the 15 and up Outback? I've looked at pictures of the CVT and the 5EAT bolt pattern and they look similar but I don't know much about it. Obviously if there is another non CVT Auto transmission that is compatible I'd like to hear about that as well. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 seriously doubt a 'downgrade' is practical - wiring harness and computer issues would be horrendous to work around. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmdew Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 Video link is nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProspevtiveSubiBuyer Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 I doubt it too Lucky, but knowing is half the battle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 18, 2018 Author Share Posted October 18, 2018 No If a small risk of cheap, straight forward trans replacement has you balking you’d never survive an auto swap on a modern Subaru. It would bolt up but swapping the harness would be a nightmare and playing nice with the CANBUS and FB would be all but impossible. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 7 hours ago, idosubaru said: No If a small risk of cheap, straight forward trans replacement has you balking you’d never survive an auto swap on a modern Subaru. It would bolt up but swapping the harness would be a nightmare and playing nice with the CANBUS and FB would be all but impossible. This is exactly what I was thinking. They stopped putting a conventional auto in the Outback almost 10 years ago. You're far more likely to have an oil consumption issue on the FB engine than a CVT failure. Both happen enough that they extended the warranty, but still a relatively low percentage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 18, 2018 Author Share Posted October 18, 2018 20 minutes ago, Numbchux said: This is exactly what I was thinking. They stopped putting a conventional auto in the Outback almost 10 years ago. You're far more likely to have an oil consumption issue on the FB engine than a CVT failure. Both happen enough that they extended the warranty, but still a relatively low percentage. That's the thing - I haven't seen any FB or CVT issues personally yet. Acquaintances, friends, and family driving these things who typically come to me with questions are cruising along without issues. Also Subaru's growth over that same time period is going to result in increased *numbers* of vehicles with issues even if the *rate* stays absolutely flat. If the CVT has the same amount of failures as the older EAT trans, you'd see the same rate of failures but 3 times as many in quantity due to sales increases from like 180,000 to almost 700,000 in those 10 years. It wouldn't be hard for anecdotal people...which comprises most of this country...to make incorrect assessments from something that isn't noteworthy. There are FB and CVT issues but let the data speak not emotions, anecdotes, and opinions... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 how much does a used CVT from car-part.com cost? The demand for replacements might say a lot about failure rates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 18, 2018 Author Share Posted October 18, 2018 18 minutes ago, 1 Lucky Texan said: how much does a used CVT from car-part.com cost? The demand for replacements might say a lot about failure rates. On 9/25/2018 at 3:50 PM, Numbchux said: we did plenty of used ones if the car was out of warranty (or before the extension). Junk yard ones were plentiful and cheap, which tells me they do not fail very often (more good transmissions in the junkyards than people looking for them). The remans are like $6k, and a low mileage junk yard one is like $6-800....no brainer. So far they seem readily available and not expensive so demand isn't vastly outstripping supply. I feel like they're a little higher than 10 year old 4EAT's were 10 years ago but maybe that's just inflation GD cautioned extended warranties may have kept prices low. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 29 minutes ago, 1 Lucky Texan said: how much does a used CVT from car-part.com cost? The demand for replacements might say a lot about failure rates. Take a look in your area... When I was at the dealership, we bought several good used ones for around $500. We had several that had out-of-warranty torque converter failure, and it was cheaper to get a used trans than a new converter. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 frankly, I have more concerns about stop-start and electronic parking brakes than the CVT. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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