tracedog67 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Fellers, i thought i broke the timing belt on my '97 OBW with 285k miles but it was the pulley instead. The belt did not break, mechanic suggested doing leak down test to see if the valves are bent. If the valves are good how much is a new pulley? If valves aren't good what is a price for a used engine? With 285k miles this is my second car and usually used here in Cincinnati when the roads are snowy. Or is it time for a junkyard? thanks Tdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 (edited) I'd have the valves checked out. Or just pull the heads if you're due to examine/replace the HG's anyways and have a shop test them. If you need a pulley please specify. I should have one if you don't find one locally. Dave Edited January 16, 2009 by davebugs typing skills Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 so you mean a timing belt pulley broke? if it did then there's a good chance of valve damage. leak down test should show that. a friend of mine repaired one with a bent valve, said it wasn't that bad. just your average head job. yes a used engine might be an option. if you're not doing the work you'll probably just want your mechanic to price out the options for you. but at 285,000 might be time for a used engine indeed if the car is in good shape/tune. if it's needing brakes, struts, exhaust..etc, then might be simpler to find another vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 sumtin like this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 or maybe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracedog67 Posted January 16, 2009 Author Share Posted January 16, 2009 the indy mechanic spoke with a subaru dealer mechanic and he said 98% of the time the valves do bend. to do a leak down test he has to replace the pulley and belt just to see if the valves are bent. How much should the pulley cost and the belt? I wonder if it would be worth telling him to replace the belt and pulley and throw it back together without testing the valves? Or if the valves are bent slightly would it make a big difference thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdjdc Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 If the valves are bent you will be running on two cylinders. It just won't work, it will mess up the shift points inn the tranny (auto?). 98% chance of bending the valves is pretty sure. I wouldn't wastemy money or time and I do them myself. If you want, I have two 96 heads that are in fine condition and I can sell them to you cheap. You can do a HG and be done with it. I also have several idler pullys in my shed and I can send them along. Let me know if this is in your plan. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster2 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 In my opinion, repairing a motor with 285K miles on the clock is throwing good money after bad. Suggest replacing motor with a good used one with a guarantee makes better economic sense. I bet cost and labor for repair vs replacement comes about to be about the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subeast-EA81 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 which pulley? if its an intake pulley, you can remove the intake manifold and use a flexible neck LED inspection light and see the valves quite well, also while doing the belt you can rotate the cams to that all valves are closed and listen with a piece of hose down thw intake port, you will hear air bleed past the valve (this is all done with the timing belt and intake manifold off) i have done this on my 98 OBW, works good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torxxx Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 the indy mechanic spoke with a subaru dealer mechanic and he said 98% of the time the valves do bend. to do a leak down test he has to replace the pulley and belt just to see if the valves are bent. How much should the pulley cost and the belt? I wonder if it would be worth telling him to replace the belt and pulley and throw it back together without testing the valves? Or if the valves are bent slightly would it make a big difference thanks thats not true bout bending valves. I've had some belts snap where I swore up and down the valves were bent and they werent. Sometimes you will get lucky and they will just lightly get tagged, and u can put a new belt on and redline the hell out of it and they will work again. I'd put a new belt and pulley on and compression test it. If you got compression, you should be fine. Out of the prolly 80 or so engines with bent valves/broken t-belts I've dealt with I've never seen one jam the valve shut, they were always bent open so compression test should be more than enuff. good luck and if they are bent, I'd replace the valves themselves. 20 dollars a valve and some time relapping them and you are good to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 question regarding compression test: can you manually turn the cams and close all valves to do a compression test with no timing belt? manual close the valves to no 1, hookup the compression tester and then kick over the starter with no timing belt. repeat for 2, 3, 4. would this work? trying to learn, john Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torxxx Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I doubt you could because its a interfence engine, one valve is going to be open some where on teh engine You would have to pull the valve covers and make sure that all the valves were closed at the same time or u will smash one. maybe someone else on the board has done it but I havent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdjdc Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 I guess you could close all the valves andd then do a manual compression test, but if you have already done damage to one of the valves you now run the risk of doing more damage to the piston and the valve as well as the seat. Personally, I wouldn't do a compression test without the belt on and the timing properly set. question regarding compression test: can you manually turn the cams and close all valves to do a compression test with no timing belt? manual close the valves