xr2guy Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Having never owned a Subaru and i'm looking at getting one, I was wondering which would be better. I'm looking a a 1996-1999 legacy 2.2l. What has everyones pluses and minus's been over the years with either of these in your Subaru's. Thanks RB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deadend9009 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Automatics use a 90%-10% ratio between front-rear wheel power. Manuals have 50-50 at all time Manuals also do not have a clutchpack in them, they use a viscous coupling with is much more reliable. Beware of "torque Bind" that is when the clutch packs fail, expensive to repair. I would personally get a manual, and its what i did myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotshot Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 As far as performance and reliability, you really can't go wrong either way. The choice basically comes down to which you prefer driving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 lets be clear , automatics constantly vary the torque split from 90/10 to 50/50 (or 45/55 on the newere ones). Gas mileage is about the same in the real world, and if they are both taken care of they last the life of the car. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daehttub2000 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 A 2.2L running an AWD drivetrain in a Legacy Wagon needs all the help it can get so I’d recommend a manual. You’ll pick up at least 1 second in a 0-60 dash and you’ll have a lot more control (IMHO) in mud/sand/snow. I have a 5-speed 2.2L 95 Legacy Manual and I’ve driven both 2.2 and 2.5 automatic Legacy wagons. The Subaru 4-spd auto’s really slow them down. The downside is that you might find some very tired clutches on wagons driven by people who try to drive them like WRX’s:rolleyes: . I’m less familiar with the reliability of the automatic Subies but I’m sure the folks on the board here can tell you what to look out for (torque bind?). Of course, if you need to text message while you have your breakfast on the drive to the office in the morning, by all means get an automatic:lol: . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Subies but I’m sure the folks on the board here can tell you what to look out for (torque bind?). On any subaru you look for Torque bind. In the autos there a few things that can be tried to fix it, but if its on a manual, it needs a new center diff. Make sure all the tires match on the car, and that they have the same amount of wear. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 The automatics are very reliable but manuals are more so. A manual has the better chance of making 250,000 miles without needing replacement. But the manual will also probably need at least one if not two clutches in that time which is $1,500 in maintenance costs. You can replace an automatic for that or less. So take your pick, the life costs aren't significantly different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
four-fleet-feet Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 OK, here's the other thing to think about: have you ever owned/driven a manual IN PORTLAND? Or ever? If you have no manual driving experience, it might come as a total shock the very first time you are on an icy hill. Hill-holder or not, you will be in for a surprise if you've never done it before. If you have any back problems, the manual will KILL you. I speak from experience here. However, if you have no back problems, have manual driving experience, and the thought of having future clutch work doesn't faze you, the manual will certainly avoid the automatic's penchant for thinking it knows better than you do when to shift going uphill or downhill (rant!). Manuals, also, have a higher resale percentage in the NW. Everyone wants one! You'll have no trouble selling it when the time comes (if ever). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fnlyfnd Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 I vote for the 5spd. It feels peppy and as long as the clutch is recent you'll be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostinthe202 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 I'm for the 5spd too. I don't like the fascist nature automatics.... But seems you're really asking about the reliability of each not peoples emotional preference. The answer on that seems pretty even, so you'll just have to pick one;) Good Luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheinen74 Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 i have both on my legacys, 5spd and automatic. and in the snow, i think the auto does better, with the 90/10 split and 50/50 split on high power neeeds. The 90/10 on ice and snow, is more "wheels that slip transfer power to those that grip" like on the manual, its always 50/50 so its not as good on ice and snow, its like a 4wd truck when one slips they all slip... gas mileage is better in the 5spd cause i can control the shift points, even though the final ratio is same. 5spd much more sporty.....in the snow i drive my auto, in summer the manual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forester2002s Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 If you have any back problems, the manual will KILL you. I speak from experience here. ...a voice from the dead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
