Tman_567 Posted April 17, 2007 Share Posted April 17, 2007 Ok. I had a thread a week or so ago i had a thread about my car and the CV axle. The general consensuses was that my axles needed replacing. So today I'm on my way to the auto parts store to buy a few things in preparation for doing it myself. I was driving up Highway 99 in Lynnwood and saw a banner "$99 cv axle replacement" so i pull in and talk to the guy to see if that would apply to my car and if he had the parts ect. He did have the parts and the price would apply to my car (87 GL 2WD MT) I pay him in advance for one axle and told him i would pay the rest when i pick it up. I then asked him to "Could you look over the car to see if anything is wrong with it? If thats an additional charge thats fine, just look it over" he said ok and to come back in 3 hours. 3 and a half hours i come back and he tells me it will be a additional $127 and that my transmission is in really bad shape and needs to be replaced before the car will even move. I'm confused and ask him "what am i paying for then"? He said they did replace the axles. I step out side, call my dad and explain what happened. I came back inside and asked him "why would you replace the axles if the transmission doesn't work?" he said they didn't check. I go back in to ask "can you replace the transmission and how much that would cost"? He said they couldn't do it there.... Before this i had assumed he was just doing the mechanic thing when they tell you your car needs ________ and they could do it for you for an additional $____. When he said they couldn't i was a little confused. I leave the room to think it over. I go in tell him i would like to go home and that i would be back to pay later if that was ok. He said that would be fine. Am i wrong in assuming that you couldn't possibly replace both axles without noticing the transmission is shot? Like broken metal shot. When the CV went out there was a lot of noise and a bit of metal grinding. I realize i have to pay him. He did "technically" do what i asked, except the "check it over", but he did replace the axles..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted April 17, 2007 Share Posted April 17, 2007 pay via credit card and you hvae options to contest the charges later at least. i'm VERY confused you it drove fine to the shop but then the trans was shot? something isn't right about the way i'm reading this. were there any signs at all of trans problems before you stopped there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboobaroo Posted April 17, 2007 Share Posted April 17, 2007 if there was no problem BUT the axle like driveability issues, then pay for the axles and get outta there. Its a scam or they f***ed something up and are trying to blame it on it needing a tranny and getting you to pay for it. If the tranny didn't make any noises when you took it in there, ask if you can take it for a test drive and see why the tranny needs to be replaced. If they're trying to toy with you, there shouldn't be anything wrong with it since the only thing that has to do with the tranny when you replace the axles is the axles have a roll pin that goes through the axle, through the stub on the tranny and back into the axle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoodsWagon Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 So.... you paid: $99 for one axel before hand $127 afterwards Did the $127 include the $99 for the other side's axel? Have you tried driving the car? The only thing I can think of is they may have removed the halfshalfts by prying the stubs out of the transmission instead of removing the roll pins and sliding the inner CV joint off of the stub. If they pried the stubs out of the tranny, then it's their responsibility to fix it. Ask them the procedure they used to remove and replace the axels. Leaving any shop with an open "look it over, I'll pay any additional charge" is a bad idea. Get the quote and stick to it as best you can beforehand. You don't drive a car to a shop, have new parts put on, and then not be able to drive it back out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddy Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 hey it a scam cuz after reading your story theres no way that ur tranny be shot and still be able to drive the suby to the shop. we almost got scammed at a smog station heres the quick story 86 GL-10 Turbo wagon fails smog and the crusty old tech tells us theat the car needed new injectors and that the timing marks were erased and needed to be repainted.REPAINTED????? they are stamped !!! well took the car to my uncle's mechanic and he found the true problem injectors were fine. anyway what i suggest is that you do what i did and find a trust worthy mech. and you know what dont go by yourself to the shop take your dad or someone wit u. good luck aight and i check back on your situation soon!!! Buddy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddy Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 So.... you paid:$99 for one axel before hand $127 afterwards Did the $127 include the $99 for the other side's axel? Have you tried driving the car? The only thing I can think of is they may have removed the halfshalfts by prying the stubs out of the transmission instead of removing the roll pins and sliding the inner CV joint off of the stub. If they pried the stubs out of the tranny, then it's their responsibility to fix it. Ask them the procedure they used to remove and replace the axels. Leaving any shop with an open "look it over, I'll pay any additional charge" is a bad idea. Get the quote and stick to it as best you can beforehand. You don't drive a car to a shop, have new parts put on, and then not be able to drive it back out. true true true so ever true like i said before get back there and investigate your are being scammed!