to no 1, hookup the compression tester and then kick over the starter with no timing belt. repeat for 2, 3, 4. would this work? trying to learn, john Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdjdc Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 The main reason that I offered my heads is that they are used. Doing a head rebuild on an old engine is asking for lower end failure. The head seals too well for the worn block and causes problems. Using the "broken in" head will lessen the possibility of failure. Just my 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subeast-EA81 Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 you can close all valves, just rotate all cams so that they don't have any tension on them, that's when the valves are closed, when i say no tension, i mean that the cam pulleys will rotate effortlessly. the trick is to rotate them correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 I've had several EJ25s come in with slipped belts, and be fine after hanging a new one. It is just a luck of the draw thing. If you shut it down quickly after it slipped you may have gotten lucky. This is what I would do if you brought the car to my shop. I would first pull a used pulley and and belt out of my junk pile. Then I would install them on the engine. At that point both a compression test, and a leakdown could be done. Heck, you could even just fire it up at that point and see how she runs. Now you can make informed descisions on where to go from there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracedog67 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Share Posted January 17, 2009 Fellers, thanks for your input. I can't get to the PMs, how much would someone sell me a crankshaft pulley for? I may just have him put it back together and try to start and take a chance on the valves. If they are damaged i'll just sell the car otherwise thanks Tracy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 Like I said - figure out which one you need - or did I miss it? I probably have a TB with 600 miles on it, drawers full of idlers that are used. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracedog67 Posted January 18, 2009 Author Share Posted January 18, 2009 It is the crankshaft pulley, if you wish send me an email at tracym@sddcorp.com instead of a PM here. thanks for your help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 the crank shaft pulley isn't driven by the timing belt. so you're saying the crank pulley came apart and managed to damage the timing belt? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaru360 Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 99% chance it bent valves if it lost an idler pulley. With that mileage I would not invest any money or time in it. You can keep the car on the road for cheap with an EJ22 engine swap. It is a direct replacement. Search on here for the specifics, but you want a 95 EJ22 engine from a car with an automatic or a 96-98 EJ22 from an automatic if you can get the matching exhaust y pipe. These engines are dirt cheap, you can buy them for 200-300. Fellers, i thought i broke the timing belt on my '97 OBW with 285k miles but it was the pulley instead. The belt did not break, mechanic suggested doing leak down test to see if the valves are bent. If the valves are good how much is a new pulley? If valves aren't good what is a price for a used engine? With 285k miles this is my second car and usually used here in Cincinnati when the roads are snowy. Or is it time for a junkyard? thanks Tdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 GG, I just got outta bed to type the same response. Still confusion on what he really needs. The TB doesn't come in contact with the harmonic balancer. Unless the real problem is the keyway, and the splined gizmo on the end of the crankshaft which hasn't been discussed. I did respond via email a few hours ago with no response yet. Still need a definition (or pic) as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure I have what he needs - just still not sure of what it is. After it's determined what is needed he may even be able to obtain it locally. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 99% chance it bent valves if it lost an idler pulley. With that mileage I would not invest any money or time in it. It's lower than a 99% chance. I'd say it's more like %60. But whatever. It can't hurt to hang a used belt on it and see what he gets. These engines are dirt cheap, you can buy them for 200-300. You can't get a GOOD EJ of any kind around here for less than $500-600. The yards here in the NW aren't full of rusty junk. They ask top dollar for there stuff. To the OP, put a belt on it and see what you get before making any decisions. only way to make an informed decision Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracedog67 Posted January 19, 2009 Author Share Posted January 19, 2009 Ok, i finally got my story straight. You guys are correct it is the pass side camshaft pulley not the crank pulley, my fault. If my pivot point is about $800-$1000 what would be the best option to get the car back on the road. The mechanic thinks there is almost no chance that the valves are ok. It is an '97 OBW with 285k miles and 5 speed tranny. Is this a good candidate for a cheap used 2.2L engine swap as Davebugs suggests? Looks like i may have to put it up for sale as a non runner. thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subaru360 Posted January 19, 2009 Share Posted January 19, 2009 It's lower than a 99% chance. I'd say it's more like %60. But whatever. It can't hurt to hang a used belt on it and see what he gets. You can't get a GOOD EJ of any kind around here for less than $500-600. The yards here in the NW aren't full of rusty junk. They ask top dollar for there stuff. To the OP, put a belt on it and see what you get before making any decisions. only way to make an informed decision Well the OP is ohio, I think the market there is about the same as here in PA. I get 2.2's for $65 if I pull them out. I know davebugs said he gets them in the pittsburg area for $200-300 with a warranty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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