four-fleet-feet Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 If you ever drive a stick after a severe back injury, it'll hurt so much you'll PAY for someone to put you out of your misery. Believe me when I say for a long while I wished I HAD died until I got my truck with auto trans. That's why I no longer drive a manual (or get the 37mph in town and 51 on the freeway). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 If you ever drive a stick after a severe back injury, it'll hurt so much you'll PAY for someone to put you out of your misery. Believe me when I say for a long while I wished I HAD died until I got my truck with auto trans. That's why I no longer drive a manual (or get the 37mph in town and 51 on the freeway). Same reason i dont either. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaruplatt Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 in the snow, i think the auto does better, with the 90/10 split. The auto I have is continuous 5 plate limited slip 60/40 not on demand 90/10 and the more sporty autos are even more rear wheel biased with 7 plates. Someone should settle this 90/10 vrs 60/40 thing etc. I know what front wheel drive is and believe me I'm not feeling it with this one! Great in the snow! Would highly recommend it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 The auto I have is continuous 5 plate limited slip 60/40 not on demand 90/10 and the more sporty autos are even more rear wheel biased with 7 plates. Someone should settle this 90/10 vrs 60/40 thing etc. I know what front wheel drive is and believe me I'm not feeling it with this one! Great in the snow! Would highly recommend it. Whats there to settle? Auros are constantly variable computer controlled split form 10/90 to 50/50 Or on newer ones 45/55 (i think). www.cars101.com. Yours in an imprezza so it may be differnt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edrach Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 5 speed manual. Better pickup, more control, better gas mileage. No brainer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsince77 Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 5 speed manual. Better pickup, more control, better gas mileage. No brainer. What edrach said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 What edrach said. http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/bymake/Subaru2007.shtml I beg to differ on the new ones, some of the automatics get better MPG then the manuals. nipper PS granted its only a few MPG..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaruplatt Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 Whats there to settle? Auros are constantly variable computer controlled split form 10/90 to 50/50 Or on newer ones 45/55 (i think). www.cars101.com. Yours in an imprezza so it may be differnt. I know that the auto is a modified front wheel design in that the front wheels are solidly linked to the drive line, but. OK what my tranmission does is maintain, under normal circumstances 60/40 torque. So lets say your driving along and you are putting out 100 hp. You are then putting about about 100 ft lbs, 60 ft pounds out of the front axle and the rear friction coefficient allows the rear to do 2/3 of the torque of the front and your putting out 40 ft lbs from the rear. The car endeavors to do this under most circumstances. You get more to the rear under acceleration and less under hard braking. High speed might also net you less if the design dictated it. Just when does this 90 % front scenario play out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 I know that the auto is a modified front wheel design in that the front wheels are solidly linked to the drive line, but. OK what my tranmission does is maintain, under normal circumstances 60/40 torque. So lets say your driving along and you are putting out 100 hp. You are then putting about about 100 ft lbs, 60 ft pounds out of the front axle and the rear friction coefficient allows the rear to do 2/3 of the torque of the front and your putting out 40 ft lbs from the rear. The car endeavors to do this under most circumstances. You get more to the rear under acceleration and less under hard braking. High speed might also net you less if the design dictated it. Just when does this 90 % front scenario play out? I'm not sure what your asking. The car when all is well in its life is 90% front and 10% rear (legacy/outback auto). The computer determins when it needs 37/53 so i can not tell you when it determins this exactly, but it does. Under full throttle, Dirve low and reverse you get a forced 50/50 split. To explain when what happens and why I would leed a g meter, and an oscilliscope, so unless someone is sending me some new toys ..... nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktsubaru Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 Dallas TX had a few inches of snow today, and I own 5 speed 08 Impreza Outback. I used to own 4AT Legacy BG5 year 96. I realized that manual is better on slipperly road, because once the tires slip, all you have to do is quit putting your foot on gas pedal and the tires start to grip. Automatic.... I had one moment that 4AT Legacy slipped and couldnt stop until it bumped into ice wall ( fortunately no damage to the car....) Automatic is nice when you are stuck in the traffic jam. So, I guess which advantage you want might be the key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostinthe202 Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/bymake/Subaru2007.shtml I beg to differ on the new ones, some of the automatics get better MPG then the manuals. I love this site, I've looked up the two cars and one truck I've owned that I actually tracked the mileage on and I found the the original EPA stickers were more accurate then the new numbers. The two auto trans that I see on that list with better mileage (comparing premium to premium and regular to regular) then the manuals say S4 or S5. what is this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip Posted March 7, 2008 Share Posted March 7, 2008 I own one of each.... A 5 spd Impreza and an auto O/B. The O/B is the slowest freakin' car on the road,(probably because it weighs over 1.5 tons). As far as going thru snow or ice is concerned, there's very little difference between the 2. The rear end wants to come around a bit more on the 5 spd. With either one you'd have to drive like an idiot to get stuck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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