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoodsWagon Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 1." I feel like punching him in the throat but contain myself and calmly step out side,""When he said they couldn't i was very confused and upset." "Hes a rump roast hole" 2. "he said they didn't check. " "except the "check it over"," 3. Am i wrong in assuming that you couldn't possibly replace both axles without noticing the transmission is shot? Like broken metal shot. When the CV went out there was a lot of noise and a bit of metal grinding. It isn't a little worn out or even very worn out, its broken. How could you not notice! and he did "technically" do what i asked," but he did replace the axles..... 1. Totally wrong attitude to be dealing with a shop with. Calm yourself down, and don't get so friggin emotional about it. Pacing in and out of the shop is almost comical. Seriously, pull yourself together before you go back. From your explination, it really doesn't seem like he raped you, unless the $127 is above and beyond the $198 for the two axels. 2. You normally don't "check a car over" untill it's up on the lift. Checking a car over includes looking at the brake lines, pads, ball joints, tie rod ends, exhuast, holes and body damage, and tires. Usually costs less than $40 3. Was the car pushed into the shop? You seem to imply that the cv joint exploded, which means the car can't move it's self if it's a 2wd like you stated. You can't tell if a tranny is bad by just looking at it. All you normally do to a tranny when you're replacing a halfshaft is look at the exterior, so there is NO WAY TO TELL if the tranny is bad untill you drive the car. Which you can't do untill the new axels are in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZRX Doug Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 Hmm..wonder if they tried to install the wrong inners on your car? The larger diameter ones will slip right over the small output stubs, and a stupid enough mechanic could concievably just hammer the roll pins thru and call it "done" without ever realizing that the output shafts will just spin within the axles..it's concievable that the roll pins would even provide enough resistance to "drive" the thing while on the hoist and possibly outta the shop before the pins shear under real abuse. At this point, the tech will hear a grinding noise and your car will not move. Bozo will KNOW it's not an axle prob ('cuz he just put new ones on, right?) and make the leap to assuming the tranny is junk.. The reason I bring this thought up is that it took the local axle supplier three attempts (and a couple death threats) to get me the correct inner ends when I replaced my front axles last summer..I was wise (lucky is more like it!) enough to check that the splines mated properly before I started, but I can see how a properly motivated Bozo who's not familiar with the Subie world could manage to screw this one up.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 Hmm..wonder if they tried to install the wrong inners on your car? The larger diameter ones will slip right over the small output stubs, and a stupid enough mechanic could concievably just hammer the roll pins thru and call it "done" without ever realizing that the output shafts will just spin within the axles..it's concievable that the roll pins would even provide enough resistance to "drive" the thing while on the hoist and possibly outta the shop before the pins shear under real abuse.At this point, the tech will hear a grinding noise and your car will not move. Bozo will KNOW it's not an axle prob ('cuz he just put new ones on, right?) and make the leap to assuming the tranny is junk.. The reason I bring this thought up is that it took the local axle supplier three attempts (and a couple death threats) to get me the correct inner ends when I replaced my front axles last summer..I was wise (lucky is more like it!) enough to check that the splines mated properly before I started, but I can see how a properly motivated Bozo who's not familiar with the Subie world could manage to screw this one up.. Good thoughts. I also second the idea of mellowing out; not all shops are "out to get you," but they ARE all out to make money, that is NATURAL... and you have no right to be offended by it. Chances are, because this is a 20 year old subaru, they overlooked something. Test drive the car; find out why they think it "needs a tranny" and go from there. Above all, just relax. He CANNOT take you for any more of a ride than he already has; he said so himself. Find out the parts they installed (it seems to good to be true that they had a pair of axles on hand ready for you) and come back and update us with the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman_567 Posted April 18, 2007 Author Share Posted April 18, 2007 My dad and i decided we didn't want to deal with them, they hardly spoke English and demanded their money. "pay now. New axle in car!" The guys an rump roast and there is nothing i can do about it. Hes not going to budge. Ya i was very angry when i typed all that up.... i was still in the parking lot, so i was pretty pissed. Reread it, kinda embarrassed... It was the principal that got me so rilled up. Tranny is shot. Car still wouldn't move. Towed it home. I guess i need a new tranny. Any ideas? Any honest shops around :-\ How much is that going to set me back? I got brand new axles on my subbie now! If this was any other car i would give up.... but i LOVE my subbie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonicfrog Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 ZRX, that sounds very likely since subie axles are not very easy to find. I replaced 3 /4 of mine last fall while swapping the crappy 3 speed auto tranny with a five speed, and had to do a lot of hunting to find the axles for the turbo model. Auto parts stores will sell you four wrong parts for Subie before they get you the right one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZRX Doug Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 Wait. Answer a few questions, please. 1. Did you initially have to tow the car in, or did you drive it there? 2. Assuming you drove in, what was the car doing that made you feel it needed axles? 3. What EXACTLY is the car doing now that makes you feel the tranny is dead? And is this different than what it was doing BEFORE the axle replacement? There are quite a few different scenarios that could play out here, but we're all just guessing until more info is provided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 OK, here's the original thread http://ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=73625 Tim... one very important question: was the car on the ground or on jackstands when you shot the video? If it was on the ground, then the hub is stripped and the transmission is probably OK. The hub's easy to change and one should be available via this board for a pretty low price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman_567 Posted April 18, 2007 Author Share Posted April 18, 2007 Video- on ground Towed it to the shop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZRX Doug Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 Okey dokey then..you've got some sort of issue with the hub in the video..stripped splines most likely. And the axle shop apparently missed the hub damage when they installed your new axles, though I don't know how they could have torqued them properly if the hub(s) were stripped that badly. Does the car still do the same thing? Is the new axle spinning while the car's on the ground too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caboobaroo Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 I bet the hub where the axle goes into the knuckle is stripped out. With the axle turning with the tranny, that would be the best bet. Easy way to tell. Jack the front of the car up on jackstands, pull the wheel off and start the car. Then put into gear and if you see the end of the axle turning (large 36mm nut), then the hub is stripped out. Easy fi, just remove the 36mm castle nut, remove the brake caliper and slide it off the axle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 the video in the other thread shows the axle rotating.. it's the hub. Easy for a shop to miss. You don't even have to fink with the caliper - just remove the cotter pin and 36mm nut and then there are 4 14mm bolts which attach the hub to the rotor. Post an ad in the Wanted section asking for a hub for your car. It won't be more than $9 to ship it from anywhere in the US using flat rate Priority Mail boxes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misledxcracker Posted April 18, 2007 Share Posted April 18, 2007 Same thing happened to me in the past. Stinkin hub! Easy fix... sure beats a transmission! Hope it works out for you... it should, once you get hold of a hub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZRX Doug Posted April 19, 2007 Share Posted April 19, 2007 Well? What happened? Is the axle still spinning, did the tranny guys install the wrong axle(s), is the tranny really broken? Anxiously awaiting the conclusion to this lil' drama, here.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemaker13 Posted April 19, 2007 Share Posted April 19, 2007 Just read thru all of this... I am curious too as to what was the final verdict. Some good thoughts to keep in mind when diagnosing axle/tranny/hub issues! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman_567 Posted April 20, 2007 Author Share Posted April 20, 2007 Ok. Sorry i couldnt get back earlier. Been busy. I took some pictures of the axle. The two main things im curious about are... It moves 4-5 inches back and forth. It looks like there was a pin holding it that broke... It looks sheered and twisted. When the car is running (with wheels on the ground) in neutral it kind of makes a weird noise. And every once and a while it makes a horrible grinding noise. The axles no longer spin but when i pull the thing back i can see a gear sticking out and it is spinning. when i push the thing back in if it catches right it stops spinning. If it doesn't you can tell the gear is spinning inside the thing and making noise. Pictures are probably more helpful than me. pulled out http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c193/Tyler_987/axle/5005.jpg pushed in http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c193/Tyler_987/axle/6006.jpg broken pin? http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c193/Tyler_987/axle/13013.jpg http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c193/Tyler_987/axle/9009.jpg http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c193/Tyler_987/axle/14014.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman_567 Posted April 20, 2007 Author Share Posted April 20, 2007 when the car is in neutral should the sprocket thing coming out of the tranny be spinning? it doesnt seem to be spinning with much force, it can be stopped with the axle thing... someone tell me the proper names of these "things" i labeled the things i want to know the names of.... haha What are parts one and two?? http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c193/Tyler_987/axle/14014parts.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted April 20, 2007 Share Posted April 20, 2007 Part one is the Axle stub shaft, or just stub. Part Two is the inner CV joint cup, a part of the complete axle assembly they installed. Problem is they installed 25 spline turbo axles on your car. The ones you need are 23 spline. That is reffeering to the number of "teeth" on axle stub. Which is the thing stick out of the trans spinning. The axle they installed has a bigger hole than the axle stub. The pin is only supposed to keep it from sliding in and out, like you are doing. It broke because it is not supposed to take any rotational, or driving power. And because the stub can spin freely, no power is transmitted to the other axle. Just like being stuck in mud, one wheel spins, the other sits still. Tell them to get you the right axles. 23 Spline, Non-Turbo axle your're trans is fine. Did you ever check the hub however? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyale 2.7 Turbo Posted April 20, 2007 Share Posted April 20, 2007 ...Tell them to get you the right axles. 23 Spline, Non-Turbo axle ... Please, Correct me if I´m Wrong: I Just Counted 22 ... ... I Just Changed one Axle on my 1985 White Wagon, and this is a Photo of it: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyale 2.7 Turbo Posted April 20, 2007 Share Posted April 20, 2007 Just set the Mouse´s Cursor on one Line, then count... I only found 22. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.